posted
I guess the weird economy is having an effect on my customers.
Lately new customers have been coming into the shop with strange attitudes, mostly insisting on having impossible deadlines met. This morning was no different. I live in a small house next to my shop and office, and I heard a semi pull into the driveway, about 40 minutes before opening time (and yes -- my hours are CLEARLY marked on sign and door).
The phone starts ringing and ringing and ringing and ringing. I know it is the driver of the truck, but I answer anyway. After a brief hello I tell him that I don't open for another 40 minutes. (and I wasn't exactly dressed for going outside!!!)
Before I can say anything, he very politely says, "Well, I guess I'll just go somewhere else then," and he just hangs up.
Now, this is not a story complaining about idiot customers (well, it might be!!!), rather, it's a warning that since this has happened to me 3 times in less than a week (impossible deadlines, wanting to show up after shop hours, etc.), we as signmakers may have to adjust our way of doing business to somehow keep these jobs from driving down the highway.
Now it wasn't possible on this job or the last two I lost to keep them. The last two, for instance, were impossible deadlines that would have warranted cancelling two days worth of pre-scheduled work, working on the weekend, and cancelling a dental appointment made two weeks prior.
Still, my customers are feeling an economic crunch, and that seems to have put them in a poor frame of mind when they finally decide to buy a sign, and that makes some of them insane to deal with. And yet none of us want to lose work. Time to adjust tactics, perhaps???
thoughts???
-------------------- Michael Gene Adkins The Fontry 1576 S Hwy 59 Watts OK 74964 Posts: 845 | From: Watts, OK USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
Personally if a customer was good enough to drive to my shop/house I would have said Hold on there, I'll be right out! In my underwear if I had to.
Now that being said.. I do understand Impossible deadlines, I personally work with them all the time... Not all of them can be met however... but you try your best. If the economy is that bad where you or anyone else does business you have to step up to the plate... Good Luck Micheal!
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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Well, Neil, I thought about it-!!!! But it was pretty windy this morning!!!!!
Like I said, though, wasn't complainin', just realizin' that things are happening a little differently these days and we'll all have to adjust or go broke!!!
-------------------- Michael Gene Adkins The Fontry 1576 S Hwy 59 Watts OK 74964 Posts: 845 | From: Watts, OK USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
If they want an impossible deadline, make it worth it. Tell them that you'll have to reschedule some work already in house and work after hours and you'll have to add a rush charge. Double your price to make it worth your while.
I've found that they are either thrilled and I have to work overtime or the "deadline" changes and I still may get the job. The trick it making the financial reward large enough that you don't mind doing it.
-------------------- Bill Modzel Mod-Zel screen Printing Traverse city, MI modzel@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1356 | From: Traverse City, MI | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
My current post on "what's up" talks abit about making adjustments in business for our current state of affairs.
I know what you mean about losing customers. In one way or another I am also. Some companies I've done business with thru the years are struggling with this economy. Some have gone under. Some have just retired. Some have become price shoppers and are sizing down with their wallets. Many are more apt to name their price at this stage of the game.
There is also an air of rebellion out there right now. I myself, as a consumer, understand it. We are all just tired of being ripped off, and are fighting back in some ways by tightening up our purse strings, demanding more for our money, and cutting back where we can.
There has been alot of exploitation taking place in our country, and folks are starting to revolt in even little ways against big injustices that have gone on, especially at the top level for too long.
hahaha.... don't get me started!
Yesh, we may be losing some customers out there for many unsettling reasons right now.
I suggest we go out in our underwear if we have to and snag those customers that are still knocking at our door ... at whatever hour they do it.
~nettie
-------------------- "When Love and Skill Work Together ... Expect a Masterpiece"
posted
I'm thinkin' about sleeping in my clothes from now on!!! Just in case I get the "3 a.m." phone call-!!!
Janette and Neil, on the other hand --- I dunno about those two characters......
You may be on to something Janette. Our customers may be having hard times that makes it difficult to part with their money, which in turn gives them a bad attitude, which in turn will force us drop our own attitudes and make whatever adjustments necessary ( as Bill said ) to insure that we can still get the jobs!!!
-------------------- Michael Gene Adkins The Fontry 1576 S Hwy 59 Watts OK 74964 Posts: 845 | From: Watts, OK USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
Todd, it is funny that you bring the dictation of who gets what when and where...Paul and I had that same discussion last nite.
After going to our church picnic planning meeting last nite, which I am the advertising chair and ENTIRE committee and receiving my budget for promoting the picnic, the discussion turned to cutting costs and maximizing profits. Basically, run the picnic as a business, not just an event.
So as I return from what was supposed to be an hour meeting, 2.5 hours later, my head reeling, I go back to work at 9:30 PM to letter a pickup truck and a dumptruck, both needing to be picked up this morning. Didn't get done, cleaned up and paperwork for each job filed until after 12:30 am.
How does this relate? Well, both of these trucks are good clients that need them during the day to make money. I am not going to tell them that they have to be done during "business hours." So yes, I work weekends and evenings to accommodate this, otherwise the dude with the vinyl machine in his garage down the street will get MY $$$.
So I get paid. good deal... but at the same time, belonging to an association, like a church, requires effort and people to help and make a committed effort. Everyone wants to go to the picnic, but no one wants to help or pay anything. Which makes it difficult for those trying to organize. Relation to the socialist system?
If we don't make money on our picnic,(sign business) or other events, we don't reach our budgetary numbers for basic operations for the parish... big deal who cares? Ahhh! Here's where the picking out of the pocket comes in....if we as a parish (business) don't contribute our assigned amount to the diocese (gov't) through the yearly appeal (additional giving fund drive)(taxes etc...)the diocese (govet) TAKES the money from our operating budget-we have no choice in the matter. So if our picnic committees (sign shops)do a great job at cutting costs and maximizing profits for the picnic (business) and the balance of the appeal amount is short (new taxes), all of our work for the picnic (business)is "wasted".
So for all purposes, the picnic as a "business" needs to accommodate "clients"- parishioners etc and their spending habits and demands....new ways to drive "business" to the picnic grounds.
talk about frustrating businesses...and we don't get paid....however it is interesting to see how ideas play out in real life when it really isn't your butt on the line....
-------------------- Nikki Goral Image Advantage Signs 4050 Champeau Road New Franken, WI 54229 920-465-4500 "Finish every day and be done with it. Tomorrow is a new day."-Ralph Waldo Emerson Posts: 928 | From: New Franken, WI (East Green Bay) | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
Although, I must qualify my statement too...my first few years in business, I worked 14 hour days, 7 days a week to "get established." I was exhausted and crabby... Now, I will schedule nights and weekends when I want to work. Maybe I have something going on during the week at my son's school. It gets scheduled in just like any other job, and I determine if it is something I really want to do and take my "weekend" time during the week...
-------------------- Nikki Goral Image Advantage Signs 4050 Champeau Road New Franken, WI 54229 920-465-4500 "Finish every day and be done with it. Tomorrow is a new day."-Ralph Waldo Emerson Posts: 928 | From: New Franken, WI (East Green Bay) | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
Because of this whole economic thing... I do every truck that comes my way... Early, late, whatever I do it.
Does that make me like doing trucks? NO!
I love telling truck drivers(not truck owners or the one writing the checks) how much I hate doing trucks and as soon as I grow up and become a real shop I will quit doing trucks. I get cool reactions.
posted
Stories like this remind me of a former customer who once told me "If you kiss enough a$$, eventually sh!t smells like money." My response was, "If you kiss everybody's a$$, it makes money smell like sh!t."
Michael, the way to deal with this is to letter the truck, then show up with it at midnite and bang on his phone til he answers, saying something like "Your truck is done. Pay me right now or the keys will be locked in my shop until I come back from vacation next week."
Seriously? I'd have a message on my phone that says business calls will be taken between the hours of 8 to 6 (or whatever). Period. Customers that don't respect your space or personal time are always the same people that lie to you and try to rip you off, they will jerk you around on money and everything else.
-------------------- "A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle
Cam Bortz Finest Kind Signs Pondside Iron works 256 S. Broad St. Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379 "Award winning Signs since 1988" Posts: 3051 | From: Pawcatuck,Connecticut USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I guess we would look at their attitude....if they truly were in need and were kind about "Can you please help me out? I have to have this done and I have to drop it off now because ____" and they had a good reason, we'd accomodate them. But if they were rude and surly and acted like a child who wasn't getting his way, I can "be rude & surly" with the best of 'em! I just don't get why people think if they are rude to you that you are going out of your way to jump through hoops for them!?
I should add, we stopped working on Saturdays years ago. When someone asks if we work on Saturday, I say, "We try not to, but if it is really important we will do it. But you do understand Saturdays are time and a half, right?" That weeds out the "I can't wait!" people real fast.
[ March 10, 2009, 04:46 PM: Message edited by: Jane Diaz ]
-------------------- Jane Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, Il. 61764 815-844-7024 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 4102 | From: Pontiac, IL USA | Registered: Feb 1999
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My dad has always run his salvage business the opposite of how I run my sign business. He has the attitude that he will let no sale get away from him no matter what-!!!
He has lots of money now, but the stress of it all finally caused him to have a stroke. He has his mind, but can no longer physically do the things he once could do only a year ago. At 62 he can't even drive himself to town.
He just could not seem to strike a balance between his business and his health, and ultimately it was not worth it.
Me? I just want to find that balance.
-------------------- Michael Gene Adkins The Fontry 1576 S Hwy 59 Watts OK 74964 Posts: 845 | From: Watts, OK USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
We work entirely mobile and have for the past 17 years. I wouldn't have it any other way. Nobody wakes us up. They get the answering machine.
That said, we don't keep regular business hours and have no problems with working Saturday or Sunday if necessary. We also have no problem with taking a few days off in the middle of the week if so inclined. See my post on the portfolio page. I've been in business for almost thirty years, I've worked for all sorts of clients. For the most part the 18 wheeler guys are the best customers bar none. One has to understand that the truck is their way of making a living. If it isn't on the road they are loosing money. They can sometimes, but not always, be in a hurry. We try to accomodate. What works for us might drive other folks crazy but it suits us just fine.
[ March 10, 2009, 09:17 PM: Message edited by: George Perkins ]
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
we used to run our sign shop off our property and the house was just a hop and a skip across the yard and i can relate. how customers feel like just come by at weird hours and expect that you have to work at strange hours because you live next to were you work though i did not like it it was the main motivation for me to move my business to a main street store front. my business has increased, i go home and i don't work week ends.
I have to agree with Cam...respect is demanded by my customer so i ask my customer to have the same respect!
Lovelady
-------------------- "We have been making house calls since 1992"
Chris Lovelady Vital Signs
NOW WITH 2 LOCATIONS! Tallahassee, Florida Thomasville, Ga.
posted
While we try to accomodate our customers and their needs we also expect them to respect our time and limitations. We enjoy what we do but like them, we also have a life away from our work. Even in a slow economy, we operate much the same as we always have, giving our customers appropriate quality workmanship in a timely manner, within the bounds of a schedule that fits our energy and maintains our sanity.
-------------------- Kent Smith Smith Sign Studio P.O.Box 2385, Estes Park, CO 80517-2385 kent@smithsignstudio.com Posts: 1025 | From: Estes Park, CO | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I surely would not have went out there. your hours are posted and that should be respected. Do you think he could have went to the bank and pulled that? no.
Times are hard here too. Jobs are trickling in. one...by...one. Even the larger companies are slow and that makes them more available to jump in om my "local stuff" which was majority of my work. Good news though some smaller guys are selling equipment and calling it quits, we could get rid of a couple more.
I dont know if I see more arrogance in people and as far as I need it now, hell thats ALL i have ever seen
-------------------- You ever notice how easily accessible people are when they are requiring your services but once they get invoice you can't reach them anymore
posted
Living 'out in the sticks' where we do, customers will call in on their way in to town, or on their way home from town, if at all. You get used to combining several jobs in the one trip, and you understand when others do the same.
That can have them arriving at 7 am, or at 8 pm. I don't mind, with a bit of warning. A few will tell you they've arrived while I'm still in my PJs! It doesn't matter- they're here to collect a job & pay me, not to judge my clothing!
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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posted
I know from my own life that most "business emergencies" are self-induced by failing to plan ahead.
A potential customer who shows up, without notice, off hours, had damn well better be nice about it. The very act of showing up an hour early and asking for an immediate response is ALREADY disrespectful; compounding that with "attitude" is absolutely unacceptable.
People who act like that do so because they get away with it. They were bullies and spoiled brats as kids and still are - and as adult they learn to avoid people that refuse to be pushed around, and constantly seek out anyone who they think will be a doormat for their obnoxious "me first" behavior.
-------------------- "A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle
Cam Bortz Finest Kind Signs Pondside Iron works 256 S. Broad St. Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379 "Award winning Signs since 1988" Posts: 3051 | From: Pawcatuck,Connecticut USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I have a Home Based shop & people stopping by is part of the risk of having your business at home. You have to live with that choice or change it.
Having worked at many race tracks over the years the words "Impossible deadlines" has a whole new meaning. Deadline: paint a 30,000 sq. ft. grass painting four days before a NASCAR race! All they tell you is, "Live TV on Sunday and it better be there when the show starts!" The rain comes in on Wednesday & Thursday. The cars are on the track until 5pm Friday & Saturday. That means Friday & Saturday we work all night! Impossible Deadline met!
Last Sunday morning at 7:30am the phone rings. A very apologetic person needed some lettering on an existing sign for farm show he was in that day. Response: "When can you bring it up?" Got paid a "Healthy Sum" (cash) and to top it off, on Monday morning I found two cases of Budweiser at the shop door!
I've been in a very successful sign business for 27 years and I guess what I'm trying to say is that "I am here for my customers, they are not here for me!" That is not an easy statement to uphold but it has worked for me!
-------------------- Tony Vickio The World Famous Vickio Signs 3364 Rt.329 Watkins Glen, NY 14891 t30v@vickiosigns.com 607-535-6241 http://www.vickiosigns.com Posts: 1063 | From: Watkins Glen, New York | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
Hiya Michael, As you can see from the various comments, trying to find that "balance" is not an easy task. In your situation with the truck driver, I would side with the others and have tried to be more accommodating. However, since the driver wanted to start the job outside my normal business hours, I would have charged overtime for the entire project I too offer a flexible schedule and I'm willing to meet with and work for clients early in the AM, nights or weekends if the job merits the effort. Like Bill and the others mentioned though, I'll say yes as long as I'm paid accordingly.
Havin' fun,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I just can not believe some attitudes here.. I really can't.
Tony you are Spot on!
Just last week I had a customer, a local Airline who operates all kinds of Aircraft, they were in a bit of a pickle, a Dash 8 that was being painted arrived early, so they needed the stripes/ graphics, lettering registration done like right away, I said I wish I had known, I could have had it all preprinted and cut. I did not know that this Aircraft was coming.... I got on the Phone and the colors of the vinyl were'nt even in the counrty... at least a part of them were'nt, I printed the rest on the versa Camm. Long Story Short, we had the plane ready for application on Thursday, the client called on Friday morning, the day of the install and apologized, the plane had to be used, so I punched her in the face! No not really, I laughed and she laughed and said to me, "You know how it is Neil" I said after doing your work for over "25" YEARS! I certainly do know how it is.. we rescheduled for Saturday Moring....and we had the Plane ready for Sunday Morning.
"That is how I have kept this customer for over 25 Years!" Among other customers... I can't imagine saying "Too Bad! You never gave me any notice, now leave me alone! I have other customers work to do that took the time to call in advance!"
I'm sure that not everyone on here really believes in that attitude, in any situation, recession or not...I don't ramble very often but this worries me.
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
I can see both sides of this situation, on one side is customer service. If you bend over backwards you might get a customer for life out of the deal, but not too often. Years ago, customers were loyal to you, but in the last 10-15 years, customer loyalty is is a rare thing.
Now if you do bend over backwards, you have a very good chance of losing control of your business, after all, YOU own the business, not your customer.
When times are good, it's easy to blow someone off, but things are not good right now. If it was me and I only had to throw some clothes on and walk outside to talk to the guy, I would have. Chances are you might not had to do the job right away, but go over it, get a deposit and schedule the job.
In these times, if you don't jump on a job right away, there is a good chance that in a week or two the customer realizes he can no longer afford to have it done.
If there is one thing this reccesion has taught me, it's that I'm not as important or valuable as I thought I was.
[ March 11, 2009, 11:11 AM: Message edited by: David Thompson ]
-------------------- David Thompson Pro-Line Graphics Martinsville, NJ
I'm not this dumb, it's just the paint fumes talkin' Posts: 397 | From: Martinsville, NJ | Registered: Oct 2001
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posted
I see everyone's point, and while I don't want to beat the issue to death, please note that the truck driver in the original true scenario hung up the phone and starting driving off before I could say anything about accomodating him.
I'm sometimes willing to do almost anything for a job, but I can't run outside in my birthday suit and chase semis down the road!!!
Not that Tony and Neil wouldn't!!!!! Plus, meeting some of the impossible deadlines people have put me under lately would have lost me jobs that were already on order--with good and reasonable customers. Sometimes you can only do so much.
Last Friday afternoon, for instance, a guy wanted me to letter a miniature windmill for him. miniature turned out to be the size of a truck bed. Trouble was, my schedule was already filled for the weekend and up until next thursday. He wanted it monday morning. The job simply wasn't possible for me. For others, maybe, just not my shop!!!
Like Checkers said, find a balance that works for you.
Or do like Janette and buy cuter underwear!!!
I'm thinking a pimp-daddy leopard print robe would look nice on me!!!
-------------------- Michael Gene Adkins The Fontry 1576 S Hwy 59 Watts OK 74964 Posts: 845 | From: Watts, OK USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
There is a big difference between going out of your way to accomodate a good customer with an urgent request and bending over backwards to accomodate somebody who doesn't value your time. All you have to do is know the difference. The latter will not improve over time - you either have to let them go, or learn to deal with frustrating customers as the norm.
Get PREGNANT!!! Really! You should see how accommodating ALL my customers have been since they found out. No one wants to tick off a pregnant lady or be non PC because she is...
Until the kid is out, then back to business as usual!
-------------------- Nikki Goral Image Advantage Signs 4050 Champeau Road New Franken, WI 54229 920-465-4500 "Finish every day and be done with it. Tomorrow is a new day."-Ralph Waldo Emerson Posts: 928 | From: New Franken, WI (East Green Bay) | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
It really all boils down to Aretha Franklin....R-E-S-P-E-C-T~! I will respect a customer who treats ME with respect. If they are rude.....back at cha!
-------------------- Jane Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, Il. 61764 815-844-7024 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 4102 | From: Pontiac, IL USA | Registered: Feb 1999
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posted
If you read Michael's story, he says that the customer POLITELY said he would go elsewhere. He then didn't really give Michael the chance to "streak" after his semi to keep him. (thanks for the visual Michael. haha)
It may seem that the truck driver was out of line for his early hours, but again, he's a truck driver and I know they need their trucks for their living.
While it's clear that this trucker could of handled things better here, he still was polite about it, and just needed his needs met quickly.
I dunno about anyone else, but I'm not perfect either. There are just times I need a deed done and off my list, so I seek out the quickest avenues without always thinking things thru. Whether it be right or wrong.
So, I tend to give people some slack, like I hope they would do for me when I fall short on dealing with things in the best ways.
It really is about finding a balance. I think that people tend to deal with things as they "are" in any given moment at times. Again, not always the best ways, but hey, we're human.
Respect IS key. Blantant disrepect IS unacceptable. However, I can usually be quite generous in giving people the benefit of doubt, and some wiggle room in their blunders.
~nettie
ps: Jon, get that lard gut of yours over to the health post and post a goal "out loud" so we know you're serious and we can hold you accountable for that diet plan! he he he ...
posted
Wellllllllllllll....it seems it is time to start cutting our customers some slack!
I just got off the phone with a long time customer. Needed a price on some signs for a new building that they are painting. They are normally a construction company, but are doing the painting.
I aske how come they are painting, his annswer was: "Remember? I started out in the painting game before we got into construction. Now every job we bid, there are 15 to 20 others bidding it too! We had a chance to grab the painting end of this one, and it will keep my crew employed!"
Sound familiar?
-------------------- Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
si.allen on Skype
siallen@dslextreme.com
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!
Brushasaurus on Chat Posts: 8827 | From: La Mirada, CA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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that was the intent of my post, to make all of us aware that our customers are going thru changes that might make them a little more difficult to deal with!!!
Stay sharp, and maybe you won't be chasing them down the road in your underwear!!!
I've bid some jobs I thought were too low lately, and the customers still didn't buy them. They didn't go anywhere else to get them either. They simply didn't buy them because they felt they couldn't afford them.
-------------------- Michael Gene Adkins The Fontry 1576 S Hwy 59 Watts OK 74964 Posts: 845 | From: Watts, OK USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
I knew that Michael....Customers are being a little more Demanding and unreasonable really.. we just have to adjust out attitudes along with them.
There was one guy on here a few years ago, who is now retired, I can't remeber his name, but he had a hard nosed attitude, not saying he was'nt a nice guy, but boy! He was a tough old buzzard ... it must be great to be able to have that many disposable customers.
-------------------- "Keep Positive"
SIGNS1st. Neil Butler Paradise, NF Posts: 6277 | From: St. John's NF Canada | Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
MICHAEL, YOU WANT MY GREEN SPEEDOS?????? MY SELF, i woulda walked out in my underwear, just to let the guy know..........he was early!!!!!!! then i woulda said come in and have a cup a coffee, WHILE I GET WOKE UP ENOUGH TO WORK))))))))) most a the people who come here, MY HOUSE & SHOP are same property, KNOW I DONT DO MORNINGS!!!!!!! gettin me to even answer the phone before 11 am, is a push. now, on the other side of that, i have people show up here at 7 PM..........to get work dun. i also do a lot truck for towing, plumbers, tree service, a/c shops. now these are mostly 8-5 pm, 5 day a week WORK VEHICLES. so i will work sat/sun so they dont have the trucks outa service when they are needed. so when i do this, i can take MON or TUE and do what i was gona do on the weekend........OR SPEND THE MONEY i got from workin the weekend))))) iam flexable that way, just dont DISTURB MY SLEEP TIME..........and we get along fine. the way the economy has been the last year, NOBODY GETS OUTA MY YARD........WITHOUT SOME THING DUN AND I GOT $$$$$$$$ IN MY HAND.
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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