What is the concensus among my long distance peers about race car lettering. Here locally it seems as though the race teams have run the gammet with all the sign people. Nobody seems to want to work with these guys because they want everything for free, (sponsorship). If any of you are actually making money off these guys, what is your formula? I have sworn off all race cars unless one of the sponsors is my customer and wants me to do it for them, and they pay me themselves.
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3489 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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I'm finishing my last racecar today, and next year, no more! When they call, they are like, "you can put your name on it, too!". Yeah, right. I tell them I don't care if my name is on it, if they want it done, the price is the same with or with out my name on it. And they wait until the last minute to get them done also. I find them to be a real pain in the a$$, for alot of time and no real money. So i have also decided that this is my last year for lettering them. Possibly if i did vinyl also, it might make a difference.....I don't know. There are a few drag racers that I will still do, but they seem to be different from the circle trackers.
-------------------- Kristie Byrnes Paintbrush Graphics 6126 Big Cut Rd. Mt. Carroll, IL 61053 rugbyrnes@hotmail.com (563) 357-7614 Posts: 90 | From: Thomson,IL | Registered: Dec 2002
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most of the race cars around here are pretty much hokey street stock..guys put together a beater and stand around it drinking beeee-a w/ stiffies. they don't have a pot to pi$$ in nevermind paying top dollar for design and recreating logos. not my type of clientel thank you...they always call..can ya come down and look at my car so i can put them sticky things on it fer my sponsors....ah..no but YOU can measure it up, just remember, the horizontal is running sideways the side of the veeeheeeckle. verteekle wood be runnin up and down th' cocksucka. i'll make the sticky things and you and yer buddies can do the rest. seriously tho, i'm sure down in the south where it's big business there's lots of money to be made..it's just not my cup a joe up heee-a in east bum bum nh.
-------------------- Karyn Bush Simply Not Ordinary, LLC Bartlett, NH 603-383-9955 www.snosigns.com info@snosigns.com Posts: 3516 | From: Bartlett, NH USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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It aint any different down here either. Even if they have several sponsors, they have spent all the money on motors, etc. when they get to the signguy. I did one this year, and got paid for it, and thats the only way Ill do it. Thats why Ive only done one. I coulda done ten more if I hadda been a sponsor. Its always funny to me, they think we are stupid enough to fund their hobby for them. haha. yeah.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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Had a guy ask me to do his race car.... me: "Sure, I'll look at it and give you a price. " him: "Well, you should do it for sponsorship. I'd LET you put your name on it." me: after I wiped away the tears from laughing so hard. "I don't do sponsorships" him: "Well, you should, it's good advertising" me: "How do you figure?" him: "well, you get your name on the car, people see it". me: "First, my name goes on every car I do, period. No one I've ever talked to can name 1 job they got from having their name on a race car. I don't need to spend my money on YOUR hobby so 20 of your cheapest friends begging me to do their car free, not the type of advertising I'm looking for." him: "well, I'll just have Ray do it, he does it every year." (This Ray does a ton of race cars, haven't heard of anyone paying him and haven't heard of him doing anything except free race cars) "You're probably not any good anyway" me: "I must be better than your buddy since I actually get paid for what I do. Just remember, you get what you pay for."
bah-bye
I used to do a lot of cars, this year I quit. I quit dealing with people who want me to pay for their hobby instead of food for my table. I quit dealing with people who want 15 sponsors on their car, make it look nice and be able to read all the sponsors from the stands because "Joe gave us a case of beer, we gotta give him good advertising". I quit dealing with "we need to add 1 more sponsor" This year, I did 1 and it wasn't an install. I liked this guy. A friend referred me to him, I did some quicky stickys, handed them to him, he was tickled and when he paid me, he asked "Are you sure that's enough?" I charged a little less than I do for installed jobs, but I didn't spend how long crawling over a car.
-------------------- Chris Welker Wildfire Signs Indiana, Pa Posts: 4254 | From: Indiana, PA | Registered: Mar 2001
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Welcome to the world of Sign People who get educated by Moron Racing People. I do ONE car a year. He has come back year after year. His son has went to an "Edge" shop and the sponsors look good when views from 12 inches on a monitor...ho hum. At first I raised my prices where they should have been, and that "weeded" out most of them. Now the raceteams have their OWN computer or their "girlfriends " letter the car....(Just like the old days when the girlfriend lettered it, they still look like sh*t only they have a plotter and vynull to do it!) If anything productive can come from dealing with these people, ...it's building up a tough skin. It will help you deal with other cheapo's trying to deal with you on sign work.
Another American pastime gone to the cheap commercialization of "The quick buck."
Good Luck and I'm with John, Chris and Karyn...GIVE EM HELL!
-------------------- Mike Meyer Sign Painter 189 1st Ave n P.O. Box 3 Mazeppa, Mn 55956
We are not selling, we are staying here in Mazeppa....we cannot re-create what we have here....not in another lifetime! SO Here we are!!!!!!!
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Hey Karyn..... I kick thoses idiots outta my shop 15 years ago... figures they didn't get down the road very far.
My buddy in the body shop business and I use to give these types a wicked run-a-round years ago.... I once put my shop name upside down with " don't call us we'll call you", damn fools never got the hint.
They were great in the begining years, let you put on any style you want so it was great practice. Now the dragsters and hot rodders are a whole different crowd.... I can't get enuff of those!
-------------------- "No excuses!.... No regrets!..."
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In the 70's and early 80's, Watkins Glen International was the last stop on the Formula 1 circuit. For years I lettered these cars when they came to the "glen". Some of the drivers were Grahm Hill, Jackie Stewart, Niki Lauda, Mario Andretti and so no. I even lettered two cars in Japanese before they went back to Japan. Lettered a ton of other cars at the track in different classes, even spent an afternoon with Paul Newman after doing a quarter panel on his Nissan. All of these jobs paid WELL! I raced myself for 12 years in various cars from dirt late models to NASCAR Modifieds. I letter two cars a year. One is a sprint car for my cousin and the other for a good friend who I barter services with. Other than that I will NOT letter a race car. It seems there are people out there doing them for $200.00. The way I figure it, ther are about six to eight signs on a typical car. When you give them a price they go nuts! They shell out $ 28,000.00 for a motor without blinking an eye, but money for lettering it!!! No way!! I love "I'll put your name on it"! I tell them, "you pay me and I'll put your name on it"! I can loose money two ways........work my butt off or sit and have a "cold one". I pick the "cold one".
-------------------- Tony Vickio The World Famous Vickio Signs 3364 Rt.329 Watkins Glen, NY 14891 t30v@vickiosigns.com 607-535-6241 http://www.vickiosigns.com Posts: 1063 | From: Watkins Glen, New York | Registered: Sep 2001
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How about this: Get ready, it really happened just the other day...
About 3 weeks ago a guy came into the shop. He is local, I know the guy, his wife and 5 kids go to our church. He is holding a squirming 1.5 year old wearing socks and no shoes.
I say hello, what can I do you you today... out of his mouth comes the words "do you ever put your name on race cars?"
Sudden bad vibe.
I say "no, I don't sponsor race cars, I paint them or apply vinyl to them because that is what I do and I get paid for it." Now, I thought that this was a very UP FRONT response that left no doubt as to what it was I meant to say but suddenly it turned into the same type of conversation that I often have with my wife where she explains what I am really thinking or saying.
The guy pulls a cell phone out of his pocket (kid is still squirming) and dials a number... starts talking to someone and then says "here, this guy wants to talk to you."
I grab the phone and say hello, at the same time a woman is dropping off a truck to pinstripe and the shop phone is ringing. Mayhem ensues.
The guy on the cell phone starts talking about 800 miles an hour... I'm getting something about numbers and sponsors and can't we work out a deal if I put my name on it and he has $100.00 (yes, one hundred dollars) invested in this project so far and can't imagine spending much more.......
I say "look, write down everything you want, bring the car over and let me look at it and I'll see what I can do with your limited budget... which won't be much."
He will bring it to the shop that day. The car never shows up. I figure that they will do it themselves or go somewhere else. (I hoped)
The other thing I have neglected to say is that this is the "turd on wheels" class or something like that... like hobby stock but not as good, I think.
So, I hear nothing. Until Thursday of this last week. The guy with the kid comes in again and asks if these other guys (on the cell phone) ever contacted me. I say no. He says he will bring the car in that afternoon. Again, no car and I have other things to take care of.
Friday: I'm taking care of other things when a guy that looked like a messed up "Bluto" from Popeye cartoons and his sidekick, the bizzaro world version of the banjo pickin' freaky boy from Deliverance come bounding through my door... Bluto is smoking a butt.
I don't know if I'm more surprised at the way these two characters look or if I'm just ****ed that someone has the balls to assume you can smoke in here. (Sidebar: I smoke too but I would never walk into any business this way)
Bluto askes if I am ready to do the car (the car I have not seen yet). I say I don't know what you guys want... he turns to the banjo pickin' freaky boy from Deliverance and says "get that notebook."
The freaky boy SQUEALS, spins around and runs out the door to the vehicle to collect the notebook. He SQUEALS again and brings it back into the shop. The freaky boy is twitching and making goofy noises and darting around in the shop. I am getting creeped out by the whole thing and my pressure starts to rise. I looked at the notebook and read through the VOLUMES of crap that they wanted on this car. I said, "and when do you want this?"
GOTTA HAVE IT TOMORROW, WE RACE TOMORROW NIGHT.
This is 10:00 friday morning and I have yet to see this car. The guy says he will bring it in about 30 minutes because it has no brakes and they need to fix them.
I do not normally EVER do this... In fact I can't remember EVER doing it before but I said "Look, You had all FU****G week to get this SOB in here, and you want it tomorrow! It's NOT GOING TO HAPPEN... AND YOU DON'T WANT TO PAY ANYTHING FOR IT! AND I SHOULD CHARGE EXTRA FOR FAST SERVICE!!!
Bluto asks if I can at least get the numbers on it. I say, get it down here and I'm not promising anything.
30 minutes goes by. 60 minutes. 90... Now it's lunch time. I drive down the street to see where these unique individuals are and how they are coming on the brake job. They are finishing it up, they will have the car there by 1:00pm.
It was there. I about puked. Here is an 80's station wagon painted red and black. The new paint job is helping to keep the rust together. It looks like a demo-derby car, not like something you would race on a weekly basis.
I lettered the car. Got everything on there. ALL WHITE. No creativity. Well, maybe some. No ad from me, I would not want my name on this turd anyway.
They pick it up at noon the next day and paid for it, $150.00. Not a lot but I did make out on the deal.
Sunday was Easter, there was a breakfast at the church. My wife and I were seated when the wife of the guy with the squirmy kid sat down next to us. She complimented me on the car and thanked me for being able to get it done on such short notice.
Then she tells me that the car is for the banjo pickin' freaky boy from Deliverance... he will drive it. This guy is her 31 year old brother in law and "he's a little slow." In fact, he does not have a driver's license.
I knew it, I just knew it!!!
No, I don't do race cars.
-------------------- Jeff Vrstal Main Street Signs 157 E. Main Street Evansville, WI 53536 1-608-882-0322 Posts: 670 | From: Evansville, Wisconsin | Registered: Sep 2001
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Ohhh my God Jeff!!! LMAO and having flash backs to working a race car literally in a dirt floor butcher shop, 13 people on the pit crew, whole families watchin' the arteest, and a fist fight over who was going to try it down the road first..... on and on and..... 3 days $75 and all the beer I could drink (I stayed away from the home made hot dogs) .... we gots a lot of them long forehead types back in the woods of my hometown. "mmmmm.... you gotta mighty purdy mouth on you...." still gives me goose bumps
-------------------- "No excuses!.... No regrets!..."
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Vrstal, did you steal that story from the Lenny series?
I know where you're coming from. I don't do race cars. I did help out at a local track last summer. I think every sign wannabe who wants to letter race cars and every racer who knows what his number *has* to look like, should be forced to do scoring just once. Gives you a whole new outlook. You're suppost to right down the cars, in the order they cross the line. (ok, go-karts). My scoring sheet went something like 37-12-42-13-77x-b (blue stands for the blue one with hieroglyphics where the number oughta be).
-------------------- Chris Welker Wildfire Signs Indiana, Pa Posts: 4254 | From: Indiana, PA | Registered: Mar 2001
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i live 1 mile from pensacolas FIVE FLAGS SPEEDWAY. most of the big named winston cup boys ran this track one time or another. the 1st yr i moved here i got all the track work, paintin the inside retainer wall with 3x10 foot logos. they had some 12x24' billboards did a couple of them with paint. and being at the track.....you get to meet all the drivers. well most have there own vinyl cutter!!!!!! those that dont got some schmuck with a vinyl cutter who is the sponsor of the race car. i had a banner outside my shop(was on the way to the track) HAND LETTER STOCK CARS $125.00. i got one car to do...that didnt want me to sponsor them!!! i can do a car with with paint, 3 numbers, 3 colors, and 2 sponsors, free hand....in about 3 hours!!!! so at $125 iam makin spendin money!!! this last 2 years i havent done any!!!!!
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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It seems as though the concensus is unanimus! And, if I can quote "Moron Race Team" is everywhere in the US and Canada. And here all this time we thought they were a small organization! I swore off race cars and the darrell's that go with them. Thanks for your input
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3489 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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ahhhhh, memories. I could write a book about dealing with racers----in fact, racing's what got me into the biz----OneShot'ing entire cars with splashy paintjobs and lettering. Then a vinyl cutter. Then an EDGE---and so on, and so on...
Racer's want it for free, want it fast, and want it good. Or, if they do agree to pay (cheap), you'll be waitin' months for the money---funny how they can always find money for gas to put in the tow vehicle or for a new set of tires, but can't pay your darned $500 bill till say October November when maybe the prize money cheque from the banquet might cover it, if they don't drink their cheque that night!
"Does the paint have to be dry for you to put the stickers on?" was always one of my favourite questions.
Why would you want to put your name on a racecar, so that more of the damned racing types can find you???
Anyways, my experience with racers' wasn't all bad----did some cool EDGE work for years with the Player's Indy Team, etc. But that was a one-in-a-million opportunity.
As frustrating as they are, remember, everyone starts somewhere. Guy I know in Indianapolis used to 'donate' shirts to Ryan Newman as a sponsorship deal---about 40-50 shirts a year. They guy now does ALOT of work for Penske.
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We quit doing race cars quite a few years ago but at one time we did up to 20 a year....do NOT miss them at all. Things that others haven't mentioned that I always "enjoyed" (I'm being sarcastic here!) 1. They would bring all the information written on the cardboard for the inside of a 12 pack. 2. We would letter the car and then they would "notice" that one of the sponsors names were misspelled. "Well, I figerred you'd look all them names up to see if they was spelled right!" 3. Having them drive up in a $300.00 pick-up truck with 2 small children standing up in the seat (no seat belts, of course) as they drove in and squealed to a halt. The $2000.00 worth of new tires that they bought for the racer are in the back. They've come to pick up the racer and "dog-gone it, I've forgot my wallet! Can I git the money too you next month. We are going to race and when we win that one we can pay ya!" THAT"S WHY WE DON"T DO ANY RACE CARS!
-------------------- Bill Diaz Diaz Sign Art Pontiac IL www.diazsignart.com Posts: 2107 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Dec 2001
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quote:suddenly it turned into the same type of conversation that I often have with my wife where she explains what I am really thinking or saying.
Too funny.
The only experience I have is "getting" to cut sponser decals and stripes for my brother-in-laws racing ski-doo. Once he gave me $10.00 for my troubles. He was happy to tell me his buddies thought I did a great job, and he might be able to "swing a little business my way". I keep telling him no thanks.
Suelynn
-------------------- "It is never too late to be what you might have been." -George Eliot
Suelynn Sedor Sedor Signs Carnduff, SK Canada Posts: 2863 | From: Carnduff, SK Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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We have a dirt track about 3 miles from my shop. I use to do lots of cars and had some of the same experiences mentioned above.I was wondering if jeff's customers had driven all the way here when I read his reply. Boy did it bring back memories. Now I will do race car "decals" and let them put them on. I do a fair amount of go-carts. They don't take that long to do and they haven't gotten as bad as the dirt guys. I just finished a drag car yesterday, and will continue to do his. He has never asked me how much it will be, and I get my check about 3-5 days after I'm done. He owns a commercial masonry business. I have used shade shifter and signgold on his cars in the past. He picks out what he likes and I charge him fairly for it. Compare what you get for a 4x8 double sided sign, and what racers wants to pay. They about the same size area wise, but the car takes alot more time in design and application.
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After turning a few away who wanted their car done for free if I put my name on them, I finally did my first car last year. The charge was over $700 and the car won the "best looking car" contest...$1000 prize. I then lettered this guy's brother's car for about $400 but not as much stuff on it. The first guy brought the left rear quarter panel back a few weeks later for me to redo then brought the car back again this year with all new panels. His brother also brought his car back and wanted his duded up fancy this time.
The same car won the $1000 prize again for best looking car. The second brother's car had blown an engine in a previous race and missed being in the contest. I made over $1600 to do both cars this year...and put my company logo on them as well.
Joe, these guys race at a track over your way....Milton.
[ April 22, 2003, 05:45 PM: Message edited by: Wayne Webb ]
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7404 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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A lot of this depends on the *class* of racer you're dealing with. here, it's all dirt track cars. These are one step above the demolition derby cars.
-------------------- Chris Welker Wildfire Signs Indiana, Pa Posts: 4254 | From: Indiana, PA | Registered: Mar 2001
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We live around 5 km past a race track, lots of folks around here race a variety of cars. One of the younger guys in our Volunteer Fire Department (I'm the training officer) asked me to letter his demo truck in exchange for advertising space. Business being fairly slow, and he lives very close to our place I said sure. Created 6 sets of decals in intermediate white, and dry applied them to a freshly painted truck. An hour and a half of my time, and he bought the beers. My logo in full colour on the hood. Even loaned him my portable gas powered air compressor for the races. After the first race ( he came in fourth) he said some of his buddies wanted my company decals for their trucks too. These trucks have their sponsors hand painted using a corn broom. I said 'NNNOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!. Two days later he phones again, his buddies will hand paint my logo on their trucks. Now I'm ****ed to say the least. I tell him in no uncertain terms that they have no right to apply my logo to their vehicle, and if they will not listen to him, I will personally demo their trucks before their next race. Nice kid but not too bright. I guess my first race vehicle will probably be my last. Enjoying the posts.
-------------------- "Are we having fun yet?" Peter Schuttinga DZines Sign Studio 1617 Millstream rd Victoria BC V9B-6G4 Posts: 521 | From: Victoria BC | Registered: Mar 2002
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Sh** Jeff. You made me blow pop out my nose.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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"Whatcha pay fer that engine?" "Ten grand, and its a woozie!" "Whatcha pay fer them tires?" "Two grand, and theys worth every penny!" "Whatcha pay fer that body?" "Three grand, and it were a steal!" "How much you wanta spend on the lettering?" "SPEND?! Ima gonna let you put yer name on it real big sos the fans can see it when I goes by at 110 miles an hour. You'll get all kinds o' business offa this here car! By the way, kin you put my five kids, my wife, and my two dogs name on the back panel? THeys my pit crew. Damn fine ones too! And could you get right on it? We gotta race tonight and I need it done by five o clock. It are free fries night at the race park." "Wow! You mean you're gonna let me do all the lettering on that fine car,and I even get to put my name on it too! SHEEIITTTT! Bring it on in here and lets get started! Ill get my little kids to get started on it. There only five and six, but love to paint." "Yore kids! Why, they aint even big enough to reach where I want my pit crew put on at, and they haint got no skills doing race cars have they? Theys too young!" "Maybe so bubba, but round here, they're the only ones that'll work for free, basically. You just gotta keep em in candy and pop. Ill even throw in my nephew pete. After his nap that is, hes just turned three. Hes reallll mean with a house brush and latex paint. Gotta be careful though, he tends to wanta paint with the doody outa his diapers sometimes." "Uhhhhhhhhh....Shoot! You had me going thar fer a minute you rascal! Hahahahaha! Boy, you shore had me a thinking thar fer a spell, and, hey, whats thet thar Petes a putting on my car? Lordy, lordy, hes a lettering it with doody! We gotta go! Lord help me, my cars a smelling like powdered poop! "Yall come back now, ya here?"
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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Dana is really angry at you! It's your fault I just spit out my coffee.
Hey, no one else wants to accept the responsibility of their actions, why should I?
-------------------- Bruce Bowers
DrCAS Custom Lettering and Design Saint Cloud, Minnesota
"Things work out best for the people who make the best of the way things work out." - Art Linkletter Posts: 6451 | From: Saint Cloud, Minnesota | Registered: Jun 1999
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I do all types of race cars: round-track, go karts, sportsman drag cars, professional drag cars, and drag bikes. I do their trailers, their t-shirt designs, their giveaway stuff.
However, what makes it worthwhile is telling them UP FRONT "I don't sponsor, we are going to do things ON A SCHEDULE, and you WILL pay this much"
I don't get a lot of the type of business everyone here talks about. I used to. When I started instituting my "10 minute" rule, I began weeding out the cheap, irresponsible ones. If they are not "serious" within 10 minutes, I move on to my next project. Even if they are still standing there, I move on.
I still get new ones every year. Round track racers want 3 numbers, 2 sponsors and everybody's name for $150 tomorrow. Go Karts want the same, but for $50. Sportsman racers always wait til the last minute to get their numbers, and then want you to travel 50 miles to install $70 worth of decals. Pro drag racers always wait til the last minute, want everything PERFECT, BUT....they do PAY!!! Drag Bikes are as bad as dirt-track round track racers. I've dealt with more of these than anybody, BECAUSE I used to LOVE motorcycles and motorcycle drag racing. It didn't take but five years, three sponsorships, two FREE paint jobs, and TONS of decals to learn the ultimate lesson: SIGN SHOPS don't benefit from putting 'ya sticka on tha side of my byk'...
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I do a lot of race jetskis and you get lots of the same story, lots of people wanting the piece of the pie in a sport that isn't generating any income for anyone, not even the professional riders (well, most of them anyway, a few are independently wealthy)..
So here's my deal:
1. My name goes on everything whether you paid full retail for it or if I was generous enough to give a break.
2. If I give you a break, this is how things are gonna go. You are going to sign this here contract which legally binds you to my terms. My terms are 20% off Retail and you have until the second week of October (the jetski World Finals) to send in 8 referrals (average 1 referral per race weekend in any given race region - easy target). If you don't fulfil the referral quota (I said *8*, not *7*!), you owe me the other 20%.
3. Nobody gets anything from me at no cost and anyone that tells you they did is a liar. The absolute bare minimum I'll let out the door is material cost plus markup.
4. Your other sponsors pay for their logos, I'm not producing free advertising for THEM too!!
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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........all these stories are great...lol. Guess I never really tho't about anyone else havin' to deal with the same craziness I've seen here in my little piece of hickdom, LOL. One of the last really fun cars I got to do for a guy was a lemon yellow camero(dragster). . . he let me shoot the works an' paid well too, for cartoons all around an' fades on the lettering . . . I even worked 'til like midnight in his shop while they were tinkerin' an' braggin' on how fast it would run . . . a coupl'a days later I stopped by to see how the big race went . . .well, it never left the shop . . . seems shortly after I'd left someone rev'ed it up an' drove the drive shaft thru the floor board. Oh well, at least I got paid!! The dirt trackers, have all decided they like the "stickers" that BamaBudwieser "cuts out" for them, apparantly fer free . . .They say I'm just too high-priced. . . .for somethin' that's gonna get tore up an' rolled over, I say so too. But I still like to go watch 'em tear 'em up!!
-------------------- Signs Sweet Home Alabama
oneshot on chat
"Look like a girl, act like a lady, think like a man, work like a dog" Posts: 5758 | From: "Sweet Home" Alabama | Registered: Mar 2003
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Its good to know these tight fisted idiots exist all over the world, same questions, same language, different accent, was asked by one of these blokes "whats the cheapest signs you do" "heres a tin of dried up paint and a brush with 3 bristles, you can have 'em for free, now **** OFF!" Although I did do a HIAB recovery vehicle for one guy, "can you copy my other truck mate?" "Yessss" "So and so airbrushed it for me, only charged me 50 quid (£s) but I did have to buy the paint for him" "so why are you asking me to do it then?" "Ah well he's working in a packhouse now" (this means this fella is standing in a line of people putting letucce and other salads into plastic bags for sale on the chill counters of supermarkets for 10 hours a day) "how much are you gonna charge me?" "£300 mate, I have no intention of making salads for Wal-Mart" I thought this tosser was going to pass out, he went pale, "how much if I let you put your name on it?" "£400" was my reply, hee hee took him a while to figure that one, but I did it got the £300 and never saw him again.
-------------------- Steve Broughton Alpha Grafix Signs Lowfields Road Benington, Boston Lincolnshire, England Posts: 315 | From: Boston, Lincolnshire, England | Registered: Aug 2001
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Yep, been going through the usual race car thing again this Spring. Of course you have to deal with these guys during the busiest 2 months of the year. I made the mistake of lettering a bunch of cars for free, or next to free when I first started out. My ex and I owned a mudracer called the Mudshark and that really put me in the middle of the, "I'll let you put your name on my car if you letter it for free" group. I did get a lot of practice and gained speed and accuracy by doing all of these cars, but I have paid for it for years now trying to get rid of these guys. Anymore I say, "Wow! you can afford to race? I barely make enough money to pay my bills, sorry, I can't afford to donate to your HOBBIE"
I do have a few good customers that don't expect me to donate or sponsor, but too much time is wasted explaining to the cheapies why I won't work for free.
Oh yeah, I did the Mudshark logo in gold leaf one time (because that is what the ex wanted) and of course it was a rush job and I pulled an all nighter on it. Did the finishing touches as they were loading it on the trailer to go racing. He called that night to tell me how good the gold leaf looked until they rolled the car during the first pass. He was laughing. Guess I should have made him pay for the gold leaf, he wouldn't have been laughing so much.
Just be careful when getting involved with the sponsor jobs. They will come back to haunt you.
Pam, Pam's Signs
-------------------- Pam Eddy Niles, MI ple@qtm.net Posts: 460 | From: Michigan | Registered: Dec 2000
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I do about 20 to 25 racecars per year. Some of them are a real pain in the a**. But so are alot of the other jobs I get. On average I get about $300-$350 per car doing vinyl lettering (sometimes painting if time permits). (These are all dirt track cars) I actally kinda like doing them. The ones that get the best deal are the ones that let me do what I want. That way I have the say on how much I think I can charge them. This is when I can really use any kind of colors, techniques, and can try stuff out because lets face it, they don't stay pretty for very long. And if they wreck bad enough I get to do it twice, so its repeat business. And yes I am making money off them.
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.... we gots a lot of them long forehead types back in the woods of my hometown.![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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Although I did do a HIAB recovery vehicle for one guy, "can you copy my other truck mate?" "Yessss" "So and so airbrushed it for me, only charged me 50 quid (£s) but I did have to buy the paint for him" "so why are you asking me to do it then?" "Ah well he's working in a packhouse now" (this means this fella is standing in a line of people putting letucce and other salads into plastic bags for sale on the chill counters of supermarkets for 10 hours a day) "how much are you gonna charge me?" "£300 mate, I have no intention of making salads for Wal-Mart"
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