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I have started to do some research on smalts, and this is what I am finding out. This is what has been read, and not tried, as of yet, but I am working on a piece right now that is going to be multi colored...
In my research, the Black Beauty does come out black, but there isn't UV protectants, so it turns to a dark gray after time.
There is a material called Frit, which is a glass material, that comes in several different textures. Fine, Medium, and Course...This a glass material that is designed to be melted to make stained glass.
I started looking online, and found it sold on Ebay for a couple of dollars an ounce, but when you get a pound of it, your quickly up to $32 a pound.
I was directed to a place that has wholesale accounts, but for them to sell it to you, you have to buy $700 the first order, and several hundred dollars more a year. Not really feasible.
I did fill out an application with the company prior to seeing the requirements, and the rep emailed me back, and even though they couldn't bend the buy in policy he supplied me several suppliers.
-------------------- Mark Kottwitz Kottwitz Graphics Ridgely, MD www.SeeMySignWork.com -------------------------- Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein Posts: 746 | From: Ridgely, MD | Registered: Oct 2000
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Mark; A frit is a combination of minerals mixed and fired to fusing temp and then ground. They are used in ceramics to help certain combinations of minerals in glazes that would not make it to higher temps. Frequently it involves special colors, but the color a frit is does not really show what it will be at firing temp. I would guess that they are quite stable in your intended use.
-------------------- Gerald Barlow Artworx Turlock, CA
95380 artworx@bigvalley.net Posts: 198 | From: Turlock, CA 95380, USA | Registered: Dec 2002
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You're both right. Frit: definition A frit is a ceramic composition that has been fused in a special fusing oven, quenched to form a glass, and granulated. Frits form an important part of the batches used in compounding enamels and ceramic glazes; the purpose of this pre-fusion is to render any soluble and/or toxic components insoluble by causing them to combine with silica and other added oxides.[1] However, not all glass that is fused and quenched in water is frit, as this method of cooling down very hot glass is also widely used in glass manufacture.
According to the OED, the origin of the word "frit" dates back to 1662 and is "a calcinated mixture of sand and fluxes ready to be melted in a crucible to make glass". Nowadays, the unheated raw materials of glass making are more commonly called "glass batch".
In antiquity, frit could be crushed to make pigments or shaped to create objects. It may also have served as an intermediate material in the manufacture of raw glass. The definition of frit tends to be variable and has proved a thorny issue for scholars. In recent centuries, frits have taken on a number of roles, such as biomaterials and additives to microwave dielectric ceramics. Frit in the form of alumino-silicate can be used in glaze free continuous casting refractories.
Now that makes the definition of frit clear as pea soup.
That out of the way, Mark, are you going to order up some samples to see what it looks like? I would think that glass colored for stained glass would have a very permanent color and should hold up very well. And this frit is at almost half the cost of smalts, except for black. For some reason black frit is more than double the price of black smalts. Sure wish there was a way to do accelerated weather testing on this stuff.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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That out of the way, Mark, are you going to order up some samples to see what it looks like? I would think that glass colored for stained glass would have a very permanent color and should hold up very well. And this frit is at almost half the cost of smalts, except for black. For some reason black frit is more than double the price of black smalts. Sure wish there was a way to do accelerated weather testing on this stuff.
I am. I am working on a display sample with at least 6 colors... When I finish I think it will be impressive.
-------------------- Mark Kottwitz Kottwitz Graphics Ridgely, MD www.SeeMySignWork.com -------------------------- Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein Posts: 746 | From: Ridgely, MD | Registered: Oct 2000
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I bought black smalts and some colored from Letterhead sign supply. (One of Letterville merchants). It has been on my business sign ,facing the sun, foe 20 years. And no fading. it has been washed 1time. still looks great. Ron Purcell. 800-531-3359. California
Diane
-------------------- Balch Signs 1045 Raymond Rd Malta, NY 12020 518 885-9899 signs@balchsigns.com http://www.balchsigns.com Posts: 1697 | From: MaltaNY | Registered: Jan 2000
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That's where I get my smalts from also. Great product for a great company. As far as the frit is concerned, I can't really tell from the pictures on the web pages, but it looks like the fine frit looks too fine and the medium frit looks too coarse.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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Several years ago, when the site was booming, Steve and Barb did monthly drawings for some great products that were donated to the site. One month I was honored to win one of the drawings- a package of 1 lb. fine black smalts from Kristi Percell at Letterhead Sign Supply in CA.
I don't produce that type of sign, so I put the package back for use at a later date. So here's the deal: I would be happy to pass this 1 pound bag of fine black smalts on to you if you promise to put it to good use and post a photo of the finished piece.
email me your address (clantongraphics@yahoo.com) and I'll mail it out to you.
-------------------- Michael Clanton Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio 1933 Blackberry Conway AR 72034 501-505-6794 clantongraphics@yahoo.com Posts: 1736 | From: Conway Arkansas | Registered: Oct 2001
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I to have some black smalts on a couple signs - and they have been out in the weathter for a few years now, and still look as great as ever. I also use Letterhead Sign Supply....they are awesome. Good luck
-------------------- Patricia A. Raap Raap Signs 2615 Arthur Coopersville, MI 49404 616-677-0158 pat@raapsigns.com Posts: 576 | From: Coopersville, MI 49404 | Registered: Nov 2003
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Mark- You should be getting an early christmas present in the mail in the next few days, put it to good use and post a pic of the finished project for all of us to "ooo and ahhhh" over.
-------------------- Michael Clanton Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio 1933 Blackberry Conway AR 72034 501-505-6794 clantongraphics@yahoo.com Posts: 1736 | From: Conway Arkansas | Registered: Oct 2001
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Michael, cool. Thanks so much. I have a file that I drew up, and I've got a little tweaking to finish it up. I have some off cut 18 lb sign foam 4 that I had a buddy cut down to 1" thick (it was one 2" thick piece, now it's two 1" thick pieces). I am going to throw it on the cnc next Wednesday, and I am going to work on it over the thanksgiving holiday.
I will post up some progress pictures and a "step by step".
-------------------- Mark Kottwitz Kottwitz Graphics Ridgely, MD www.SeeMySignWork.com -------------------------- Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein Posts: 746 | From: Ridgely, MD | Registered: Oct 2000
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I have made some picture frames using granulated charcoal overcoated with urethane clear. I screen the ground up Kingsbury charcoal to get a constitant size and drop over a urethane sticky area to look like smalts. A real easy solution to get the effect and the charcoal keeps black well. Since these are inside pieces, I am not concerned about the aging as a couple have stood up perfectly for ten years.
-------------------- Preston McCall 112 Rim Road Santa Fe, New Mexico 87501 text: 5056607370 Posts: 1552 | From: Santa Fe, New Mexico | Registered: Nov 1998
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WHat are you finding best for bonding your smalt to the background? I've found short life with the products that I've used in the last ten years. Holfast oil was a flop. We've mixed 1shot with varnish and tried using screen enamel instead. During my apprentice years we mixed smudge with boiled oil and white lead. Then we added bulletin color and spar varnish. We'd get it kinda thich, but still brushable to cut in the letters and fill the background. I always liked doing the outline and gilding before dropping the smalt.
[ November 21, 2014, 10:04 AM: Message edited by: Rick Sacks ]
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6715 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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my smalts shop sign has been up for 18 years. black smatz. we painted the background black, let it dry. then we applied a thick coat of West Systems epoxy, heavily sprinkled on the smalts. Let it sit for 24 hours. Then dump it over onto a plastic tablecloth to collect all the excess smalts. The sign still looks good. it has only been washed 1 time.
Diane
-------------------- Balch Signs 1045 Raymond Rd Malta, NY 12020 518 885-9899 signs@balchsigns.com http://www.balchsigns.com Posts: 1697 | From: MaltaNY | Registered: Jan 2000
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I have signs with black beauty out in the sun and wind for over ten years with no graying or fading
-------------------- Len Mort Signmaker1.com 11 Juniper Drive Millbury, MA 508-865-2382 "A Good Business Sign, is A Sign of Good Business"(1957) Posts: 811 | From: Millbury, Ma | Registered: Dec 2006
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I use PB Resin from Coastal enterprises. It is a slow set epoxy that accepts One Shot so you can mix your epoxy to match the color of the smalts. West System with their slowest hardener works for black smalts but it is less UV stable than PB Resin so it will darken too much for colored smalts. I've done full 4x8 and bigger backgrounds with just me and my wife in about 40 minutes. I use a needle nose bottle to lay the epoxy. It's fast and easy to lay a thin bead around letters and border edges. In big areas I flatten in out with a squeegee, then like Diane sprinkle the smalts. I lay it on heavy and will even pat it down to make sure it gets embedded well into the epoxy. Next day dump the excess, if you can, pat the back to knock off loose smalts. It lasts much longer than the old Smith's Cream in One Shot method and goes on a lot faster. If you are worried about the epoxy setting up too fast, here's a few tips. If you make a big batch, break it down into several smaller containers. The larger the volume, the faster it sets. Save all the interiors of letters like O's & P's etc. for last. You can make a fresh smaller batch for those. PB Resin will be okay if multiple batches come together on the sign if they weren't mixed with a lot of time between, but you want to keep different batches from mixing if you can. Get it on the sign as quickly as possible, then spread. 1/4 inch beads of epoxy will set way slower than a bottle full of it, so the faster you get it out of the bottle, the longer the working time.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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OK, folks, what we used to do is paint the black outline and let it dry, wipe it with potato starch and oil size letters and gild. Polish gold and then outline with the smudge used to adhere the smalt. Can you control the outlining with resin? Is it possible to reclaim a brush after using that method? clean lines from a squeeze bottle doesn't seem possible.
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6715 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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-------------------- Mark Kottwitz Kottwitz Graphics Ridgely, MD www.SeeMySignWork.com -------------------------- Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein Posts: 746 | From: Ridgely, MD | Registered: Oct 2000
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I used to use the method shown in Rick Glawson's guide. But as bad as One Shot has become, I'll stick to my colored epoxy method. I've seen smalts come off of One Shot in less than 10 years. No problems at all with the epoxy method.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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