posted
I have heard many of you talk about the top five vinyl brands but haven't heard what they are. In your opions, what is the best high performance vinyl to use. Presently I use Gerber and Arlon(Calon II). I just would like to know if I can give my customer more. Tanhks All!!
------------------ Rob Larkham RL Graphic D-Sign Chester, MA rldsigns@aol.com
Posts: 517 | From: Chester, MA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
Upper line : Avery (just my preference) Lower line : Oracal 651 series,for the jobs that you don't need a to last a long time it's great for the price, cheap.It has a 3 year warranty. 15 inch X 10 yds about $15.00
posted
ok...sparcal(now avery),gregory,ameribam,gmi,for hp..gregory being the lowest price,ameriban, then avery and gmi ....for intermediate avery, gmi is all i use..and when hard pressed ill us oracal junk...
------------------ joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-944-5060 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND
Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I use Avery and Oracal hp. I have been getting mostly Oracal lately because it is a good amount cheaper than avery, and i have had great results with no problems. I like their 651 intermediate series as well, it is alot better than what I was using before, FDC. I also like how oracal has a light blue liner on their white vinyl, making it easier to weed..
------------------ Tyler Malinky
A Step Above Signs Cleveland, Ohio 440.479.8129 440.842.1894 fax
www.astepabovesigns.com tmalinky@astepabovesigns.com or exmayors@aol.com
Posts: 190 | From: Parma, Ohio USA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I'm stuck on Avery's A8.. I really like how this stuff works and it's much tougher than 3M's films.
I'm in the middle of replacing all my current stock with Avery film, roll by roll as I need them.
I order from Ameriban now, since they carry all the standard Avery HP colors (all 90 colors).. and I order metallics from GBC which they get from Neschen which is just a converter for Avery's metallic films just like FDC is.
I dont even mess with intermediate films.
------------------ Mike Pipes Digital Illusion Custom Graphics Lake Havasu City, AZ http://www.stickerpimp.com
Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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I have switched over to Oracal. It's working out great for us. 651 is a high gloss intermediate which works great for Gerber Edge prints. I can cut little letters which stay put and are easy to weed. Also, I like the way I can conform it to contours with a little help from a heat gun.
Speaking from experience it is very prudent to stick with one brand of vinyl, and only stray to get a specific color or product that is not available. Once you get to "know" your vinyl (like how it cuts, weeds, accepts different application tapes, and goes down on the substrate) then the more confident you will be in your sales pitch. And, when repeat orders come in or repair jobs, all your colors will be on hand and will match.
If you buy vinyl based on price, or a cheap price, you get what you pay for. If you use 4 square feet on a truck door lettering, it only costs you $2 or $3 extra for a better vinyl that won't "backfire" on you. This is a small extra amount to pay when the truck lettering is in the $95 to $250 range. That is my personal feeling on the matter.
I trust Oracal to hold up and not "backfire" on us. After Sparcal went out of business, we tried several different brands, including Avery, which made Sparcal,and we had some bad experiences. I don't need or want that trouble. We settled on Oracal with Transfer-rite clear application tape which is for me a perfect reliable system.
------------------ Draper The Signmaker Bloomington Illinois USA
Get To A Letterhead Meet This Summer! See you there! 309-828-7110 drapersigns@hotmail.com Draper_Dave on mIRC chat
Posts: 2883 | From: Bloomington Illinois USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I use some Avery, some Gerber, and some Arlon HP. For intermediate I use CalPlus...I tried Oracal...but I don't like the way it weeds at all. Seems brittle. I am used to weeding fast...so when I have to slow down and be careful....I don't like it. Plus Oracal is quite a bit less than 15". So when cutting long runs....you have to also be careful as it runs off the tracks of my Roland. Nope...I don't like Oracal.
------------------ surf or MoJo on mirc Cheryl J Nordby Signs by Cheryl Seattle WA.....! signsbycheryl@hotmail.com
posted
I like oracal (651) now, I felt the same way as Cheryl at first, but I turned up the force a bit now it cuts and weeds great, I also like the blue liner on the white, helps position when using a hinge. I also like the fact that it is high gloss, makes things look nicer that with the matte finish Arlon (cal2) that I was using. I use it for everything but storefront signs and some vehicles, how long do you need a general sign to last? I have a friend who has been using it for 3 years and no signs of failure. They never seem a roll, they have great colors, it's made in Germany and you know how good those guys make cars. Oh yeah and it is neither calendered or cast vinyl it is actually a PVC product with an adhesive back.
------------------ -------------------------------------------------- "A wise man once said that, or was it a wise guy?"
posted
"Way back when", it used to be Arlon/CALON. That was when Jim Welsh still owned the plant. Then he sold it to KUX Mfg., and the weather testing changed and the films were no longer what they had been. Arlon changed hands 4 more times and no longer is what it was. Avery holds the top spot now. Don't be fooled by some of the names. There are some very large converters that would like you to think they're actually a manufacturer.
------------------ St.Marie Graphics & Makin' Tracks Sound Studio Kalispell, Montana stmariegraphics@centurytel.net http://www.stmariegraphics.com 800 735-8026 We're chiseling every day of the week! :^)
I measured every one of my 15 inch rolls of Oracal to see if you were on to something. They are all 15" perfect.
Not only that, Oracal pays Gerber a $fee to have the holes punched in the vinyl same as Gerber's configuration.
Thus, when printing with the Gerber Edge, there is no slipping and misprinting, a problem I have had with Avery silver metalic. I wasted 3 full rolls of Avery and that was it for me! The problem was the hole punch configureation going through the Edge and slipping out of the track.
I have to agree with the comment made that Oracal is a PVC material. It IS DIFFERENT and other manufacturers of vinyl have been given a "wake up" call to this new developement in the graphic film industry.
------------------ Draper The Signmaker Bloomington Illinois USA
Get To A Letterhead Meet This Summer! See you there! 309-828-7110 drapersigns@hotmail.com Draper_Dave on mIRC chat
Posts: 2883 | From: Bloomington Illinois USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
i think she means the 20" ora junk...my 20" rolls are closer to 19 1/2"-19 3/4"...and peirrer got it right it aint vinly its PVC..and feels like it....iam a "tactile" person...and if it dont feel right.... as for adding down force..yep takes almost twice the pressure to cut it..and it eats blades...only interm. vinly i ever cut that actually broke a blade tip....and i keep the old blades to cut it with....only get it when i have to match a color....
------------------ joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-944-5060 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND
Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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Sounds like the sales reps from a certain manufacturer have been trying to dog-out the competition..
Has Oracal also explained the other aspects of their films' chemical make-up? Say like UV coatings or additives required to make up for the fact that PVC is NOT UV stable? Have they mentioned any means they use to lessen the effects of plasticizer migration, where the plasticizers in the PVC migrate into the adhesive, causing an adhesion failure? Since PVC requires plasticizers to make a flexible film, this is obviously a problem.
Now I'm sure Oracal has done their research into this stuff, but if they're going to tout how their film is better than the rest because it's PVC, they better be prepared to answer some technical questions to assure their customers.
Does anyone care that Avery manufactures 90% of all graphic films on the planet, with the other 10% being split between 3M and these other film makers?
Of all the film companies, AVERY knows what they're doing when it comes to good quality films. This is pretty obvious with the number of converters reselling their films - SparCal, Neschen, Universal, FDC (plus others I am sure but these are the films I have used and know for fact are Avery films).
Oh and for the record... MOST of the films from other manufacturers are PVC too, Oracal hasn't come up with anything new.
------------------ Mike Pipes Digital Illusion Custom Graphics Lake Havasu City, AZ http://www.stickerpimp.com
Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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posted
Vinyl choices seem to be as personal as lettering styles.
I would've never thought Oracal would divide so many people. It truly has this love/hate thing here, which I find amazing. I use it a lot myself - I like the way it works for flat, very smooth substrates (alum, mdo, sintra,etc), you can't beat the price, you cant beat the care Oracal has put into the product for the signmakers (ie - grid printed on liner, blue liner on white vinyl, punched for all cutters, etc.), and you can't beat the shine (customers love that, least around here.)
I'm in South Carolina, a moderately hot climate. I feel Oracal works well for me because of that - if I were in Wisconsin I'd be scared to use it. I have no idea how it works in sub-zero climates, boiling point hot climates etc. But, it works for me.
People tend to holler about a failure rate. For my money, failure rate is 99 out of a 100 times applicator error. There will always be a bad batch float around.. I used Rexham vinyl for a while and that stuff wasnt fit to letter a cow's ass. Bad batch? Maybe.. but the place I got it sold so little of it, some of it was ancient (I found out later).
I maybe ignorant of good from bad in a lot of sign products and techniques. I've always done things 'my way' meaning I figured it out as I went along. So far, I've seen little difference in HP vinyls. The calendared stuff.. now there's a difference.
Some people say "I NEVER use cal". I dont know why. It works great for its intended purpose, and sometimes - the customer doesnt need anything better. Why waste the money?
Oracal 651 works great for me economically, mechanically, and artistically. While I wouldnt recommend or use it for say, a residential entry sign... I'll use it for business signs, vehicles and banners. If it does fail, or looks bad in say 3 years, I'll go replace it for free. I've never had to do that.
Signs shouldnt last forever, you know. Styles change, colors change, owners change, etc.
Besides, I became addicted to eating and living in a house.... so a reoccuring income is sort of important to me.
Final Thought - use the right tool for the right job. You dont put a new motor in car you're going to trade, and you dont put 8 year vinyl on a less-than-three-year sign!
------------------ Robb Lowe Hub City Graphics Spartanburg, SC
posted
Dave.......I had 3 rolls...white, black and blue....all of them measured less than 15". I stood them on end....on a hard surface. They are definately shorter. I told my supplier....they agreed. Oracal is not the same 15" as other vinyls. Maybe I just got a bad batch??
------------------ surf or MoJo on mirc Cheryl J Nordby Signs by Cheryl Seattle WA.....! signsbycheryl@hotmail.com
posted
I did 38 4x8 signs for the back stretch at a local race track three years ago. I used mostly Oracal HP for all the signs. I'm having troubles anywhere I used white vinyl on a dark background. Under the copy I'm getting a chalky run all down the sign. The vinyl seems to be breaking down and when the rain runs down the sign it is taking the color with it. I have also had alot of glue failure after three years. 99.9% of the work was applied dry. MDO substrate with Oneshot bulletin colors for backgrounds. I also find their vinyl to be very plastic and it snaps easily. As I said I just bought a roll of Avery from Ameriban and I like the feel of it. I will give it a try.
------------------ Rob Larkham RL Graphic D-Sign Chester, MA rldsigns@aol.com
[This message has been edited by Rob Larkham (edited July 29, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Rob Larkham (edited July 29, 2001).]
Posts: 517 | From: Chester, MA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I've used Gregory for their Trendfilm & also the 3m Electrocut vinyls. Also, Gerber - all with excellent results.
If you'd like to use metallics you might try Sharpline Converting Inc. in Wichita, Ks. They have an excellent line of high perfomance vinyls which cut, weed & apply Real easy. The # is: 1-800-888-4888
------------------ Bill Cosharek Bill Cosharek Signs N.Huntingdon,Pa
bcosharek@juno.com
Posts: 703 | From: N.Huntingdon, Pa, USA | Registered: Dec 1999
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posted
I dont use calendared/intermediate films mainly because it has no place in the work I do (vehicle graphics).
I cant airbrush it because it will curl up under the paint/ink.
You never know the environments a certain vehicle is subjected to, you may as well use the best film you can.. it's your reputation on the line afterall.
In my business the average $300 graphics kit uses 8 feet of vinyl. You can do the math, $8 worth of HP vinyl or $2.50 worth of calendared vinyl.. I dont see a reason to skimp out and use the $2.50 option, besides the fact this kit would be airbrushed and I've already said the intermediates cant be painted and expected to stay flat more than a few months.
Others have their reasons.. sure, a 50 yard roll is super cheap in comparison, but check out the "per job" cost and the difference is very little.
Just because the material is 1/3rd the cost doesnt mean the job should be too.. in fact, it's the same amount of labor to complete the job, so based on material markup alone most jobs arent that much cheaper using it.
------------------ Mike Pipes Digital Illusion Custom Graphics Lake Havasu City, AZ http://www.stickerpimp.com
Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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posted
rob...hp oracal is good...intermediate is what i was makin referance to....as for oracal being cheaper..i dont know what your payin for vinyl but it aint the cheapest on the block in my part of the world....ill bet if you go to gregorys site...youll change your mind...20"x10 yrd gregory hp cost me $42.00.(and there silver and gold is same price as color)..same 20"x10 yrd oracal hp cost me $46.99. ORACAL 651 20"x50yrd $63.00, 20 X 10 YRD is $19.95 GMI gloss interm. 20"X 50 yrd $59.00 avery premium 20"x 10 yd $55.95 avery interm 20"x 50yd i think is 69.99 20 x 10 yrd is $18.50, ameriban hp 20x10yd is $44.00..wont use the banner cal...red lasts about a week..
------------------ joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-944-5060 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND
Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Hey Rob Larkam, you said you had adhesive failure, and you said they were all done dry(as though dry was the best way to insure quality bonding),well myself and a lot of other folks have learned just the oposite.
The best bonding is usually from a WET application with Rapid Tac or Tac II(and following instructions).
The proof is right in your own statement,"all done dry, 99.9% failure"
Ok, I'm all done now !!
Roger
------------------ Roger Bailey Rapid Tac Incorporated Waikoloa, Hawaii
posted
Roger- Can you give me a reason that wet will make something stick better. I'm just being the devils advocate and maybe learning something in the process. I'm looking for some scientific reasons not just because everyone says. I always thought if you could get it to lay flat and where you wanted it that dry was the best way. What's in your juice that would make this stick any better, and why don't the vinyl companies tell us to always use aplication fluid for better adhesion. Understand Roger, I'm not looking for a fight, just honest answers. It's not that I don't love your product when I need it but if I can get buy with out using $27.00 and $20.00 a gallon fluids on everything I'd like to. As it is you've got me using $33.00 a gallon juice to wash my brushes and air brushes. Next you'll have my wife washing my clothes with it. LOL. Thanks for any imfo Roger. You are a hell of a salesman.
------------------ Rob Larkham RL Graphic D-Sign Chester, MA rldsigns@aol.com
Posts: 517 | From: Chester, MA | Registered: May 2001
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You said something in your post above that I can provide some insight on.
-------you said: "I always thought if you could get it to lay flat and where you wanted it that dry was the best way. What's in your juice that would make this stick any better, and why don't the vinyl."-----------
When you remove vinyl from the paper track a charge of static electricity in the vinyl becomes a sign guy's worse nightmare. It magnetically sucks right down on the substrate before you can work with it, then there are bubbles everwhere, not to mention dirt that might get attracted as well.
Also if its hot outside, the vinyl seems to melt and stretch before one can get it into position.
Rapid Tac or Rapid Tac2 will allow you to CONTROL those issues. The fluid does not react with the glue, it does not add to the stick...its just for control.
Problems using application fluids arise when the fluid can not be removed...like around rivits on a box truck. The moister gets in behind the rivits and then comes out again causing a great deal of frustration and wasted time and sometimes job failure. The vinyl never gets seated around the rivit and then it cracks in cold weather.
In our shop, all magnetic signs are made by printing the copy first on white vinyl (Geber Edge)* then applying that vinyl to the magnetic sheeting, then trimed. There is no way we can put the vinyl down on the magnetic sheeting without Rapid Tac.
*The reason we are "printing" magnetic signs is because the Gerber Edge will lay down 4 to 6 colors faster than we can cut, weed and apply 1 color copy. (fyi)
hope this helps
------------------ Draper The Signmaker Bloomington Illinois USA
Get To A Letterhead Meet This Summer! See you there! 309-828-7110 drapersigns@hotmail.com Draper_Dave on mIRC chat
[This message has been edited by Dave Draper (edited July 30, 2001).]
Posts: 2883 | From: Bloomington Illinois USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Dave- I'm aware of the reason for using rapid tac when it comes to bubbles. I don't get any bubbles when I use the hinge method, therfore I didn't think I needed to use any Juice to help me. I use the same dry method when applying vinyl to my magnetics. Simply stick mag onto piece of sheetmetal on drawing board and apply vinyl with hinge method. I have worked dry for six years now. Rarely do I use fluid. I have applied vinyl race graphics 10 and 12 feet long 24 inches high, dry onto race trailers.(hinged in the middle) My question to Roger was if he could tell me that there is something in his fluid that would make it stick better. I was always under the impression that it was strictly for positioning and bubbles. I have applied a lot of vinyl and have had no problems except at that race track with the oracal HP. So once again Roger...What's in the juice???
------------------ Rob Larkham RL Graphic D-Sign Chester, MA rldsigns@aol.com
Posts: 517 | From: Chester, MA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
Re-read the info/msds sheet that comes with rapid tac dave..its not just for bubbles...Rob,what rapid tac or any application fluid is designed to do is this...the glue/adhesive on the back of the vinyl is on there in millions of tiny encapsulated spheres,wheh you squeegee the vinyl the spehres break and release the adhesive...sometimes,they dont all break due to surface tension,angles,substrate,temp etc...application fluid allows this to happen easier and more uniformly,its also the reason you wanna use app fluid in a wet app(whether its rogers or another) and not soapy water,windex,or anything thats gonna damage those adhesive spheres prematurely,cause em not to release etc
------------------ Gavin Chachere aka Zeeman Miller Supply Co./Ozone Signs & Grafix New Orleans La. www.millersupply.net www.ozonegrafix.com
Posts: 1223 | From: new orleans.la. | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Why is it the fluid guy telling me this and not the vinyl guy? Is this a conspiracy?When I buy a roll of vinyl it comes with a nice little sheet giving me instructions on how to apply dry. I would assume if the vinyl company wanted you to apply their product wet they would tell you to use fluid...yes-no? Who am I to believe? It's my opinion that when vinyl applied wet or dry hits the sun and gets baked on, it is on. Maybe I'm missing something here but I'm not sure who is giving me the straight skinny on this one. It's not that I don't use Roger's product when I need it, but who is telling the truth.
------------------ Rob Larkham RL Graphic D-Sign Chester, MA rldsigns@aol.com
[This message has been edited by Rob Larkham (edited July 30, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Rob Larkham (edited July 30, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Rob Larkham (edited July 30, 2001).]
Posts: 517 | From: Chester, MA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
Oops, I got busy today and just "dialed" back in. Thanks to Gavin, Dave D. And to Rob for honestly wanting to know !!
Dave, you have it about 1/2 right (the "fluid" does indeed promote 100% bursting of adhesive beads) just as Gavin explained earlier(thanks Gavin for your "paint industry knowledge").
That means MORE of a total bond then just dry applying, don't take my word for it though.
Go to www.rapidtac.com Click "testimonials" There you can find a letter from Fasson(AVERY) Also read the bottom of labels on bottles of Right On / Right Off, (Rob, this helps answer your question about vinyl manuf. telling you what).
Rob, I started applying "preasure sensitive vinyl" in 1965, now that really don't make me a genius, but I have laid enough to know that "not only does application fluid guarantee a quality job" it also (in aprox.80% of vinyl applications) saves time over dry apps.
Time Rob, plus insurance against having to travel back to the shop, cut another sign, drive back re-apply,re-instill confidence in customer,etc.(all of that when you should have made a profit on his job and been 3/4 of the way thru the next job)
So, hows that 28.00 dollar expence weigh up against (in one month) a few hours lost labor, travel costs, wasted material bill, frustration, customer confidence,etc. ???
OK then, now you can say " I GOT A HONEST TO GOODNESS SALES JOB FROM ROGER BAILEY" !!.
But remember Rob I'm willing to prove it !!
Oh yeah, and its a "SAFE" product to clean with (4 benifits in 1 bottle).
Such a deal !!
Roger(the answer man)lol, yeah I have to answer for everything .ha ha ha ha ha ha
------------------ Roger Bailey Rapid Tac Incorporated Waikoloa, Hawaii
posted
Thanks Roger- I now have the answer I wanted. Do you have any opinions on what vinyl is the best? Or best when used with your product? Not to put you on the spot but I figured maybe with some of the research and development you have done with the product, you may have a better answer than most. Just wondering.
------------------ Rob Larkham RL Graphic D-Sign Chester, MA rldsigns@aol.com
Posts: 517 | From: Chester, MA | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I read the Avery/Fasson testimonial on the rapidtac site. To me, it reads like 'your product DOESNT HURT ANYTHING but I dont read it as "your product makes our product work better".
I am a wet-applicatin' fool, dont get me wrong. It saves me a LOT of time, effort and money. I often dont even worry about hinges and such, I just soak the board, peel and soak the vinyl, slide it into place, squeegee and remove paper. Within a day at max, that sucker is rock solid. Not one failure yet.
I avoid dry installation like the plague if I can help it. Bubble city, one-shot-or-die kind of error window, and no hope for 'saving' a doubled over, wind or gravity damaged decal. I often think a lot of signpeople do the dry apply out of some sort of 'honor' thing. Like it somehow makes them more of a 'real' signmaker. I have no idea if thats true, but thats how it comes across when you get that,
"Well I NEVER use fluid.." (looking down nose, arms crossed, arrogant demeanor)
Now before you think ol'Roger sent me a check to say all this - let it be known that I'm the guy he loves to hate - I'm the guy that mixes his own most of the time. I know..I know.. "soaps have silicone!" well thats true.. not ALL of them, but most. Roger's concoction is great, but its an expense that has yet to be proven in my shop.
Although I will say this - if it makes frosted or reflective vinyl go on wet - I'll buy a case of it!
Not looking to stroke or smack any egos here, just saying that if it can go on wet, it works best that way, 99 out of 100 times, for me.
------------------ Robb Lowe Hub City Graphics Spartanburg, SC
posted
Experience has always been the best teacher for me.
That said, I've always noticed that when I had to strip vinyl off a job where we used Rapid Tac, the vinyl was a lot more difficult to remove. It just seemed to be stuck tighter than on jobs where we applied the vinyl dry. To me, it seems Rapid Tac makes the adhesive do a better job of stick'n.
posted
Jeeeze...i figure i use at max $1.50 in rapid tac on a job...at maximum. At less than 10cents an ounce its hardly an added expense...do something radical like add $5 to each job you do to pay for it and you'll pay for it more than a few times over,if $28 is gonna put the entire biz into a hardship or close you down its time to rethink strategy....ex.--draper said he sometimes double or triple tapes a graphic to make it stiffer and easier to handle...i've done that and it works great..but if we're gonna look at the hard dollars and cents of the isue.....its gonna be a given you'll wind up using more $$$$ up in tape and in your time pulling it off than using a wet application in the first place...now might you find a situation where the triple tape method is the way to go,yes...its just an example.Believe me...all day long i listen to people bitch and cry about the $$$$ price of something b/c they don't look one hour into the future,they only see the right now cost.
------------------ Gavin Chachere aka Zeeman Miller Supply Co./Ozone Signs & Grafix New Orleans La. www.millersupply.net www.ozonegrafix.com
Posts: 1223 | From: new orleans.la. | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Gavin, you make great points and I totally agree with you. All I'm saying is - performance wise, I dont see any difference so why spend the extra cash for nothing to gain? It takes less time to mix up a batch than it does to call and order, wait, sign for the UPS, etc.
I'm not saying Roger's stuff isnt excellent - it is. As a matter of fact, compared to the crap you get from Denver Sign Supply (buy one, get one free gallon deal), its freekin champagne!
------------------ Robb Lowe Hub City Graphics Spartanburg, SC
posted
i got rogers samples....what ive used is ok....dont do a lot of wet apps anyway....did one the other day..used my trusty WINDEX NO DRIP....works for me...
------------------ joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-944-5060 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND
Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Rob Larkam, our products will work with most every vinyl, my personel favorites are based on a wide variety of reasons.
I like Arlon, gerber, avery, 3-m, there "seems" to be some differences between "pigment, colors" But, thats one of those things you gotta deal with from job to job.
I NEVER use "high tac" trans tape, period. I do use "mid/low" tac,(the smaller the charecter/ the higher the tac).
I NEVER use a "cloth towell or rag" to clean ANYTHING for paint or vinyl application.
I ALWAYS use a "grocery store(cheap) paper towell".
Now you have what I have learned over the years, and I have had VERY few problems.
But if a problem arises, I have confidence, cause I "wet applied" that leaves a "window" for correction, at the job site, NO going back accross town, re- cutting,weeding,applying, And that Rob Lowe Is where you compare the 28.00 a month!!
Roger
------------------ Roger Bailey Rapid Tac Incorporated Waikoloa, Hawaii
posted
problem with using windex on anything is that it contains ammonia...which always wants to return to its gaseous state...when the windex evaporates the ammonia stays,and when it gets hot enuff it gasses off...whether its under vinyl,on a window etc....learned the hard way never use that stuff to clean anything
------------------ Gavin Chachere aka Zeeman Miller Supply Co./Ozone Signs & Grafix New Orleans La. www.millersupply.net www.ozonegrafix.com
Posts: 1223 | From: new orleans.la. | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Hey Heads, Anyone try that newfangled liquid vinyl? Yeah, it comes in a can, no cutting, nbo weeding, the only problem is you gotta apply it with a brush. LOL
------------------ Bob Elliott SouthPaw Signs Dingmans Ferry, Pa. 570-828-8909 southpaw@pikeonline.net
May be left-handed, but still not in my right mind.
Posts: 35 | From: Dingmans Ferry Pa. USA | Registered: Jan 2000
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posted
gota inject some humor ..once in a while....heheheheheh....as for going back to the shop....i take my shop with me...this is so great....make a mistake..oh well just recut and move on....
------------------ joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-944-5060 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND
Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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