posted
Has anyone ever used a vinyl mask directly on the mesh for screenprinting?
I'm curious to try it. It seems it would be quicker for short runs. I'm not sure how short, however.
Anyone ever tried that? If so, what was your experience?
Randy
-------------------- Randy Graphic Details Promotional Merchandise Distributor South Glens Falls, NY Posts: 381 | From: South Glens Falls, NY USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
It can be good for a short couple of dozen pulls when printing low quality runs, but at that point you might just try getting some light activated emulsion. Cut your vinyl in mirror image, apply it to a piece of glass that fits in your screen, then place vinyl and glass face down onto screen, follow recomended exsposure time, then rinse.
One of our regular instructors at the MicroMeet, Richard Bustamante (Signs of the Pines), teaches a class on how you can start "Silk Screening for under $200.00". Richard also includes this technique in his discussion.
The technique, as said before works on up to 20-24 runs with One-Shot(tm).
Good Luck
-------------------- Ron Percell Percell Signs 707-769-0639 Petaluma, California
posted
We had a lady come in and order two shirts. 2/color redition of her husband's car. (a hot rod)
It worked fine, but I wouldn't count on it for over a dozen. It's been years since that occurance though and they may have some vinyl that won't come up for a spell. I'm waiting for knowledge here myself.
posted
rather than cut vinyl, get yourself some Ulano screen film. they have two kinds of "knife cut" films (ie, you can cut them on your plotter). one is applied with just water and the other is applied with either lacquer thinner or their special adhering chemical. the water adhered material is very easy to work with and is suitable for solvent-based paints/inks.
plus, the stuff weeds more easily than vinyl and it is thinner, so you get a better print.
-------------------- :: Scooter Marriner :: :: Coyote Signs :: :: Oakland, CA :: :: still a beginner :: :: Posts: 1356 | From: Oakland (and San Francisco) | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Ron, thanks for the experience tips. I guess it's something that just has to be tried to see what kind of quality and durability results.
Linda, I've learned a few things so far, hope you have too!
Scooter, I have seen the Ulano films, however, I always thought they were films that you plotter cut to use as positives to burn emulsion-coated screens?
I didn't think they were something you applied directly to the mesh for screening on them?
I'll have to re-check the Ulano info.
Thanks everyone for the tips so far. Anyone have anything else they can share???
Randy
-------------------- Randy Graphic Details Promotional Merchandise Distributor South Glens Falls, NY Posts: 381 | From: South Glens Falls, NY USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Got my start from Richard's screen printing seminar at Ron Percell"s Micro Meet! As everyone else has said, the vinyl works for short runs but the cost in time may not be worth it. You have nothing covering the mesh on the ink side of the screen so it's going to take that much longer to clean the screens. It's a bear trying to get all that pressed in ink out of the screen! As Scooter said the Ulano knife cut stuff is great. Has a carrier sheet just like vinyl. It's quick and easy and less expensive than vinyl, plus it fills up the screen mesh. It is far easyer to remove the Ulano than the ink! The glass and emulsion Idea is great also but it can be a little more time consuming cause you've got to razor of the immage from the glass each time in order to re-use it. There are several places producing coated transperance sheets that can be run through an Ink Jet printer and give a Great positive (or negative) for producing your emulsion based screens. I have an Epson 3000 Ink Jet Printer and produce all of my screen seps with it through SignLab, Photoshop, and most reciently, Corel (Thanks Ron!) Don't have to spend a lot of money either. Good luck...Robin
-------------------- Robin Sharrard Sharrard Graphics & Sign Fallon, Nevada rds@phonewave.net "Proud $$$ Supporter" Posts: 282 | From: Fallon, Nevda, USA | Registered: Feb 1999
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posted
I can't see where the savings is for doing this. Cleaning up your screens would be a nightmare, and by the time you cut/weed/apply, you've got more time invested than if you would have just burned a screen to begin with.
Emulsion's cheap. And if you don't have an exp. unit or a halogen lamp laying around, just use the sun.
-shane
-------------------- Halo Graphics Clearlake Oaks, CA http://www.halographics.com ntshane1@halographics.com Posts: 308 | From: Clearlake Oaks, CA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I'm with Scooter and Felix. If you need detailed instructions on how to use the Ulano film, e-mail me. We have mostly used the water based film but it's not for the real fine stuff. Here's another one, but more for entertainment rather than an actual suggestion: My old friend tells me that they used to print the weekly sales posters for Safeway and others, using paper cuts. Cut paper copy, place under screen, start printing. Paper will stick to the screen like a film. Wanna change copy? Lift screen, pull paper off, place new paper copy under screen, get going. Piece of cake. As I said, I am not actually suggesting that you try this...
posted
If you got a clean screen on the shelf, cut weed & apply a simple layout. set-up, print a few, clean up. Your job is drying on the rack in less time then it takes for emulsion to dry. cost of vinyl: a buck or two.
I agree that Ulano's green water based film is a much better solution because you can use for longer runs & you can re-use the screen. But to answer Randy's question, & Shane's, if you got vinyl, & are in a rush to print a short run it can work, can save time, & based on what is readily available in your shop, can save money too.
[ April 13, 2002, 06:39 PM: Message edited by: Doug Allan ]
posted
Interesting topic. I have used this method for some short run shirt printing jobs for many years and winthin it's inherant limitations it works excellent.
Method is:- Use cheapest real estate vinyl 380mm wide, Cut mirror image, weed, & tape up. Set up carosel with a blank screen (43T) on the head and a shirt in position on the platen. Remove backing sheet from vinyl and lay it in position on the shirt, sticky side up. Make sureit is in the correct position where you want the print to fall.
Now simply lower the blank screen down onto the platen and using a vinyl aplication squeege rub the ink side of the screen down onto the vinyl. I usually only do this lightly first to get the vinyl tacked to the screen. Lift the screen up and place a piece of board the same size as the screen onto the platern and lower the screen down again. Now use heavy pressure to apply the vinyy firmly to the screen. Using the aplicator squeege directly on the screen mesh does tend to wear them down faster, so use an old one. Tape up any exposed edges of the screen and you are ready to go.
We use water based ink for printing with these and it produces a beautifull sharp edged print. The real beuty of this method is when you finish the print run, you simply remove the screen and wash the ink and the stencil off with a water hose, dry it and it is ready for the next job.
The limitations are: print run 25 or so shirts, Simple text and graphics (Cut and weedable), use water based inks.
The anvantages are: It take longer to talk about it than it does to do it, but be sure to wash screen immediately you finish printing because water based ink will dry in the screen quickly after you stop using it and will be a pain to clean.
Other thoughts: Plastisol inks tend to attack the vinyl quickly so their use is not advised. Any solvent based inks will do the same thing.
One more thought: I have used the following technique several times for simple detail jobs requiring printing with solvent based inks. Using a thin cast vinly cut the design in mirror image. Then weed away the excess as you would for a regular sign job. Next tape up and apply the image to the substrate side of the screen. Now using a screen printing squeege apply a couple of light layers of water soluable blockout emulsion. Allow this to dry a little then carefully weed the vinyl off of the screen. Allow to finish drying in the sun and you have a screen that can be used with any ink/paint that is not water based. The one strong plus for this method is that after printing and cleaning the ink out of the screen and drying, the screen can be hosed with water and the stencil (being water based) will simply disolve out of the mesh. A 500ml bottle of water based blockout is very cheap (a few dollars). The down side is that there is a bit more time involved and you do have to be carefull weeding the vinly off of the screen, so as to not damage the stencil. For the occasional use and the cost of a bottle of blockout it is another tool in the box of tricks.
-------------------- Badges2 is Bob Wright from Bundy Badges Screenprinting located in Bundaberg Queensland Australia (The land of OZ)& Dad to Katie, The Kookaburra Bird. badges@interworx.com.au Posts: 69 | From: Bundaberg, Qld. Australia | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
Geez Doug, I seriously figured I was talking to the fellow who asked the question in the first place. Until I ran into that suspicious "Aloha" and wondered what was the matter with the guy from NY.....
Anyway Randy, you can have a copy of those instructions if you like.
posted
I use this method when I am in a hurry, a small run and no screens ready to expose. Same general methods as described above. Works great in a pinch.
-------------------- Michael Clanton Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio 1933 Blackberry Conway AR 72034 501-505-6794 clantongraphics@yahoo.com Posts: 1736 | From: Conway Arkansas | Registered: Oct 2001
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I found some detailed instructions on the Ulano website called the "Ulanocut Green and Amba Technical Data" sheet.
Are these the same instructions you have?
Thanks. If yours are different, please email them to GraphicDetails@UReach.com
Thanks again.
Randy
-------------------- Randy Graphic Details Promotional Merchandise Distributor South Glens Falls, NY Posts: 381 | From: South Glens Falls, NY USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Randy, I couldn't find the data on the Ulano site to compare with my notes, but I suggest that you should go with their instructions by all means. You should have no problems. Good luck.
posted
short eun ...can't beat it....but you can extend your run if you simply mask the inside of the screen with "tuff bak" (r-tape)or even 2" masking tape and just leave the area where the stncil lies open (solves the scren clean up concerns.
We use direct emulsion and in a pich(like when you run out of ruby-lith) we have even applied vinyl letters to the emulsion then burned it in...removed the letters washed out the emulsion and screened the images.
-------------------- "Werks fer me...it'll werk fer you"
posted
I've done this lots of times. The ink you are using will determine how long your screen will hold up. Harsh solvents eat adhesive. Mentioned above, the Ulano knife cut films will give you a longer duration screen. Just remember to clean the screen as though you were going to coat it or use an indirect film and allow it to dry before applying your vinyl.
Also mentioned above was a reference to using the sun to expose screens. I played with this years ago and although timing can be tricky, you can't get a better point light source. Make sure you have complete contact between your positive and the image side of your screen. A piece of mdo or an old formica countertop cut down to fit inside the screen frame placed on the underside with a piece of plate glass on top works pretty good.
-------------------- Dave Johnson Saltsburg, PA
724-459-7240 Posts: 228 | From: Saltsburg, PA | Registered: Dec 2001
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