Apologies in advance-- this may be long-winded---again.
This is an addition to the Signgold Challenge thread, and has to do mostly with todays prices of most everything.
I have a real problem wrapping my Alzheimer's afflicted mind around current prices, because I'm old enough to remember when a $50,000 home was considered a mansion, a new car went for less than $3000, a bag of groceries could be had for $5, and the list goes on and on. During WW2, my father was working in a defense plant that was building Sherman tanks, and with overtime was making $45 a week. At the time, this was cosidered to be big money.
The country, and indeed, most of the oil-dependent nations of the world took two huge economic hits in the'70s when OPEC pulled the embargoes, and I don't feel that any of these countries ever fully recovered from these jolts. Inflation went absolutely wild.
As an example-- take the $3000 car----- nowadays a similar vehicle can't be had for much less than $20,000----- almost a 7 fold increase. Prices of most everything else followed suit. Wages may or may not have kept up depending on the field of endeavor one is involved in.
The point of this is that back in the '60s I was charging my work out at $6 or $7 an hour and gradually increased that over the years. With '60s prices, I had more $ left over to play with than I do now because in my minds eye I just plain can't justify a seven fold increase. I know what the realities are, and still can't do it.
I wont mention what I do charge these days because I don't want some of you calling me to complain that you hurt yourselves when you fell off your chair laughing. I will admit that I don't do much by the hour these days, preferring instead to flat-price an item ahead of time. This unties me from feeling I have to watch the clock.
Again, this is not meant to start a war or a flaming match. Just curious to know how the rest of you feel about this, especially the ---ahem--"older" crowd.
-------------------- Bill Preston Fly Creek, N.Y. USA Posts: 943 | From: Fly Creek, N.Y. USA | Registered: Jan 2000
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Bill..not sure how (ahem) OLD you were talking about but..yes prices on some things certainly are surprising. Just yesterday I paid 3.00 for a head of lettuce! A new roof is going to be over 7000 on our very small home. As far as sign prices, I have been taking a real hard look at where the sign business is going. Years ago I made quite a bit of money. I was one of only a few sign painters around town. Now as you know...sign shops are practically on every street corner. But with the help of Mark's pricing guide and some straightening out of my inner conflict..I have been charging much more. And taking only the jobs I want. This was sure hard at first as I thought when I let go of my 'cheap customers' I would be missing out on dollars! Not so! I have learned that these customers were a pain in the ass most of the time and the customers who are willing to pay more....receive my undivided attention. I still get people who say 'oh you are expensive!' but now instead of backing down and lowering my price a bit...I just smile and say 'yes I am. You get what you pay for' For a few years I was letting the franchise prices control my pricing. Now I am back in control. "WHEW!"
Posts: 3729 | From: Seattle | Registered: Sep 1999
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The first image I have is my mother, filling the gas tank after an afternoon of grocery shopping.
She was standing outside my car window muttering because milk AND gasoline had just sky rocketed to 25 cents per gallon! I won't repeat what she said! LOL!
Second image, when I started out in this industry, I apprenticed for $30 a week. By the time I had decided to slow down and concentrate on gettin my health back on track, I was making an average of $300 a day. Not too bad for a one woman sign kit, on the go.
Third image, my Mother paid $250 a month for her home. We're paying $1,500 a month...comes with a yard one quarter the size of hers...hmmmmm.
posted
Hi Bill. Reminising about what things cost in "the good old days" might be fine for writing memoirs, but it shouldn't dictate what one charges for their time or services these days. That's sort of like steering your car by looking into the rear view mirror.
The temptation is always there for those of us who have experienced "differing values", to want to retain those past prices and standards. The reality is that if we do so, we will harm the current crop of younger folks trying to make a go of it in this industry. They are the ones copeing with the payments on bigger mortgages, larger car/truck payments etc. Like everything else, the cost of doing business has also risen, and many shops have shifted toward a much more "capital intensive" mode of operation. It's almost a necessity to have some sort of computer or cutting program to remain competitive today. That wasn't so back when. All that was needed was a well-equipped sign kit, and one's own ability, to earn a living. The cost of maintaining these constant upgrades is also a factor.
If those of us older folk price our work and ignore what the current market value may be, we will be doing ourselves a disservice, as well as those younger people who may not have the benefit of a paid-off mortgage, or own outright, their tools of the trade. They too have to feed their families, and make those payments, as we did. The difference is that they are doing so in a higher priced economic climate.
-------------------- Ken Henry Henry & Henry Signs London, Ontario Canada (519) 439-1881 e-mail: kjmlhenry@rogers.com
Why do I get all those on-line offers to sell me Viagara, when the only thing hardening is my arteries ? Posts: 2689 | From: London,Ontario, Canada | Registered: Feb 1999
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Ken, I understand where you are coming from, and I have adjusted prices by going to the flat price route. Depending on what in the way of sign work we are talking about, I think my prices are not too far off the mark in todays dollars. It just takes me longer than it used to, so the seven fold factor is not in there. In other words, no specific hourly shop rate--- just determine a price agreeable to both the customer and myself, and go from there. Even the 3 tier pricing structure is part of how I determine what is fair for both of us.
Hope that clarifies.
-------------------- Bill Preston Fly Creek, N.Y. USA Posts: 943 | From: Fly Creek, N.Y. USA | Registered: Jan 2000
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YOU GUYS CHARGE FOR YOUR WORK?.......sheesh!!
-------------------- James Caley JCI Int'l 655 State College #19 Fullerton, CA USA 92831 jamez31@msn.com 714-773-9048 Posts: 16 | From: 655 state College #19, Fullerton CA USA 92831 | Registered: Feb 2002
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A well known FACT with financial people is..... You have no control over your in flow (prices you pay for whatever) BUT you do have control over your out flow(things you buy) The key is to minumize the OUT FLOW! DON'T live beyond your means,and pass the in flow to the consumer.
hope this helps
-------------------- PKing is Pat King The Professor of SIGNOLOGY Posts: 3113 | From: Pompano Beach, FL. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Hmmmmmmm...I remember those days, Bill. When I first raised my shop price to $10/hr...I thought...WOW! Am I making big money!
Remember those 1 inch sable flats? $3 each! Tempra paints at $8/gallon? Vinyl cutters were an X-Acto knife, etc.
Them days is long gone, like you, I price by the job...that way I can do it at MY pace (no longer the fastest brush around)! And like Cheryl,I have dumped all the pain in the a$$ customers. Nor do I try to compete with the 'Quickie Stickie" shops! I now cater to people who want quality, not cheap!
Life has become much simpler and better, as a result!
-------------------- Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
si.allen on Skype
siallen@dslextreme.com
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!
Brushasaurus on Chat Posts: 8831 | From: La Mirada, CA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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boy iam glad we got romain and iceberg growin in the kitchen garden.....we had a salad the other nite....mixed both and had some brocolli grown too....ive nevr bought letuce that tasted this good!!!!! as for prices of stuff.....i remember when(not that long ago) when i would get $100 to letter a set of truck doors, and the guy was glad if i could get it done in the same week!!!!! as for prices, think about this: a gallon of gas in 1960 was 24 cents.....a bottle of wiskey was $5.00. now gas is $1.25 a gallon...and you can still buy that bottle of wiskey for $5.00....makes ya go HUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM?????
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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but..yes prices on some things certainly are surprising. Just yesterday I paid 3.00 for a head of lettuce! A new roof is going to be over 7000 on our very small home. As far as sign prices, I have been taking a real hard look at where the sign business is going. Years ago I made quite a bit of money. I was one of only a few sign painters around town. Now as you know...sign shops are practically on every street corner. But with the help of Mark's pricing guide and some straightening out of my inner conflict..I have been charging much more. And taking only the jobs I want. This was sure hard at first as I thought when I let go of my 'cheap customers' I would be missing out on dollars! Not so! I have learned that these customers were a pain in the ass most of the time and the customers who are willing to pay more....receive my undivided attention. I still get people who say 'oh you are expensive!' but now instead of backing down and lowering my price a bit...I just smile and say 'yes I am. You get what you pay for' For a few years I was letting the franchise prices control my pricing. Now I am back in control. "WHEW!"
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