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When we first started with the digital prints, it seemed like a practical things since we were overlaying vinyl, sometimes 4-5 layers on top of each other to get the degree of fanciness we wanted. But you have little points here and there that are vulnerable, etc. So keeping the color all on one layer was appealing. So we dove in got a printer.
For my semi folks, I told them the literature I came across said that you should get up to 3 year for a print without lamination. Since we were going to laminate everything, I told customers they's probably get 4 and that if one needed to be redone, and they called ahead we could probably get the thing ready, take the old off and put the new on, and ... I kept a few examples (real fancy) around for them to see. Everybody was cool with that, because in the end, the fanciness factor was what they were after.
So we got the longest lasting film, and we got the longest lasting laminate and we kept our fingers cross.
Well, we're coming up on 7 years and we haven't had to replace any of the original prints.
The other day a trucker made an appointment to have a prints put on his driver's door to replace one that was damaged along with the door in an accident. So I was anxious to see what the print was going to look like. The truck was letter almost 6 years ago to the day.
Check this out. Our color profiles have changed since the first one was made, because back then we printed cmyk and now we print rgb. I think that's the reason the purples are slightly differed. But man there's a tiny little red line in there and it still looks good:
-------------------- Bill Diaz Diaz Sign Art Pontiac IL www.diazsignart.com Posts: 2107 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Dec 2001
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I should also have pointed out that the semi was striped with HOK and the truck had over 500,000 miles on it. By the looks of the truck overall, and it was new when he brought it in, I'd say this cat didn't take the best care of it. I'm judging that by the way the inside of the cab looked and evidence of BLUE BEACON and or TIDAL WAVE washing which was starting to take a toll on the HOK striping.
-------------------- Bill Diaz Diaz Sign Art Pontiac IL www.diazsignart.com Posts: 2107 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Dec 2001
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Bill I agree totally, These digitally laminated prints last for a lot longer than whats stated... I Have Hundreds of prints out there, Hundreds, maybe even thousands, I have never had to replace one, some of them are 7 years old and even longer, and the old ones, and I'm talking about full digital prints on 20 ft trucks and even 54ft Trailers for Dairy companies that are that old, and they look Just Great! Now if you don't laminate them they are not near as durable... we laminate everything!
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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Im starting to use urethane clears over digital prints. concept 2021 form PPG. The only thing I have noticed that laminated prints do is ruin a set of mags in less than 1 year. they will shrik all the way around about 3/16" on white mags. They did this on my personal mags. So then I ordered prints from Blake and cleared overthm myself...NO SHRINKAGE!
-------------------- You ever notice how easily accessible people are when they are requiring your services but once they get invoice you can't reach them anymore
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Bill - my buddy has a Roland SojJet Pro EX 2. I use his equipment when I need digital stuff.
When he first got his printer, several years ago now... he printed a color logo out and stuck it on a Metal door on his friends airplane hanger. The metal door faces east and gets sun beating on it for half the day or better. I bet it's been 7 years, and he says it looks as good as the day he put it on. That is probably an exaggeration... it has probably changed a 'little'.... but so little that nobody would even notice.
And - - this is UN-laminated. I think these digital prints are really holding their color longer than we all imagined.
I'd like to hear more input from other digital owners.
-------------------- Todd Gill Outside The Lines Potterville, MI Posts: 7792 | From: Potterville, MI | Registered: Dec 2001
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Then there is the whole out-gassing for a day or more before laminating vs laminating it a few minutes after it's printed. Because of the way we are set up to do truck work, we often times don't have the luxury of waiting day(s) for the print to "out-gas". However we have yet to see this effect the longevity of our printed graphics. Perhaps it's different for people using different printers or inks.
Where we have noticed a difference is the aggressiveness of the tack of the film on graphics that have sat a day or more vs graphics that were laminated and applied with in hours of it being printed. The graphics that have NOT sat for longer than a day are very aggressive and less repositionable. So if we were to do something like a wrap or any print that has to go around curves, it helps to let it sit. But longevity? We have found no difference.
-------------------- Joe Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, IL 61764 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 538 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Aug 2005
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It should also be said that we are using Oracal vinyl and printing with eco sol inks out of our roland printer. The laminate is very helpful, but I also believe that all inks & print vinyls are not created equal. I'd be interested to hear what type of vinyl, print & laminate was involved in the problems Bruce was having. I've seen other local sign shops who were using non laminated edge prints on FDC vinyl that would look like total junk after just a couple years.
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I did a double faced 4x8 sign in 2003 using digital prints I ordered from Gregory. Its in San Diego and I was away for a few years and was in the area recently. I saw the north facing side first and was not surprized to see it looked fine but was a little worried about what I was going to see on the south facing side. It looks just like the day I put it up.
-------------------- Chuck Peterson Designs San Diego, CA Posts: 1051 | From: San Diego, CA USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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As far as Edge prints go, not all foils are the same. Some Gerber foils hold up better than Duracoat or ZeroNine and vice-versa depending on the color.
The laminate you use makes a difference as well. Using 3M 8519 with Oracal 751 vinyl, I'm getting about 8 years.
Laminated with Gerber UV Guard vinyl (basically Tedlar), I've got one that is currently 14 years old facing Southeast and is still going strong.
posted
Same results here in Ireland. We obviously don't get as much sun as many of you. We have lots of stuff six years in the wild but all laminated. Can't notice any difference in now and the day they were done. It's great being able to tell a customer they can look at stuff we printed six years ago full of confidence
-------------------- Kevin Gaffney Artistik Signs Kinnegad County Westmeath Ireland 044-75187 kevingaffney@eircom.net Posts: 628 | From: Ireland | Registered: Oct 2003
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Somewhere along the line we decided to use Oracal's 3951RA instead of 3951, because it goes down absolutely flawless every time. We figured on a 50 yard roll the extra money was well spent, because the stuff is unbelievably easy to use. I don't even search for that stray bubble anymore, because I know there won't be any.
Either way we laminate with Oracal's 290G. Both 3951RA and 290G are the top of the line for Oracal.
What are you all using?
-------------------- Bill Diaz Diaz Sign Art Pontiac IL www.diazsignart.com Posts: 2107 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Dec 2001
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We have had good luck with our digital prints. I have to agree with you Bill air release vinyl is the only way to go that is pretty much all we use.
-------------------- Dennis Raap Raap Signs Posts: 839 | From: Coopersville, MI | Registered: Feb 2003
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Air release is the only way to go, we use Arlon, we have great results with it, on Glass we try to use the High Tac Product, I find widows on vehicles can be a real pain!
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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