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I have been using Porter brand acrylic latex paints on my sandblasted-carved stuff and I love it. Please explain in detail the mechanics of coating slick panels like MDO. I haven't quite got the hang of it. The look of a satin background is very appealing and expensive-looking to me.
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It seems that our coat out process is always in some type of change as we try to get it better and better. This is what we are using today.
Most of the MDO panels are 3/4" although we still use the half-inch for For Sale type signs and such. We buy unprimed, good two sides - Simpson Two Step.
After the panel is cut to shape (we rarely leave anything alone) the edges are rounded over on both sides with a quarter inch rounding over bit in our router. This eliminates the sharp edge where the paint film has to go around a corner. The edges are filled completely (not just the voids) with either wood putty if they are to be seen up close, or with a polyurethane sealer if they are not. The polyurethane is almost impossible to get perfectly smooth and it cannot be sanded, but it does a great job of sealing. It also takes longer to dry.
The putty is dry within a few hours and it is sanded with a Makita 5" orbital sander (120 grit). We leave the polyurethane until the next day.
Right now the primer we are using is Jay Cooke's. It is rolled on with a 3/8 nap professional roller cover that we get from Gary Anderson at Rhino. It is 18" long and we cut it into whatever length we need at the time - usually either 9" or 7". There are always a few 3" pieces left that we can use for trim. The roller covers are stored in clear plastic bags after use - still attached to the roller handle. Since the air cannot get to them they dry out very slowly. A piece of masking tape is applied to the handle with the name of the paint - especially if it is a special mix. The roller covers will last for a month or more before they get too thick to use. This method is really handy when you just want to coat out a small board - most of the time there is still enough paint left in the roller so that you don't have to open a gallon and mess up a roller pan.
The primer (and finish coats of latex) are rolled on generously and evenly. In this Texas heat the paint dries out very quickly, so the more you go back over it the more it takes on the appearance of sandpaper. To slow the drying process down a little we normally add some Floetrol.
Smaller panels can be painted with a brush and you achieve a little better finish that way.
The actual process of putting the paint on the surface is kind of trial and error. One of the secrets is not trying to make the paint go too far. I put it on pretty heavy and then get out - not much fussing with it. Usually a second coat can be put on the same day, sometimes even a third if necessary.
The coats can be sanded if you don't apply very much pressure and use a finer grit - 150 or so. The sanding just knocks off the little tips - it is not meant to get a super smooth finish.
One of the things that you have to get used to when using latex paints is that you will never achieve that super-hard glass like finish like you do with enamels. Even the gloss latex paints will have a satin sheen.
Most of the time we use one coat of primer and two coats of finish. If the sign has a border it also gets two coats, so that means the edges have five coats of paint on them - just some more insurance against failure.
The dimensional signs may have five or six coats of paint because we may experiment with color and change our minds in mid stream - usually the trim and filigree work. Most of the time we apply vinyl to the latex paint - only high performance, and we haven't had a problem yet. The dimensional signs with a blasted background will leave about an eighth of an inch borner around the letter since, instead of painting the lettering, we just apply vinyl and allow that border to contrast with the letter color and give it some sharpness. It also means that we don't have to cut the mask perfectly every time.
Donny - I hope that this is what you had in mind. If you have read through this whole thing you are to be congratulated.
P.S. The latex paint is 100% acrylic from Rhino Paint Company. Gary Rhino - owner and operator.
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Mr.Chapman, that explanation was exactly what I needed. Thanks for taking the time to give me a serious answer. I plan to use your method soon with great confidence. BTW, it would be awsome if both yourself and Mr.Rhino could make it to R.T. and Kathy's meet and do a live demo.I personally would love to talk sign design with you. Thanks again for the info. Donny Pavolini
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Amy - Gary Anderson's phone number is 812-332-2033. (Ask for Mr. Rhino) Address: 6767 East State Road 46, Bloomington, Indiana 47408. As far as I know, he doesn't have a web site.
If you call or write, he will send you a color chart and some technical information on the use of latex paints.
When you call, tell him that I recommended the paint and he will give you a 50% discount. That should get his heart pumping. (I'm only kidding - he doesn't even give me a discount, and I'm advertising for him all the time.)
[ July 30, 2002, 09:18 AM: Message edited by: Raymond Chapman ]
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I read your post yesterday on Drapers problems and thought it was time to contact Gary, I asked Nettie for his mail address ages ago and have just not had the time to get round to it.
I called him yesterday, and had a 90 minute call from Sweden, it was really great to talk to him and learn more, I have always loved his work and bought both his books.
Now especially with the demise of Deka am keen to try his paints, it feels like good common sense when he has been using them exclusively for 10 yeárs with no failures, that together with 30 years of doing the great stuff he does.
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Henry - you learned one more thing about Gary, he loves to talk about signs. He is one of those unselfish types that will share everything he knows with you if you are interested in learning. I talked to him twice last week - the second call was just going to be a minute because I had forgotten something I was going to ask the day before (the one hour conversation) and the quick minute turned into over thirty!
So Henry, what does a 90 minute call from Sweden cost these days? Whatever it is I'll just bet that it was worth every penny.
As you might have guessed, I'm a huge Gary Anderson fan.
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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quote:Originally posted by donny pavolini: I have been using Porter brand acrylic latex paints on my sandblasted-carved stuff and I love it. Please explain in detail the mechanics of coating slick panels like MDO. I haven't quite got the hang of it. The look of a satin background is very appealing and expensive-looking to me.
Thanks in advance, Donny Pavolini
-------------------- Bloomington Design Gary Anderson Bloomington, IN Posts: 15 | From: Bloomington, IN USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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Hey Donny, thanks to my greatest unpaid sales person Raymond Chapman, he sure is swell you know! Coating MDO is simple, sand with 120 grit, relieve the corners with sand paper, fill voids with putty and prime as normal with Rhino Paint primer. You will have the most incredible results you can imagine, just ask Raymond Chapman. How's that for a sales pitch. Donny , I have always enjoyed talking with you and I am glad to see you use Rhino Porter Brand. If you have any questions never hesitate to call. That Raymond sure is a swell guy. Best, Gary Anderson
-------------------- Bloomington Design Gary Anderson Bloomington, IN Posts: 15 | From: Bloomington, IN USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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THE Gary Anderson is posting here? I didn't think he knew how to operate a computer, plus he has all that hair hanging down in front of his face.
Now, I'm really going to have to watch what I say.
I think you're swell too, Gary. (That's an inside joke - Gary is always using the word swell, and I informed him if he came to Texas and said someone was "swell" that he may be picking his teeth up off the ground) But, then you know how those Yankees are!
Good to see you here, Gary. Send me some more pictures - I need some ideas! It's amazing how easy it is to scan those things into the computer and just change the words and then add "Chapman Sign Studio" at the bottom.
-------------------- Chapman Sign Studio Temple, Texas chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net Posts: 6306 | From: Temple, Texas, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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