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I had a brilliant inspiration a few months back. I 'discovered' that Durham's Rock Hard Water Putty makes a wonderful, fast skim-coat filler for HDU signs. I had two large foam signs to prime late one day and we didn't have enough of our usual primer/filler to do the job. But because I am a genius, and impatient, I spied a plausible substitute on the bottom shelf. You know this stuff - mix it up with water to any consistency and brush, squeege, trowel it on. We tried soaking a piece of dried material in a can of water for a few minutes and dont you know it seemed perfectly stable too. So we used it and man it sure does dry fast and sands REAL smooth! Perfect for HDU, hell, we had our first top coat on those puppies before we went home that night. Why didn't anyone think of this before.
Well let me tell you why... Outdoors, over time, this stuff reconstitutes back into a slurry under your paint, making for some very interesting phone calls from clients. "You better come look at this, our sign is peeling in big sheets". OMG, it was like water filled pouches under the surface. The only good news is that the ENTIRE background came off very easily once we got both 14' quarterboards off the roof and back to the shop. Once dry air hit the exposed soppy putty, it quickly rehardened and allowed us to manually sand it completely off the rest of the way down fo bare foam again. Funny, how some time saving maneauvers work out. Aint it.
SONGPAINTER Original Sign Music by Sign People NOW AVAILABLE on CD and the proceeds go to Letterville's favorite charity! Click Here for Sound Clips! Posts: 1974 | From: Orleans, MA, Cape Cod, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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i'm getting more scared by the minute of something like that happening to me...ya know after you've routed a 2 sided big goldleaf job...i'm so paranoid after my 10' restoration that blistered in a bunch of spots on the top plank...i pray that i can learn patience. i'll make a note of the putty thing...thanks for the heads up!
-------------------- Karyn Bush Simply Not Ordinary, LLC Bartlett, NH 603-383-9955 www.snosigns.com info@snosigns.com Posts: 3516 | From: Bartlett, NH USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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That's what you call a big "Oh Shyt!" Joe. Sorry to hear about your problem, and thanks for the heads up.
-------------------- "A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle
Cam Bortz Finest Kind Signs Pondside Iron works 256 S. Broad St. Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379 "Award winning Signs since 1988" Posts: 3051 | From: Pawcatuck,Connecticut USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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And there is something else that works great too. The latex wood fillers, made by DAP or ELMERS make great fillers for HDU. We use a squeege to apply and its ready to paint in a few minutes.
I preferred those more since they are premixed, and you can just use what you need and put the lid back on. They are in those little containers that look like yogert. We have not had any failures.
I have always disliked using the high build primer, but that's just me. Seemed faster to fill those holes with putty and go!
We'll test Durhamns out on an old piece at the shop and see what is gong on.
[ June 07, 2003, 09:43 AM: Message edited by: Dave Draper ]
Just out of curiosity... did you stick your finger into electrical sockets even though your Daddy told you not to just to see what would happen? hahahahahahahaha!
-------------------- Bruce Bowers
DrCAS Custom Lettering and Design Saint Cloud, Minnesota
"Things work out best for the people who make the best of the way things work out." - Art Linkletter Posts: 6451 | From: Saint Cloud, Minnesota | Registered: Jun 1999
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LOL! Thanxs for experiencing that an' savin' me a lot of time an' money!! By the way, I think Durham's is strictly an' interior product.........
-------------------- Signs Sweet Home Alabama
oneshot on chat
"Look like a girl, act like a lady, think like a man, work like a dog" Posts: 5758 | From: "Sweet Home" Alabama | Registered: Mar 2003
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Joe, it probably was water filled pouches under the surface. Was the sign sealed on all sides? What was the finish coat, latex? Moisture obviously got to the putty allowing it to break down. We used a lot of this stuff at one shop I worked at years ago with no problems, but everything was top coated with enamel. I don't work with HDU but I'll file this tip away just in case.
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
posted
The signs were completely skimmed with the putty, then primed all sides & backs with alkyd primer (Zinzer), then two top coats of gloss black Impervo with hardener in it. No idea where the moisture entered, it seemed like everywhere...osmosis? I should add that it took almost 3 months of a very harsh winter for the problem to surface. I should also add that I had some warnings during the fabrication. These were 16" x 14 feet long, and as we moved them around during the carving, I could audible hear the surface 'tink'ing. I now believe it was the putty shattering in fine craze cracks under the topcoats. When they say ROCK hard they arent kidding, no flex at all. I have since been to Durham's web site too, and they plainly warn not to use it for covering broad surfaces. Arrrrgggh.
SONGPAINTER Original Sign Music by Sign People NOW AVAILABLE on CD and the proceeds go to Letterville's favorite charity! Click Here for Sound Clips! Posts: 1974 | From: Orleans, MA, Cape Cod, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I used to use that to fill edge voids in MDO, it didn't work very well. I would think that even if covered with enamel you would want to use an exterior product, as all it takes is a pinhole for water to get underneath.
-------------------- Chuck Peterson Designs San Diego, CA Posts: 1052 | From: San Diego, CA USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Hate to admit but I already beat you to it. I used the Durhams years ago doing what you did and the same thing happened to me. Paint blistered off and I said f89k it. Made a new sign over from scratch and the original still hangs on my shop wall.
Another tip: The Dap spackling compound works very well but make real sure to use the exterior and not the interior. It will do the same thing.
I have always taken risk to experiment and try new things and believe me when I say, mistakes are expensive. But how else will you discover your genius?
-------------------- Bob Stephens Skywatch Signs Zephyrhills, FL
DrCAS Custom Lettering and Design Saint Cloud, Minnesota
"Things work out best for the people who make the best of the way things work out." - Art Linkletter Posts: 6451 | From: Saint Cloud, Minnesota | Registered: Jun 1999
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Don't you want to join bob, Donald, myself, and a host of others in the Wile E. Coyote Super Genius Club? Hahahahahahahahaha! Those ain't flood pants you're wearing, is it? LOL!
-------------------- Bruce Bowers
DrCAS Custom Lettering and Design Saint Cloud, Minnesota
"Things work out best for the people who make the best of the way things work out." - Art Linkletter Posts: 6451 | From: Saint Cloud, Minnesota | Registered: Jun 1999
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I qualify. Put me in that there super genius club. If it for what Donald said, I oughta be president.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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I'll just add my 2 cents. We have had the same problem with Elmers Exterior wood filler. We used to seal MDO edges with that but it seems that they change the formula about a year and a half ago to meet California standards. We now use Tite Bond II with what seems like good sucess so far.
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By the way, I think Durham's is strictly an' interior product.........
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