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I'm scheduled to put an Edge print 11" x 64" on the sides of an '01 Suburban tomorrow. My customer just informed me that he just got it out of the body shop from getting some body work done on the left rear. Its for a surfboard company who likes to change his graphics often and I'm afraid if I try to peel this off a year from now the paint may come with it. I had this happen only once or twice, but this covers a solid area, not just vinyl letters. Maybe he'll wreck it again and I won't have to worry about it, but any input would be helpful. He does use a body shop that is known for quality work.
-------------------- Chuck Peterson Designs San Diego, CA Posts: 1072 | From: San Diego, CA USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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My rule of thumb has been to tell the customer that if you can still smell the fresh paint, it has not yet cured to the max. (gassing off). Even then, I do not give any kind of warranty on the removal of applied vinyl graphics in the future.
-------------------- John Smith Kings Bay Signs (Retired) Kissimmee, Florida Posts: 822 | From: Central Florida - The Sunshine State | Registered: Jan 2000
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I read where 3M likes you to wait 30 days but I don't know anyone who does this, but I try to wait a week or two. Get him to sign a damage release to protect yourself.
-------------------- Al Checca The Sign Shoppe 934 Wood Street Latrobe PA 15650 Posts: 34 | From: Latrobe PA Just outside Pittsburgh PA | Registered: Oct 2001
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Depending on what kind of paint, the minimum for acrylic adhesives is 72 hours. Fresh paint can set up a chemical reaction with the adhesive and can actually pop the paint right off the primer. I've seen this happen repeatedly in the past 29 years I've dealt with vinyl films. Body shops learn the hard way up here when they lie about when the car was painted. Imron paints take a 3 week minimum.
-------------------- Pierre St.Marie Stmariegraphics Kalispell,Mt www.stmariegraphics.com ------------------ Plan on knowing everything before I die and time's running out! Posts: 4223 | From: Kalispell,Mt 59903 | Registered: Mar 2000
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Another thing I have noticed in doing work for a local body shop but premask can mar some paint jobs also............
-------------------- Al Checca The Sign Shoppe 934 Wood Street Latrobe PA 15650 Posts: 34 | From: Latrobe PA Just outside Pittsburgh PA | Registered: Oct 2001
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I was doing a vinyl job on a van that had been painted at a maaco type place (very cheap job) 2 weeks prior, and when i started cleaning it with rubbing alcohol, the paint got all sticky and the dirt mixed with it and made a huge smudged area. Luckily the guy didnt really care as it was an older van, and I cleaned with water and applied the graphics. Oh well.
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Chuck I am gettin a really big 'chuckle' outta this one...There isn't a single one of them that has ever painted a vehicle and none of them know what they are talkin about!!!!
AM I gonna tell ya anything? Yep! via e-mail!
IF you want to know how to do things!!
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
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All depends on the paint. Our in-house body shop paints buses all day long with Imron(Dupont). Sometimes the letters go on as soon as one hour after being painted. We've never had any problems removing the letters. The only problem is that it will be discolored where the letters were. This is using Avery FT1000 vinyl.
-------------------- Bruce Evans Crown Graphics Chino, CA graphics@westcoach.net Posts: 913 | From: Chino, CA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Chuck......any of todays catalyzed automotive paints(enamel,urethane,base/clear) if done right,will be able to accept tape or vinyl about 2 hrs after its shot,and would present no problem removing it. The easiest way to test this prob is this....take a small strip of 3m masking tape,get a low spot on the vehicle,apply it,smooth it down and remove it....if the paint it going to lift its going to do it then,ifit does it then they butchered the job and its gonna come off the same way 6months to 2yrs from now,its not gonna harden anymore over time.....also someone mentioned off gassing/smell....a couple of days later if you still have off gassing going on that you can smell they once again did something wrong,dont fool with it...trust me,try the tape test and NEVER EVER guarantee anything on a paint job other than factory original unless youre the one who painted it.
Also,what Pierre mentioned is a legit problem...although i've yet to see it here in a warmer climate than hes in,but have heard it repeatedly from people up north...doesnt mean it wont happen,but it is mentioned occasionally in seminars.....the wait 3wks for imron is the only thing i never hear anymore....that was always the word when using it on boats...glass would soak up solvent and release it back out slowly over time
[ November 09, 2001: Message edited by: Gavin Chachere ]
-------------------- Gavin Chachere Plotter in the garage,New Orleans La.
"Sgts Shugart and Gordon again request permission to rope down to crash site two" Posts: 1223 | From: new orleans.la. | Registered: Mar 2000
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Acrylic ureathane (what most shops use anymore) takes 7 days to completely cross link, gets as dry as its gonna get. It hardens chemically, not by air exposure. If its dry enough to wetsand and buffout, its dry enough to apply vynil over it.
Ive taped over my paint many times the next day, I cant recall ever having any problems, not even with translucent or clear vynil. I used to do a lot of vynil woodgrain panels, never had any problems there either. The only problems Ive ever had wasnt because of outgassing, or working over fresh paint, it was because i didnt apply the vynil right (bubbles).
The key to not pulling the paint later is how the job is cleaned, sanded, and cleaned before painting. You just have to trust the shop that it was done right, cause you cant tell after its painted.
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