posted
I'm about ready to hurt someone! I'm a pretty stable guy, but there's a shop nearby that's going to drive me postal! He has no graphic abilities what-so-ever, but he's a computer whiz. He hired a guy to do all his layouts, so some of the work looks average (that's the best I can say about it). The problem is, he's got a major account with a national business that accounts for more than 75% of his business, so he thinks that by low-balling everyone in the area, he'll be the only one left eventually. That's not going to happen, but what he's doing to the local market is just plain stupid.
I just received a call (Thursday) for a 4'x12' restaurant sign (4 words, outlined, shadowed and a nice graphic. The client needed it by Monday. The job was vinyl installed on an existing aluminum panel. The old vinyl also needed removed. I gave the client a fair bid to do the sign by Monday and a bid broken into 3 stages so he could have the sign completed over a period of about a month thus saving him the rush charge. He went ballistic and showed me a bid from my "pal" for $199.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This has happened 4-5 times over the last 6 months and it's starting to grate on me. I've really got to bite my tongue when his name comes up, because I've never been one to badmouth the competition.
Well, I'm not looking for any answers concerning this maggot. I just needed to vent, fume and boil over a little. What the hell ever happened to business ethics?
[ October 20, 2003, 12:44 PM: Message edited by: Terry Baird ]
-------------------- Terry Baird Baird Signs 3484 West Lake Rd. Canandaigua, NY 14424 Posts: 790 | From: Canandaigua, New York | Registered: Dec 2002
| IP: Logged |
I don't know where they get their bizz sense. The question... If someone is charging $110 for something why don't I charge that or more?? There was a dude here that low balled every thing. One day I get a call for a bid and he said the other guy bid this, can u beat it? Sure so i bid just about what it would cost in materials plus a littel extra. A cargo trailer for $90 bux both sides. about 6 hours work with rivets and all..
I didn't get the call back, the other guy got it. $80 bux.. The other guy is now gone..
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5274 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Can't offer any help, but can offer a possible smile....
1. Get his email address. Register it with MoneyDaze. He will get at least 40 spams a day from them and they will not stop. Does he need viagara, a dating service, re-fi his home?
2. Re-arrange the letters in his name into something stupid (think, terets syndrome here). Tell yourself this name everytime you hear about him.
3. Tell yourself he's really an alien in disguise. The MIB boys are tracking his every move. Any day now, his home planet (where everything is red helvetica in an arch) will be calling for his return.
Seriously, keep doing quality work and "don't let the bastards get you down."
-------------------- Chris Welker Wildfire Signs Indiana, Pa Posts: 4254 | From: Indiana, PA | Registered: Mar 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
...OR you could pop in and visit him at his shop and snoop around...er "make friends". He must have something going on that you could benefit from associating w. him. Like perhaps he can help you w. any (future) computer problems you may have.
Stay patient and keep in mind that he WILL "cancel himself out" eventually. The sign biz ain't no bowl of cherries (is it?), and cheap skates never last long.
If you really want to help cancel him out, start ratting him out to your local sign ordinance inforcers. Does he have permits, liscenses and insurance? Go git 'im!
posted
Sub Contract all your work to him, that way you can spend time on the profitable work Posts: 1539 | From: Hemet,CA U.S.A. | Registered: Jun 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Kissy, Did you send my e-mail address to Moneydaze? I get tons of Viagra, refinancing, porn, and Ebay e-mails everyday. One day when I wasn't here at lunch one of my employees(high school student) got on my computer and went to a porn site and they have been flooding in ever since. He didn't know that I could pull up the website history to catch him.
Terry, I had a conversation with my competition here about something similar. Just bring to his attention that our suppliers don't cut their prices when we try to cut each others throats. The only person that wins is the customer. He is cutting his own profits. If he doesn't understand then hang in there, because he won't be around long. Try to find out the info on his big account that way when he is gone you can pick it up also.
posted
every job that you really don't want cut the price to nearly cost then tell the customer that your competitor will do it cheaper. pretty soon he will be to busy to remain in business.
-------------------- Jimmy Chatham Chatham Signs 468 stark st Commerce, Ga 30529 Posts: 1766 | From: Commerce, GA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
The day will come when his national chain client wants to beat him up on price a little more, and his material costs will only be higher by then and he won't have any room left to move.. and his client will drop him like a bad habit... then he's sunk.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
i had a freind in sarasota who had a NATIONAL CHAIN account and it was the budwiser dist in town. he busted his butt doin all kinds a silly crap for them. then one day they called him, asked him if he would come over to their place and INSTRUCT their new $5.00 an hour employee on how to make all the signs that he used to make for them.....THEY WENT AND BOUGHT ALL ALL THE EQIPMENT TO MAKE THEIR OWN SIGNS!!! so much for big accounts...
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
I just lost a $40k lighted sign job. I had the signed workorder, but not the deposit.
Another customer of mine stopped by last week to pick up some decals. He saw the signed workorder on the counter as it waited for the customer to stop by with the check. The decal customer left and called my sign customer and asked to bid on the job.
He undercut my price by $11k. That's $5k below my cost.
I found out about it this morning when I called to find out where the deposit check was.
posted
Terry, Why not try going after his "major account". Wouldn't it be nice to throw a little scare into him. Since he's so busy eliminating the competition and losing money he won't have time to take care of his big customer.
Glen, That is one of the lowest, most despicable, excuses for a business person I ever heard of. I don't know how these people can stand to look at themselves in the mirror knowing that they're nothing more than common theives.
-------------------- Jean Shimp Shimp Sign & Design Co. Jacksonville Beach, Fl Posts: 1269 | From: Jacksonville Beach, Fl. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
Let him keep his "major" acount...anyone that allows one business to represent 75% of their reciepts is doomed.
Keep this guy busy with all the crap work you can send him (stupid customers...lookie lou's...self designers...and anyone that demands corogated plastic cheapos)
While he's lowballing that crap you can get on with your life doing good work for good customers.
Oh and the next time someone walks in and says the other guy is cheeper! Tell them "he knows what he's worth" then turn away and go back to work...you'll be surprised how a little lack of concern makes them stop and think! You might not get them this time but they will never tell you again how cheap the other guy is.
Especially after he's gone! and he will be!
-------------------- "Werks fer me...it'll werk fer you"
A longtime friend who owns a printing business just lost his largest account...a chain of supermarkets. They were recently puchased by a large regional chain of markets and he got hung out to dry as a result. Something like 60% of his business literally disappeared overnight and the last time we spoke he was "less than friendly". Understandable in his situation. Although they had a good relationship for years, I'm sure the sting from this is going to be what he remembers for a long time to come.
Being dependant on one customer for the majority of your income is always a bad move. You leave yourself vulnerable to a lot of problems. In my friend's case, the customer ceases to exsist this Friday and he loses the account by no fault of his own.
It's business. Keep it businesslike. Stand your ground on your ethics and you have a better list, not just a "big" list, of customers you can work with.
I'd rather work with a customer than for them. Rapid
-------------------- Ray Rheaume Rapidfire Design 543 Brushwood Road North Haverhill, NH 03774 rapidfiredesign@hotmail.com 603-787-6803
I like my paint shaken, not stirred. Posts: 5648 | From: North Haverhill, New Hampshire | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Whoa!!! Just wait a second. Is this the same crowd that asks where they can find a supplier that is $6 cheaper on a roll of vinyl? Competition is the foundation for our whole economic system. We all benefit from it. It makes us better, more efficient and ultimatly more prosperous. I'll point out lousy designs, substandard materials and missed deadlines, but if someone else can provide a better, cheaper product, they deserve the business. Eventually the better product wins. A Honda costs 3 times what a Yugo cost. Guess whos still around.
-------------------- Carper's Signs 594 Union School Rd. Mount Joy, PA 17552 carpersign@earthlink.net Posts: 157 | From: Lancaster, PA, USA | Registered: Aug 1999
| IP: Logged |
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6734 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
As to national accounts or just large ones, I always charge at the higher end. There is no loyalty from those types, so when they up and leave for the next sign company there are no regrets on my end as to how I deserve a better fate or should have charged more.
One of those was just as Joe described, a local beer distributor who had bought plenty off me for many years. One day they called and asked if I could train them on the use of their plotter and software. Hurts, but I did shoot an outrageous price at them to do it.
-------------------- Wright Signs Wyandotte, Michigan Posts: 2785 | From: Wyandotte, MI USA | Registered: Jan 1999
| IP: Logged |
![[Mad]](mad.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
so i bid just about what it would cost in materials plus a littel extra. A cargo trailer for $90 bux both sides. about 6 hours work with rivets and all..
Printer-friendly view of this topic