posted
Everyone I am sure has heard a variation of that statement. I hear the clients in the shop say it at least once a day while standing at one of the design stations. ( I know, that's a bad idea, but its a 22 year habit that is hard to break)This mindset on the clients part often presents real problems with getting a legitimate design fee in many cases.
A bulb lit up for me while reading Don Coplens pen tablet post. I would like to propose the following to the two design people at the shop, and would like some feedback before I do.
It would be my idea to put a pen tablet at each station. Rather than going directly into the sign program, it would be my idea for the designer to "rough sketch" the design with the tablet. Getting the basic idea/design in a preliminary form. Then advising the client that it will be further worked up by the design artist and he/she can return to see it.
I know this adds a step to most sales, but it drives me crazy when we don't regularly get a legitimate design fee.
The customer sees the "rough", the designer does his/her magic without the client at his/her shoulder and the percieved/actual difference from "rough" to "finished" should go a long way to justifying the design fee.
Before I started with Gemini, they never charged a design fee. Now they do if I am there to beat them about the head and neck with a 2x4. I just want a way to make it easier to get that fee consistantly.
Comments/criticisms invited...
Irish
-------------------- William "Irish" Holohan Resting...Read "Between Jobs." Marlboro, MA 01752 email: firemap1@aol.com Posts: 1110 | From: Marlboro, MA | Registered: Dec 2001
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posted
Actually a "design fee" is a "no brainer" if you handle it correctly!
Just explain that it costs multiple thousands of dollars for the computer, programs, and equipment...plus...it does take time to design, and time = money! Then I ask ...would they rather go to an Ad Agency and pay thousands of dollars for the same kind of work? If they still complain, I send them to a Quickie Stickie Shop for some "generic" signs!
-------------------- Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
si.allen on Skype
siallen@dslextreme.com
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!
Brushasaurus on Chat Posts: 8831 | From: La Mirada, CA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
To add to Si's accurate summary, there are also the years or decades of design experience, & software experience on top of the actual design time & equipment cost.
But I also agree with William, that no amout of explaining these fundemental realities will change the fact that clients seeing something done in 20 minutes will not like paying $25-$50 & up.
But if they don't get to watch, they may realize that they couldn't have done it if they took a whole day off work & rented a computer at Kinkos, so the fee is easier to live with.
posted
The "why so much" question has been around a lot longer than computers. I've always found the best defense is a good offense. I just turn it around on them. Most times the customer makes more money than me so it's pretty easy. I start by complimenting them on their nice expensive vehicle, then I ask questions about what they do and how is it they can make so much money by re-selling used cars or unclogging drains or whatever it is they do. It always gets real quiet.
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
posted
I did some decals for a friend a few years ago. Everyone was standing around the garage oohing & ahhhing when this one jackass friend of his says "well, the computer does it all". I don't care for this guy anyway & it ended up the laptop was in the truck. I walked out, brought the laptop back int, handed it to him & said "Ok, make the computer do it".
He didn't say a word after that.. for about a week til he very nicely asked me to do some decals for his new truck.
-------------------- Chris Welker Wildfire Signs Indiana, Pa Posts: 4254 | From: Indiana, PA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Letting customers watch you design on a computer is a "No No" !!!!
Sometimes it just can't be helped tho. Had a customer one day who wanted some "minor" alterations done. After 20 minutes of "wouldn't this be better here", "can you put my phone number on it", "what about ..." I finally cracked and said "do you realise this is costing you $2/minute"
Suddenly the layout was just perfect
I don't care if it's a pencil or a computer ... talent and experience don't come cheap.
posted
I had a customer that informed me that she had the same program on her computer. After she watched me for a couple of minutes, she said: " Oh, well my program can't do that! or that! or that! How did you get it to do that?!" she didn't quite understand that the computer and software is just a tool.
I informed her that I had accounting software at home but that did not make me a CPA!
If somebody wants to "watch me" work on a design, I try to confuse them as much as posible by going thru about a hundred different moves!
-------------------- Michael Clanton Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio 1933 Blackberry Conway AR 72034 501-505-6794 clantongraphics@yahoo.com Posts: 1737 | From: Conway Arkansas | Registered: Oct 2001
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posted
had a plumber bring a van and letters, logo & stripes the other the other day and i asked him how much a plumber gets an hour he said $125. i asked how he would feel if i charged him $125.00 per hour to install his letters etc. he said he didn't care so i did.
-------------------- Jimmy Chatham Chatham Signs 468 stark st Commerce, Ga 30529 Posts: 1766 | From: Commerce, GA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I think all design should start with a pencil sketch. The quick sketch lets both parties know if you're understanding each other. There is confidence established through this process. Once this is done then the design deposit is an easy request.
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6812 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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