I too have been reading the numerous posts on competing with shops who undercut you and I think if one is to survive, a simple answer exists!
Preface:
I just came into the "Letterhead" fold 2 years ago. I started my company 7 years ago as a wholesale manufacturer to sign shops for dimensional signs. My clients were mostly those franchise shops which most show disdain for including myself now!
I got so tired of dealing with these 7/hour "CSR's"(customer service reps) and made a descision to go direct to the client in the summer of last year. The reason for this switch was because all of the business I was loosing due to their inability to sell the creative service I could offer and because of their lack of knowledge and care whether they sold it or not.
When I made that move, I already had samples of my work but I felt I needed something to drive a distinct wedge between myself and the competition.
After having attended my first meet at Fred's last year, I became enthralled with the phenomenal talent that "sign" folks had and their willingness to share. The light bulb went off! This was the wedge I was looking for!
I have said this many times in the past before offering sign products and continue to say it now...I am a conceptual designer and graphical artist and it just so happens that 85% of my work is in signs and graphics. I just use this venue to pay for my more creative work...(it pays the bills)
but....I show many samples of it!...since Fred's I have dug very deep spending money and time to create the largest "wedge" I can afford...not in marketing or printed advertising but in learning ( as mentioned in the other posts)and investing in things that no "quickie sticky shop" can come close to or have produced by someone else... These shops are driven by money...not by craft and we are replacing a sign made by a Fastsigns right now that most of you would throw up on...My twist is to have the owner post a photo of the old sign next to a photo of our sign and post it in her lobby(which she agreed to do)
Going to a meet as Monte said is critical to our survival!..not just the fun had but the vast amount of knowledge that one will learn and it will make you more money than you are making now.
I have spent a fortune on gold leaf and have I sold any?...NO!..not yet but the doors that my work has opened have been tremendous...people ask why..there is not a demand...my answer to that is...just go into Fred Self's shop...just the crafstmanship on the wall is enough to tell the client that if the price is fair, he will get the work(no matter what it is)....and it has done the same for me! It has also given me ideas for products outside of signs that I am getting ready to produce because of that knowledge I have aquired!
If I had one wish right now...it would be that the talented folks on this board and folks like Fred came together and created a commercialized entity that educates the public of what a letterhead is...maybe a brochure that is given to clients that explains who we are and what our purpose of existence is and the difference between a Letterhead and your local sign shop! One must create that wedge!
We have as large a body of folks stretched across the world as Fastsigns, and we should take advantage of it...outside of the "sign industry" That was the intent of my "jam" next year...education...and letting folks know that such an animal exists!
This may all sound corny to most of you but I have already started to create my own vision of what the future will bring and I am going to tell you right now that it is working for me and I am excited!
We are hosting our first ever open house next week and I have been working like a dog to prepare more samples and concepts to show folks when they arrive...and an email RSVP from one of the most respected environmental graphics design companies in the world is as excited to come as we are to have them come!...
Is that not your dream?...It sure as hell is mine!
So...get to a meet...there are folks there that will help you...I am a product of that!
And I will end by saying there are a few that have helped me that I hope will continue to come and share their experience. Without you, this movement does not continue for which I am one person that is eternally grateful! A special thank you to:
Si Allen Fred Self Pat King Rick Glawson
and I hope this list continues to grow and who knows...maybe one day someone will add me to their list!
Got to go get ready for my trip to Fred's next week for some more edumacatin! See ya at a meet soon!
-------------------- Robert Beverly Arlington, Texas Posts: 1033 | From: Arlington, Texas | Registered: Jan 2001
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Robert, I don't think someone else could represent me nor vise versa. I do understand the high emotion of sharing the excitement of craft, quality and high end product and do want to educate the possible clientelle of the bigger world than what they know. I just think for me to show a brouchure with the work of someone else or explaining the attitude of someone else would accuratly describe what they might get from me.
Perhaps I'm not getting the picture?
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6814 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Howdy My reference was not on photos....just a verbal insight as to who we are and what we represent..as well as the commitment we have to our craft.....
What is a letterhead and what consitutes same.
Just something that draws a network of like folk together...
-------------------- Robert Beverly Arlington, Texas Posts: 1033 | From: Arlington, Texas | Registered: Jan 2001
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HI Robert...I understand what it is you propose but the Letterhead movement has never been and should never be "for sale" ...It 's about learning from or teaching your peers.
It has never been nor should it ever be about promoting ones self nor their business.
Exchanging ideas and experiencing one another on a one to one basis...creating friendships and reaping the benifits that those friendships represent is one thing but exploiting the "Letterhead" name, in my opinion would be a slap in the face of everything "we" stand for.
The "Letterhead" movement has never had any formal orginization yet it has made its way around the world...anyone that would try to organize it would only end up killing its spirit and when the spirit's gone so is the movement.
I like your idea of pulling different crafts together for the benifit of all...I just disagree on the promotion of such a plan to the general public under the "Letterhead" name.
Just the way I see it...I suspect there are many others here that see it much the way I do as I've been in this same conversation many, many times over the years...yet fortunately the movement is still a "free spirit".
Here's hoping it remains that way!
-------------------- "Werks fer me...it'll werk fer you"
posted
I say Bravo to Robert's inspirational post!
I find many things he said to be an excellent description of what I have come to identify with the un-official family of letterheads.
Maybe one thing was said that goes off on an original tangent, but that is a small part of the positive comments that make robert's post as inspirational as I see it.
As for that one comment:
quote: If I had one wish right now...it would be that the talented folks on this board and folks like Fred came together and created a commercialized entity that educates the public of what a letterhead is...maybe a brochure that is given to clients that explains who we are and what our purpose of existence is and the difference between a Letterhead and your local sign shop!
I think I get the idea to be similar to an architect with the rights to add the A.I.A to his title, or people proud to identify their "Shriners" affiliation, or Rotary Club, or Christianity even.
I know that is quite a diverse collection of comparisons, but I see it as a chance to say that part of the development of myself in this craft that I get through my involvement with letterheadsis realizing a code of ethics, or a mission statement that is greater then the sum of it's parts. How these ideals are seen, interpreted, or put into practice may differ among us all, but I would be proud to impart to my clients the ideals that inspire me from within our ranks.
The trouble is that it's probably nearly impossible to do, even to one who wants to grasp it, and most clients wouldn't care.
posted
I forgot to mention that I think a close equivalent to at least some of the intent in Roberts "brochure" idea will be having the panel-swap piece on display, & when asked, the reply that "no, I didn't do that" would probably be followed with a faraway wistful look & a failed attempt to put into words this elusive, yet tangible, comraderie.
I don't have to commercialize the letterhead movement to further my business. My growth has been due to my hard work and my willingness to learn...BUT...The Letterhead movement has given me an edge that I might otherwise not have!
SO!
For those of you that are listening to the intent of my message..I am not saying to go out and change your name or commercialize the movement for the sake of getting business. I am saying go learn what others have been taught and are willing to share...Make samples that use those skills aquired and educate the end client on what makes you so unique!
You will not see a Franchise shop sign with a smalted sign background, flamed pole or an airbrushed plex insert for a can. Then when asked, bombard them with the details of what it took to do it...and what makes your work more unique...That is what a Letterhead embodies...
A recent client came in and after discussing his project, he asked...OK...what are you working on new?...because everytime he comes over, I have something crazy and unique to show...whether it be concept or design...which gives him the profound sense that I can service his needs no matter what it is!
Good Luck!
-------------------- Robert Beverly Arlington, Texas Posts: 1033 | From: Arlington, Texas | Registered: Jan 2001
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the wedge you speak of is another way of saying you've found the customers who can perceive the value of quality signage.
there are a lot of people who only want good enough -- they either don't understand what a quality sign can do for them, or they have such a small need that they really don't need anything more than a quickie. these are the people who ask why a $25 coroplast sign costs "so much". trying to educate those people is very expensive. its so much more satisfying to find the people who already understand that their business is worth the best signage they can acquire. those people are the ones who pick up on your enthusiasm when you show them something new -- they may not understand it, but they can sense it.
you cant really explain the letterhead movement to most people (customers OR sign makers)... you just have to live it. sort of like spiritual practice -- when you reduce it to words, it starts to lose something.
keep up the good work, and the light of your passion will draw the right people.
-------------------- :: Scooter Marriner :: :: Coyote Signs :: :: Oakland, CA :: :: still a beginner :: :: Posts: 1356 | From: Oakland (and San Francisco) | Registered: Mar 2001
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Your ideas come through loud and clear! Thanks to Scooter we can read it in a few short sentences, but the message was not lost. This is the kind of stuff (positive thinking) that keeps me all fired up.
But none the less...Thank you, everyone for being sharing and considerate, and making this the coolest craft in the world.
"We were living, we were giving, that's how we kept what we gave away." N.Young
-------------------- Alan Ackerson LetterWorks Design and Graphics alan@ack2.com Posts: 776 | From: Oak Ridge, NJ | Registered: Aug 2002
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I agree with Robert and so many others who essentially say the same thing. And I agree with Monte when he says it should stay independant.
There are so many diferent of sign bussinesses that not one could agree on how to make a perfect sign. But every one will agree that we want to get paid and be respected by our clients.
As I stated in a previous post if we could develop a marketing model in some way to start a customer education program.
The "business" problems of sign business is so similiar to the Martial Art business it is almost staggering. Like the Letterheads, the martial art group did not want to "commercialize". You could go to a martial art seminar and hear and see the exact same words, problems and desires. Teh only difference between the two is ...Just change the words "martial arts" to "signs".
ITs Dejavue. A number of years ago most martial art programs were in dusty back street run down buildings. Today they are operated on main streets and the average operation is grossing at least 15 grand a month with some over 100,000 / month. All without "selling out".
The group I started with went from just 150 loations to now it is ove 1400 locations in USA, Canada, OZ and Great Britian.
How they did it was to build a business model that did not interfer with thier personal philosophy and agendas. They tapped into a huge pool of knowledge from within, and developed a marketing program that they all use. They hold meets across the US were they pass on "knowledge" just as Letterheads do.
Today the model includes a complete comprehensive step by step system starting with a advertizing to the first phone call all the way to the signing of a contract.
And like I said. All of this was done without selling out..
Now before anyone says Sign business is not like martial art your right. The technial aspects are not the same. However, the marketing is.
The talent in the letterhead group is mindboggling. But, there are so many reinventing the wheel. So many duplicating the work that so many others have already done. A quantum leap is at hand. All it will take is a very easy paradigm shift. The work is already done. The development money is already spent.
That is an answer. The Letterhead group will gain power, and influence. Yet remain completly independant.
A secrete. It was said " it won't work for us. We are so different from all other bussniesss." Many still say that. But, the very same marketing experts that held huge corporations as clients applied the exact same techniques used in the huge corporations. The result is a thriving bussiness group that holds conventions every year with over 1500 owners in attendance. Time was when the suppliers would dictate terms. Now, the suppliers come to the conventions and ask " what can we do"...
And finally, The end result is that customer no longer come to a martial art program dictating terms and beggin for more for less. Now the Business owner tells the customer how it will be.
That is what is in it for us in the letterhead group.
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5278 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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As my CPA brother and myself read this post. It comes to agreement that an accountant does the same thing as a CPA. A "Trial Lawyer" does the same thing as a Public defender. An ARCHITECH does the same thing as a draftsman. The reason that the distinction between these,and other "groups" Is the "Cream of the Crop" sharing between each other what they have in common,pertaining to thier vocations! The BEST creative move,business move,and friendship move I have ever made..... was to become involved with the Letterhead movement. To write down the difference and diversity of the craftsmanship involved with creating the Cut Above Advertising we do for our customers,is in NO WAY WRONG for the sign business in general. Or of the "Letterhead Movement" in perticular as Keepers of our Craft! If think that something on these lines are not the way it should be...then progress in any area of life should stay the same also. It has ALWAYS been up to me,to produce quality work in my marketing area that is noticebly different from the rest of the sign companies here in Birmingham AL. and will be the FIRST to inform people that there is an entire country/world of the same type of sharing sign makers out there that are belived to be DEAD. Heck these people are AMAZED that WE have "A BOOK" in which to reffer to for prices. We all hoop and hollar about how we need to EDUCATE the public about signs..Why not educate them about the sign makers also? I do it anyway. I do not "ride" on any others coat tails I am,and will be ALWAYS proud to call my self a "Dixie Letterhead"
Thanks Robert
-------------------- PKing is Pat King The Professor of SIGNOLOGY Posts: 3113 | From: Pompano Beach, FL. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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To me your post was about the importance of educating the consumer.
We have built our whole marketing program around the importance and benefits that people achieve when they have a properly designed sign. We are constantly educating. We talk about the use of proper design principles and how much more effective their sign will be when they use "our" principles. We have called our program, Sign Science. We use statistics to show people how much more money they can make with a properly designed sign.
We believe that the more that the consumer is educated that they will be drawn to the company that was the proponent of the message.
We are using the same wedge you describe to differentiate ourselves from everyone else. So, I whole heartedly agree with your concept.
-------------------- Richard Swartz DeNyse Signs 4521 Industrial Access Road Douglasville, GA 30134 Posts: 102 | From: Douglasville, GA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I often receive emails from people that want to respond but remain anonymous and I beleive this email is one that should be shared!
Hey Robert,
You definately get it and youv'e gone past the rest who are clouded by misunderstanding. I have faith in your meaning about progressive advancement using a clear base of knowledge to motivate growth. Yer on it my friend.......don't turn back!
Good Luck,
So as I travel down this exciting road of rediscovery and professional positioning, I encourage those of you that worry about loosing your ability to compete in today's market to layout out all of those things that you offer right now...take inventory and select an area(that your competition cannot provide) that would blow your clients perception of a sign product and get to a meet and learn more about it!
Here are a couple of examples that I have recently seen!
My visit to the Ponchatoula Meet was exciting when I look on a Talented Timi creating that safe for the drawing or a painting being added to text to describe a local restaurant...
but a commercial product that I see coming in very handy when competing against someone on banner work (which I do very little of) was the sample that Artee had of the banner for the meet! He explained his profit on his banners are much higher than most because he airbrushes fades/shadows and other "highlight elements that the normal vinyl shop cannot do. Yes...Artee is an airbrushin fool...but everytime I have seen Artee at a meet, his willingness to share what he knows has always been evident!
Or...my visit to Fred's last March was my very first time that I ever applied Gold Leaf. Here I sit with all of these "expensive" books of leaf...not wanting to screw it up and the Training books don't take away the discomfort!...so I intentionally brought something with me to leaf...I ask Fred (who does leaf work but as host was unable to help) who can help me?...well...sittin in the corner visitin was an ole boy not doin nothin...His name was Si Allen...I knew of Si from the board but was hesitant in asking him for help...Si jumped up in his furvor...took me under his wings and I walked away from that meet with a comfort level that I did not have before going...and yes...Si again was at Ponchatoula again assisting someone in the application of leaf...
As I said earlier in my post, I am not learning leaf work to make money...if it happens...that is great...but the reason I fell in love with it is because it is so beautiful and it is something that you just don't find in this populated area of 10 million people. Potential clients walk in and see this stuff and it sets them in awe!...I got em after that!...no matter what they buy!
And yes....I am asked often "Where the hell did you learn all of this stuff?" at which time I tell him about a special group called Letterheads. A like minded group of Si Allens that have a knowledge they willingly share to keep some of the historically used applications alive! This impresses them even more because of my continued willingness to be the best!
I BELEIVE THAT ONE DAY, THIS TYPE OF WORK WILL RE-EMERGE AS THE DOMINANT EMPHASIS OF WHAT A TRUE SIGN MAKER WILL BE CALLED ON TO PERFORM! THE REST(BANNERS, COROPLAST ETC.) OF THE WORK THAT CONSTITUTES THE BASE FOR QUICKIE STICKY SHOPS WILL BECOME SO CHEAP THAT EVERYONE WILL BE DOING THEIR OWN IN-HOUSE.
I AM PREPARING FOR THAT DAY!...AND IF YOU WISH TO STAY IN VISUAL GRAPHICS WITH VERBAGE ATTACHED, I SUGGEST YOU GET IT WHILE THE GETTINS GOOD!
-------------------- Robert Beverly Arlington, Texas Posts: 1033 | From: Arlington, Texas | Registered: Jan 2001
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I'm with you all the way, Robert - it's high time the public and business community found out about The LetterHeads. I only wish I shared your enthusiasm about it. The problem as I see it is in finding those people that DON'T look at your work and say "I can get a much cheaper one down the road." I'd like to open a shop right next door to the Q-S up the street from me and let folks see the differences In Their Face.
Next = The Sign Police !
Posts: 1859 | From: / | Registered: Nov 1998
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