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When I worked at the fire truck factory, they were getting chassis from the factory that were painted black. Then they had to paint some of them lime green. They had a terrible time with coverage until the Dupont chemists came in.They re-formulated the Imron paint so it had lead added to it. After that, all the Imron sold to them had lead in it. They say the lead was what made it cover better.
So if 1-shot will have no lead, does that mean the coverage won't be as good ?
-------------------- Jeff Ogden 8727 NE 68 Terr. Gainesville FL, 32609 Posts: 2138 | From: 8827 NE 68 Terr Gainesville Fl 32609 | Registered: Aug 2002
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It was my understaning that they took a bunch of the lead out of all the colors about 6-8 years ago, but that the reds and yellows still had some. A signpainter freind of mine went out and bought up all the inventory of a store when he heard this. I dont know if they ever took it out then, but maybe we should get Frank Manning or someone else from OneShot to give us the lowdown on it. My hopes are that they have come up with another way for these colors to cover efficiently
-------------------- Harris Kohen K-Man Pinstriping and Graphix Trenton, NJ "Showing the world that even I can strategically place the pigment where its got to go." Posts: 1739 | From: Trenton, NJ, USA | Registered: Jun 2001
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Is it possible to purchase the lead at a Chemist supply and add it in ourselves?
-------------------- Signs by Alicia Jennings (Mudflap Girl) Tacoma, WA Since 1987 Have Lipstick, will travel. Posts: 3846 | From: Tacoma, WA. U.S.A. | Registered: Dec 1999
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As I understand it it was the lead that made it last a long time, the anti-weather ingredient. And Alicia I believe chemical suppliers have white lead in powder form and it is called Litharge. But don't take my word for any of this...
Posts: 1859 | From: / | Registered: Nov 1998
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You can buy powdered lead/liquid lead in many places,i've even seen people here claim they get it at a marine supply and they add it to paint and it makes it last longer...frankly if they want to believe that its fine and dandy,let em at it cuz its very bad,very dangerous and very irresponsible advice....this isn't like the days where you bought the white lead and mixed up your own primer etc... and its not like fine art colors or glazes,for lead to be an effective part of this type of paint it has to be in the form of pigment or lead based driers,it needs to chemically be/become part of the paint film,dumping the powder in after the fact is going to have the same effect as dumping sand in the can...sure its going to feel heavier but its not doing anything but making sludge. Powdered lead is exceedingly dangerous to be around and you can easily give yourself the lead dosage in 30 days you might not get in 25yrs of fooling with paints,not to mention the powder is so fine its going to be all over your clothes,then in your house,your cars,kids and dog etc...plus it also likes to explode if it gets the chance to be near enuff to a spark or flame. Not to mention if the stae/city etc ever decides to come visit you and inspect and they detect any kind of lead in the place at random they're gonna be up your rear with a microscope till they find out wear its coming from The lead does give paint longevity b/c it has such a long half life in nature,and yah lead based pigments were heavier/denser and gave better coverage...thats not always true today,every company has the ability to manufacture or more commonly purchase pigments which work just as well,its just not always "cost effective" for em to do so.
Some colors,regardless if they have lead or not just dont have the pigment density or holdout others do....and if you read here long enough you'll see plenty people say "oh paint nowadays only lasts a year outside b/c it doesn't have lead",yet you'll see someone else with the same color up in the weather for 11yrs,seems to be a 50/50 proposition,and if it was all the paint/lack of lead you'd see failures across the board pretty much,or not see them....what the paint is reduced with or what additives you put in it are far more important to longevity nowadays than whether or not the individual colors have lead in it. Just my $.11 centavos
-------------------- Gavin Chachere Plotter in the garage,New Orleans La.
"Sgts Shugart and Gordon again request permission to rope down to crash site two" Posts: 1223 | From: new orleans.la. | Registered: Mar 2000
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Many of your management companies, universities and government entities will require a Lead and/or Asbestos statement. You may not get that form to fill out until you are trying to collect your final check.
To me, losing Lead is not a major problem since there are so many more options on paint than there were a couple of decades ago. The paint manufacturers have been forced to develop new technologies, some of which are very durable. They may handle differently but we will get used to it. Also, keep in mind that if we no longer have Lead available, neither does our competition.
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5099 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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What about the chemicals that are in vinyl? What about the waste that they produce? I waste way more vinyl then paint. How much waste is produced at the plants where they make vinyl? I wish that maybe only lisenced persons were allowed to use industrial paints. Ya know, I'm all for a clean planet and all, but is a little sign enamel gonna really ruin the world. Why don't we all just go back to the stone age, run around half naked and living in caves. Then the planet will be safe at last. PS. I still have a tiny bit of R&M wax and grease remover.
-------------------- Signs by Alicia Jennings (Mudflap Girl) Tacoma, WA Since 1987 Have Lipstick, will travel. Posts: 3846 | From: Tacoma, WA. U.S.A. | Registered: Dec 1999
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Dave, Be careful what you ask for. Everyone on the naked planet won't look like Alicia. OP, Chris Elliott, Ryan Young, and others. Those guys would be the first out of their skivies. What a thought! Man, that just screwed up the rest of my day.
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SLOW Down Folks. Nothing to really get excited about. its a matter of coverage or longevity. You have Choices here. 1. is to add Dana Color and 2. is to Add RONAN which is so heavy an d thick with color. there will be a very SHORT Learning Curve like everything else. Have a good Day.
Just For Today
Keep The Rubber Side Up
-------------------- Danny Bussell Tujunga, California
Bootleg on Chat
"Keep The Rubber Side Down" Posts: 213 | From: Tujunga, California | Registered: Mar 2003
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But without the lead, how will I continue my downward spiral into insanity? VanGogh never realized how good he had it. Hey, anybody want an extra ear?
-------------------- Mark Rogan The Great Barrington Sign Company 2 Stilwell Street, Great Barrington, MA 01230 mark@gbsignco.com
"Sometimes I think my head is so big because it is so full of fonts" Posts: 332 | From: Great Barrington, MA | Registered: Mar 2003
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Adrienne, You're good! let's vote this makes the cover of Sign of the Times! Anyone interested in making it happen?? Si, would you sell the rights to your fame?!
[ September 10, 2003, 01:18 PM: Message edited by: Deb Fowler ]
-------------------- Deb Fowler
"It's kind of fun to do the impossible - Walt Disney (1901-1966) Posts: 5373 | From: Loves Park, Illinois | Registered: Aug 1999
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Actually all of the paint manufacturers have been soft lead free since 1991 as mandated by the EPA. Soft leads are the ones that are water and blood soluable such as white lead, red lead oxide, litharge etc. They recently only have the hard leads such as chromium lead oxide in the enamels and have been exempted as professional artist applications. If they are promoting it now, that probably means that they feel that most of their back inventories including those of small volume distributors have been essentiallly depleted. I don't know the current position of the EPA on the hard lead pigments so that might also be at issue. During my last year with AKZO they were concerned as a deep pocket corp. that they should remove all leads to avoid expensive lawsuits on a small volume product line. All Chromatic colors were lead free when they were purchased by Spraylat. Spraylat may have some of the same concerns. The hard leads are more stable colors but some of the synthetics are quite good. Ronan and Dana (Triangle Coatings) are dealing with these same problems and keeping up with compliance.
-------------------- Kent Smith Smith Sign Studio P.O.Box 2385, Estes Park, CO 80517-2385 kent@smithsignstudio.com Posts: 1025 | From: Estes Park, CO | Registered: Nov 1998
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![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
Those guys would be the first out of their skivies. ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Mad]](mad.gif)
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
Lotti and ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Kelly![[Applause]](graemlins/clap.gif)
Si, would you sell the rights to your fame?!
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