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Think of all the "BAD" press he is giving himself! Who would want a Money Grubing Cry Baby to do thier signs? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.
-------------------- PKing is Pat King The Professor of SIGNOLOGY Posts: 3113 | From: Pompano Beach, FL. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Honestly, it would be different if it was a unique design, but the people in the article are right, that's a common look that *ANYONE* could have drawn up.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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Well, the design doesn't look that fantastic to me but, some of mine probably don't look that great either. The oval "welcome to" is competing fiercely with the main copy "Victor". The sign is just too busy but that's most likely not the designer's fault.
But the chances against the other designer choosing the oval, the same clipart, the prioritizing, the same arrangement....the EXACT elements and design are slim to none...impossible. I'd have to see his drawings for sure but, they most likely stole it. I hope he gets due compensation for it. But he shouldn't have given them a design without payment up front.
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7403 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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"Money-Grubbing Crybaby"???? IF the municipality shopped his design to competitors without his approval, he has every right to sue. There are way too many variables in this design for another shop to have "coincidentally" come up with an almost identical design.
As to the reputation he gets, I'd personally rather be known as someone who protects my copyright - and give notice to anyone who thinks they will shop my designs with impunity. In this case, it gives the municipality a black eye.
If I could, I'd like to see the original design next to the sign, and we might have a better idea what really happened here.
-------------------- "A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle
Cam Bortz Finest Kind Signs Pondside Iron works 256 S. Broad St. Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379 "Award winning Signs since 1988" Posts: 3051 | From: Pawcatuck,Connecticut USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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A: Consider a "bid" to be qouting a sign job that has already been designed and specified. How can more than one shop offer competative "bids" on what may be vastly different designs? Talk about comparing apples and oranges.
B: Handle such situations by selling ourselves. We go in and sell the shop...the municipality, or company or whomever, must commit to hiring us, based on our portfolio and reputation; before we even begin the estimating process. This contract is of course contigent on our providing a suitable design, but that's why you went and talked to the potential client in the first place.
Furthermore, we then establish a budget for the project. Once we've been chosen as the project provider, and the budget has been determined, THEN we offer two or three designs, all stamped with our "intellectual property" statement, for consideration.
In 24 years, rarely have we had any problems. On the occasions we did have our designs stolen, we filed our claim in court, provided all documentation, and have never lost those infrequent, but non-the-less inevitable disputes.
Posts: 465 | From: / | Registered: Jan 2000
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Good Design or bad it is still his and Brian hit the nail right on the head.
I have been the same boat and by taking a few simple steps you can have an ironclad way to prevent it and if your design is copied get paid your bid plus expenses.
Any design we do especially for bid jobs we take one simple step and allways on logo design, that is print it out sign and date with shop name and whatever info you feel important, Put it in an envelope and mail to yourself with reference name on bottom of envelope. You see that little post mark it has when you get it back in a couple of days will be as good as any copyrite lawyer. don't open it just stick in a file or the customers file and any discrepency will be settled very quickly in court.
We have had to pursue only a few since I started this on advice from a lawyer. You see the way it works when you go to court all you have to do is give that little envelope to the judge sealed and and he will look at the federal postmark and open the letter with all the dates and info, and unless they can show that the design the used was "Purchased" befor the post mark you will be awarded your original quote, installation, and whatever charges you had associated with the job that you had in writing and in that well spent .37 This is an old rule in the first step to leagaly copyrite something. The last job that this had to be used on was a sign package for a doctors office that had 2 locations our bid was 8700.00 for the package and we was awarded 9500.00 30 seconds after the judge opened the envelope.
Reproduce any artwork from one of those fancy design firms downtown and watch how fast they make someones life unbearable, Sign shops should be no different since most of us have just as good artistic skills as they do and should be respected as such, and payed just as well on our designs. Hey most design firms even get a cut of the pie as long as thier design is used for profit.
If more sign shops operated this way you can bet the stealling would be minimal and we would actually get paid what we are supposed to get for designs just like the artist most business owners are trying to bypass by getting "sign shops" to design thier logos and artwork. I don't think any one would see you as a cry baby for wanting to get paid for your skills and tallent as a professionall artist or shop owner.
And one foot note since I own the design for the doctors we do all of there signage and printing work and after an expesive lesson on thier behalf it is actually a good relationship.
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Cam said it right. If indeed the sketch matches the finished sign, time to pay up. No doubt they showed the sketches to the other signshop if they were looking for a cheaper price. I too would like to see the sketch to compare.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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