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Author Topic: Hay old sign guys....
Michael Boone
Deceased


Member # 308

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See if ya can relate to this one....
Its the day after Thanksgivin...the kids came home from college...Mom was delighted...we had a feast that quite possibly we did not even deserve...it was so good!!And...the family was all together...
Well..tonight....Ma's worn out...hit the hay early...too much cookin..Kids....hey..jess gittin started!!!Its only midnite!.Out they go!!!!See old friends!
Okay...Dad....head on over...to the shop.
I have a repaint to do.Its been there for a WHILE..
Im savin it till I can savor it....painted!
Its a sign for a country store..an old school house converted to a neat lil store.
I rollered a fresh coat on the background.. of E& M...member?...Mobil Bulletin Enamel...This sign is 20 years old!....All it needs is to be freshened!.
So...tonite....I broke out a brand new 22 Langnickel.Its a treasure from Timmies "stash"..!!!
One of my favorite alphabets for a long time was a streamlined version of " Cooper"..I sent Cooper to the gym....and slimmed it down and toned it!..
Im paintin...8" letters with a 22 quill...slide the rounded serafs...and then ease into a stroke...
Paint one side of ther letter ..then the next..
easy.
Here's the message of the post...
I did the top seraf of a "S"....began the stroke..where thin becomes thick...Ooooh!....It was like drivin a car up hill....I needed a lil more...so I mashed the brush ever so slightly..just like steppin on the gas!..and it gave me just what I needed with power to spare....then...ease off for the bottom....where it gits skinnie again..right back where it belongs..
Id walk a mile ...for a yellow handle!


Well..THAT was fun

[ November 24, 2001: Message edited by: Michael Boone ]



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Michael Boone
Sign Painter
5828 Buerman Rd.Sodus,NY 14551

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Bill Dirkes
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Member # 1000

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Thanks for the ride, Mike!
Rides like that make up for and then some those times when the fuel filter is clogged, the timing chain is broke, and the tires are flat.
All well tuned machines need to be maintained.

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Bill Dirkes
Cornhole Art LLC
Bellevue, Ky.
Goodnight Mrs. Calabash, wherever you are.

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Rick Sacks
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Mike, I'm glad to hear that others share that feeling still. The old paints work, and so do the older brushes. My son,16, recently had a job to do and I pulled out my good set of flats and handed him a 3/4" Greyhound. After Jake finished, I did some stuff with it and even todays 1-Shot worked better with that quality of hair.

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The SignShop
Mendocino, California

http://www.mendosign.com

Making the simple complicated is commonplace;
making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus

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Raymond Chapman
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Michael, you have stirred up memories that are very pleasant. It is amazing how that feel of the brush is so soothing. When the paint is right and the brush is right (and everything else is right) there is nothing to match that feeling. The sad part is that many folks in the business today will never experience it...and it's something that cannot be explained.

One thing that has changed is now when I hand letter for a long time my arm goes numb, my back hurts, and my feet feel like I've walked 20 miles. But, I don't think that has anything to do with the brush or the paint.

While memories of the sweetness of lettering with a brush gives us old timers glassy eyes, the bitter truth is that I would not go back to hand lettering pool rules with 1" Helvetica for anything in the world. Just let me punch one of those buttons and get it out the door.

Hindsight has a poor memory. But it's still very comforting to go there occassionaly.

--------------------
Chapman Sign Studio
Temple, Texas
chapmanstudio@sbcglobal.net


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Bob Ficucell
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Great post Mike,I have often thought how sad it was that people who own vinyl only shops (Please I mean no disrespect)will never know how great it feels to "swing" a brush though the last half of a "O" or palette a brush and "pull" a stroke for an "A".
I'm very glad I have that experience and ability.
Bob

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Bob Ficucell
Glass Arts
Woodland Hills,Ca

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George Perkins
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Nice post Micheal, I guess I'm one of the lucky ones, I still do way more hand lettering than vinyl.
Timmie and his "stash" are the source of many great stories, we had a lot of fun with the "pusher" at Duckies. I bought a couple of unbelieveable liners for scroll striping and some Australian flats that are just incredible.

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Si Allen
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Of course I know the feeling....do it all the time! Remember, I am primarily a "brush shop"....very little vinyl!



--------------------
Si Allen #562
La Mirada, CA. USA

(714) 521-4810

si.allen on Skype

siallen@dslextreme.com

"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"

Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!

Brushasaurus on Chat


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cheryl nordby
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Say now......easy there big guys. Us sign gals haven't lost our memories. We too know how to pull an "A" with great satisfaction. And oh the thrill of lettering those "O's" and "S's". I do a 5 stroke S. I like that last extra little "oomph" on my S's. Isn't it sumthin ..... handletterin'? I remember my first meet. I inhaled that 1-shot smell and gold size aroma I hadn't smelled in some time. The whole weekend I sat and enjoyed the smells and of course the company of fellow and fellowette sign people. Ah yes, thanks Michael. I can relate man.
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bill riedel
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It has been a long time since I've seen a greyhound, the finest flat for truck lettering ever. Grunbacher made them and they also made fine quills, but that was many years ago. Their quality went right out the window. Mack has been making fine quills and one time when I had 100 trucks to letter, it was a life saver.

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Bill Riedel
Riedel Sign Co., Inc.
15 Warren Street
Little Ferry, N.J. 07643
billsr@riedelsignco.com

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Kent Smith
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Ditto to what everyone else said. Another thing I miss is the smell of dryed enamel as I come in the shop door in the morning every day. The vinyl stink just isn't the same.

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Kent Smith
Smith Sign Studio
P.O.Box 2385,
Estes Park, CO 80517-2385
kent@smithsignstudio.com

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John Lennig
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Hey Mike, just read your heartfelt piece on joys of the brush. So true, there's sothing like it when brush,paint,hand & head work together. Hand down or mahlstick, left or right (i'm left), it's all good!
In 1977 I bought a bunch of brushes and some varigated gold from the trunk of Issy(sp?) Posners big Buick, we were in the parking lot of Santa Fe train station in L.A. I was down in S.D. visiting and was told about him and his travelling brush business.I still remember spending 100.00(big dough in '77) Standout brushes were a 1/2,3/4 and 1" Langnickel grey flats. I've still got the 1", wore out the 3/4" on gas sation windows up here.Those brushes were so good, you could leave one on your pallete, go away, when you returned, the lettering was finished!! True.

Long live the brush. When you pass on, sign painters heaven is "Where your best brushes never go bad"
bye bye.John @ Big Top

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John Lennig / Big Top Sign Arts
5668 Ewart Street, Burnaby,
British Columbia, Canada
bigtopya@hotmail.com
604.451.0006


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Dan Sawatzky
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I too can relate this week. I got to hand paint 80 flat pieces for a display. (48 sheets of MDO) It's been a while since I handled a brush. I was using acrylics and there was no lettering involved - just original cartoon figures. I did all the linework and the feeling was the same.

It was like riding a bike. A little shakey for the first couple of feet, and then swish, swish. Thick and thin, great transitions between the two, long smooth strokes. My hands were doing exactly what my brain was thinking.

There is a certain magic about painting by hand. I'll never give it up, although it doesn't happen every day.

I suppose it's like flying an old fashioned airplane where you are actually feeling the stick and the feed back, compared to modern flying where you move the stick and an impulse goes to a computer and the computer then sends a signal to the flying surfaces of the airplane.

The artwork we produce can be just as spectacular with either method, but the joy to produce is perhaps greater the old fashioned way.

No matter what, take great joy in your creations, no matter how they are produced.

That is what will satisfy you.

-dan

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Dan Sawatzky
Imagination Corporation
Yarrow, British Columbia
dan@imaginationcorporation.com
http://www.imaginationcorporation.com

Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!!


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Bill Preston
Deceased


Member # 1314

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Hi, All,

I guess I can relate closest to Raymond's and Dan's feelings on this subject. On Raymond's, it is when the aches and pains kick in-- usually before noon. With Dan's it is the feeling you get when you can "do no wrong" with the brush.

Nowadays, it is a matter of producing a piece of work with the least amount of hurt, and that is where the 'puter comes in. Then again, maybe I'm just getting lazy in my old age. That's not true, either. I was always lazy. Oh, well.

--------------------
Bill Preston
Fly Creek, N.Y. USA


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Jordan Sign Company
Deceased


Member # 230

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There is no greater feeling than swinging a brush and creating fantastic layouts with clean lettering.
Way before BC (Before Computers) I made damn good money because I was a signwriter (and still am)and now I use the puter more than I should because I get lazy and sit on my butt and do it the easy way.
It's a shame to say but puter letters last longer and easier to do.....still in all, ya cant beat a good ole hand done paper sign with lotsa "oomph" to get a message across.....puters are too "stiff" and lack the freedom of layout.
We signpainters are a group who undersatnd this feeling.
Jack Jordan
(57 years of hand lettering)

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Deceased

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Monte Jumper
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I still get in enough hand lettering to stay proficient, but not nearly as proficient as I'd like to be.

What I miss are the little mental vacations you could go on while you were lettering.

I loved planning trips, recalling old friends, reliving childhood dreams.

If I can get over an hours worth of hand lettering in, I can still slip off into never never land, but returning seems to be less rewarding these days.

Oh well thats what the meets are all about, now isn't it.

Hope to see you all at the next one (where ever it is).

--------------------
"Werks fer me...it'll werk fer you"

Monte Jumper
SIGNLanguage/Norman.Okla.
jumpers@itlnet.net


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old paint
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ahhhhh...micheal...the man with a silver tounge...how poigneit he makes the workings of eye, hand, and them great langnickels. i got a couple from the "pusher" at pats....aint had a job yet for that #22, but went out friday to all the car dealerships....tellin em to get there order in early for holiday windows...then ill get to dance with that # 22....to some ac/dc or pink floyd as i slide some paint across that window.....and i gota say...there aint no feeling in the world like it....almost better n' sex...

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joe pribish-A SIGN MINT
2811 longleaf Dr.
pensacola, fl 32526
850-637-1519
BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND

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Luke Scanlan
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WOW! That was great! I need a cigarette after that, & I don't even smoke! Michael you should send this post to Penthouse Forum. I know it got me going. Seriously though, I am very proud to list my occupation as sign PAINTER. I bleed 1 SHOT. I agree with the others. It is almost a high to be able to create something with just a brush & a can of paint. I still enjoy being my own worst critic, & seeing improvements in my work. Always striving to improve my skills. Like the saying goes "If you have to ask, You wouldn't understand".

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Luke S.
Luke Scanlan Artistry
Ocala, Fl.
lukescanlan@cox.net

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Rob Clark
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Yes this post has certainly made the blood return to my veins. I made a post recently where I suggested all should learn the brush and was instantly shot down in flames so I crawled back in my hole and felt somewhat alone.

I watched the feature on Australian TV here last weekend on the Letterheads meet in Portland, a very nostalgic look at the old "Brushmen"....wow. I felt so inspired to recommitt to the brush, truth is I have never left it, I just felt very proud to be keeping this fine old craft alive.

Question is though, how many of us are passing our skills on to a future generation?

One of the sweetest things about using a brush are being able to work the shape of a letter to improve the rithym through a word and being able to tint or tone the colour to find the perfect balance....mmmmmmmmmmm

RobC
A Brushman and damn proud!

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Rob Clark
Rob Clark Design
11 Lassig st
Moore Park Queensland Australia
0741598092


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Rob Clark
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Still cant spell tho'.....eh eh, sure am glad that word "Rythm" aint dry n hard in 1 shot on a varnished background

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Rob Clark
Rob Clark Design
11 Lassig st
Moore Park Queensland Australia
0741598092

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Rob Clark
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Still cant spell tho'.....eh eh, sure am glad that word "Rythm" aint dry n hard in 1 shot on a varnished background.

RobC

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Rob Clark
Rob Clark Design
11 Lassig st
Moore Park Queensland Australia
0741598092


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Rob Clark
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Oh boy, nuch mre comfortable with a brush in my hand.......
RobC

--------------------
Rob Clark
Rob Clark Design
11 Lassig st
Moore Park Queensland Australia
0741598092

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cheryl nordby
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Monte.....your reply made me chuckle. I used to 'space out' while lettering quite often. And often I would be really getting into hand lettering freestyle...and totally spell whatever word I was lettering at the time completely wacky. Made me laugh (except on those paper banners!) What fun eh? Those were the days my friends!
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Jackson Smart
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Man!!! I can certainly relate. I still brush most of my signs. I also use a little vinyl now and then....as Ray said..I would not want to go back to lettering a bunch of 1" helvetica.

As far as passing on the skill of brushing...I have tried several times...seems no one wants to go the distance, or maybe I am not the proper teacher, I don't know, but I sure hope it never dies.

For a sign person, there is no experience like it. Long live the brush.

I get the MOST pleasure when doing a nice flowing script...man...there is nothing like it.

--------------------
Jackson Smart
Jackson's Signs
Port Angeles, WA
...."The Straits of Juan De Fuca in my front yard and Olympic National Park in my backyard...

"Living on Earth is expensive...but it does include a free trip around the Sun"


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Bruce Deveau
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Hello Michael,
Thanks for the great topic. I solved the problem of not getting enough brush time by selling my computer and returning to hand lettering only. That was ten years ago and I haven't looked back. I decided that I would rather be happy making less money...and have become proficient enough to do pretty well without touching a keyboard. There is a certain kind of intimate pleasure from working with such basic materials as brush and paint, which i have never found with the computer.

By the way, can you put me in touch with the person who has the stash of Langnickles?

Thanks,
Bruce Deveau

--------------------
Bruce Deveau
331 Main St.
Amesbury, Ma USA 01913


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Michael Clanton
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Great trip down memory lane! But, I don't neccesarily fall into the "old sign guy" category.
Although I am a mere 33 years old, I still remember the day when my sign mentor "Obi Wan" handed me a lettering quill, a Dixie cup of 1-shot, a little Naptha and a piece of glass and proceeded to instruct me on the fine craft of hand lettering the alphabet. Day after day, letter after letter, until one day the magic happened and the "force was with me" The brush, paint and glass became one, and in the words of the Titanic guy: I was king of the world!!!

Earlier this year I was painting a logo onto 2 sides of a building: 15'x20' logo on a rough stucco finish 10' in the air. I had to resort back to the "good ol' days" and pounce the pattern with an electric pounce machine (OUCH), use the blue chalk to get the patterns up on the wall, and "cut-in" the letters in using a cutter, then rolled the large areas. A local sign guy came by and asked a million questions, and pretty much hung out for a couple of days just gawking and trying to figure out how I got that logo up there without "lettin'" a computer do it. The sad thing was, he didn't have the slightest idea what any of the tools were, especially the brushes and paint!

These days I don't use the brush nearly enough to be proficient as the "old sign guys" but when I do get to dust them off, that familiar scent of 1-shot and Naptha take me back to the good ol' days!

By the way, I appreciate and admire you "ol' timers", without you guys, the craft would have died a long time ago. Thanks for passing it down.

--------------------
Michael Clanton
Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio
1933 Blackberry
Conway AR 72034
501-505-6794
clantongraphics@yahoo.com


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Adrienne Pereira
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Mikey, is THAT what you paged me about Thursday night?? Sorry I tried callin' you right back, but line was busy.
I sure wish I had seen you do some of that letterin' when I was at your shop this summer....but I promise you I will come back in the spring if you need a helper!
Thanks again for the brushes, I have used them many times and charish them!

A

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Adrienne Pereira
Splash Signs

Port Angeles, WA
----------------
"Sure, it's colder in the Northwest, but...it's a damp cold!"

360-477-5656
splashsigns@msn.com


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Rob Clark
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Easy on the "Old Sign Guy" bit.......eh eh

Yep, there is a satisfaction with brushwork you just dont get with puters, no doubt about it.

Seems to me that the more of this generic sticky stuff there is out there the more my work stands out.

There is a small country town 'bout 30 mile east of here, it sits on the main highway north, I did my first job there 'bout 2 years ago, it has generated a lot more work, to date I have done 9 stores, even the local writers are starting to call it "my town"

It is by creating the work on site that brings a distinctive look, because the job evolves as I go and it generates an incredible amount of interest. My objective is to get as far away from that "generic look " as I possible can.
I am convinced that there is still a place for the "Brushman" and it aint the museum!

As craftsmen we have to work a bit harder so there is a clear distinction between our work and the quickemstickems, carve a niche out for ourselves.

It's too easy to just cut and paste pre-set panels, banners n fonts etc. If this is what we are doing it's no wonder the customers are going to the franchised letter shop down the road.
It's no wonder they can't tell the difference and are only shopping on price.
It's no wonder the signs are all starting to look the same.
It's no wonder there isn't the joy in it for many of us any more.

It saddens me to read many of us saying that we are resigned to the brush as being only part of the "good ole days" and I wonder how the original letterheads would feel about that kind of statement.

I know I have jumped on the soapbox, I am not apologising for that one bit.

Think about it at least .

RobC

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Rob Clark
Rob Clark Design
11 Lassig st
Moore Park Queensland Australia
0741598092


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Si Allen
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Spot on Rob....couldn't have said it any better myself!

--------------------
Si Allen #562
La Mirada, CA. USA

(714) 521-4810

si.allen on Skype

siallen@dslextreme.com

"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"

Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!

Brushasaurus on Chat

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Robin McIlvaine
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Oh yeaaaa....A couple months ago the neighbor boy needed help on his shop project. A wooden sleigh that needed pinstriped and lettered like.... back then, ya know. Had to break out the brushes and yes by heaven the feeling was back...like riding a bike. After 4 years this was the 1st time my fiance' ever saw the way brushes were ment to work.Pretty much flipped him out and the 2 shop teachers hanging out.Pulling long lines and using a true script letter style and YES the maul stick!
Mostly I've lowered myself to the lazy krylon vinyl, quick painted outlines & Jackson's CD of orniments. These are put together VERY artistically, just not giving it away these days....theres more money in technology that talent.
Great post...whata flashback!

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Robin McIlvaine
RM Signs & Vehicle Graphics
Punxsutawney, Pa

Posts: 72 | From: Punxsutawney,Pa USA | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Bob Boyd
Visitor
Member # 2500

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I have been in the business for twenty plus. Our shop use do do a lot of hand lettering. My father was a sign painter. I remember dad not coming home for dinner, working weekends, not being able to straighten his back after 18 hours at the bench. Don't wish for the old days, they always weren't that good.

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Bob Boyd
A C Display Studios
Atlantic City, NJ

Posts: 54 | From: Atlantic City, NJ | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Rob Clark
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Member # 787

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Good point Bob, that old man was me, no wonder my kids weren't all that interested in taking up the trade, what did I give them to aspire to? Only blood sweat and tears.

So I have changed my point of view, rekindled the old love for the trade, I am not working the long hours any more because I have placed a far higher value on my skills, I don't come cheap any more.

My two younger kids are showing some interest, My oldest son will be home from college ( university) next week and he has told me he is looking forward to working with me again. I absolutely relish working with my kids, It adds a whole other level of satisfaction to my work.

I want them to see me enjoying sign making, I want them to know I am proud of what I do for a living.

Food for thought maybe?

RobC

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Rob Clark
Rob Clark Design
11 Lassig st
Moore Park Queensland Australia
0741598092


Posts: 421 | From: Australia | Registered: May 1999  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

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