What is a question that you get all the time? Not just the dumb ones, but a question that you feel really leads you into educating a customer about signs?
posted
Honestly, I had a guy call last week and ask, "How much is a banner?" It just amazes me that it wouldn't occur to someone that we need more info than that to give a price. I usually answer it with something like, "Well, that's like asking how much is a car. It all depends on what options you want." and then go on to explain they need to figure out how big they want it, is it exterior for how long and what do they want it to say....
-------------------- Jane Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, Il. 61764 815-844-7024 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 4102 | From: Pontiac, IL USA | Registered: Feb 1999
| IP: Logged |
-------------------- Frank Smith Frank Smith Signs Albany, NY www.franksmithsigns.com Posts: 807 | From: Albany, NY USA | Registered: Nov 1998
| IP: Logged |
posted
What if someone decides to vandalize it? ???? What if some decides to vandalize your house? Do you fault the builder?
[ December 15, 2008, 11:18 AM: Message edited by: Jane Diaz ]
-------------------- Jane Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, Il. 61764 815-844-7024 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 4102 | From: Pontiac, IL USA | Registered: Feb 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I had a customer who wanted a certain person's name on a banner. I gave her a price and she wanted to see the banner. SO I pulled a banner off the shelf, thinking she wanted to see how it was made, opened the box end and proceeded to show her the material, seams, etc. She wanted me to fully unroll it.
"Can I see what it looks like?" Me "sure" (pull one off the shelf) "can you unroll it so I can see how it looks" Me "the whole thing just looks like this" "Does it say XXXXXX on it?" Me (now, trying to keep a straight face}"no, it doesn't say anything...it's a blank banner" "you mean it doesn't say XXXXXX on it?"
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7403 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
How about a photo of a monument sign with faux brick or faux stone....
You can have them guess the weight ? Whether it is real or faux (brick or stone) ?
What it's made out of...
I'm sure you will be amused by some of the replies, and it is a great way to inform your readers about foamcore monument signs and the exceptional benefits they offer.
I would be glad to send you some photos if you need...
-------------------- Katie Fleming Marketing Coordinator Peachtree City Foamcraft Posts: 28 | From: Schnecksville, PA | Registered: Feb 2008
| IP: Logged |
posted
I like Frank's question. I'd like to see the answer too.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
"Can't you just scan it?" This is the question I get from people who hand me a little photo or samll artwork of some kind.
-------------------- Signs by Alicia Jennings (Mudflap Girl) Tacoma, WA Since 1987 Have Lipstick, will travel. Posts: 3812 | From: Tacoma, WA. U.S.A. | Registered: Dec 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I thought you just pushed a button on your computer? Sigh....., here's a jpeg that I've converted to Eps....what do you mean that isn't what you want, you said eps.....what's a vector?
-------------------- Anne McDonald 17 Karnak Crescent Russley Christchurch 8042 New Zealand
"I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure" Posts: 877 | From: Christchurch | Registered: Sep 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
Here is what I came up with for this feature this week. It will publish on Signs Never Sleep this afternoon. www.signsneversleep.com
I want to thank all the people who helped get the wheels turning for this project.
Sign question of the week: How long does it take to make a sign?
As you can imagine, this is a question that is impossible to answer, in any kind of general sense. But I can tell you, a simple project will take much less time than a more complex one.
At Lincoln Sign Company, we tend to primarily work on dimensional, carved, and sand-blasted signs. When a customer asks me about the time-frame we need to complete a project, I usually tell them 6 to 8 weeks PLUS the workload that we currently have in the shop. To someone who has never worked in a sign-shop, I realize that this probably seems like an impossible amount of time to do anything, but the important thing to keep in mind is that everything a sign-shop does is "Made to Order" and "Custom".
When we create a sign, everything that goes into the creation of that sign is personalized. We did a custom sketch for the customer (sometimes several) to make sure that the design is just what the customer wants. The process of getting the artwork right for a customer can take over a week a week, just by itself.
This job, let's say it is for "Anne's Diner", is not the only project we are currently working on. We are a small, four-person shop (as are most sign companies in the US). In addition to working on the artwork for Anne's Diner, today I need to paint several signs that are in various stages of production, finalize another sketch for a customer, start carving another sign and talk to three customers on the phone about their projects.
Tomorrow, we have a large on-site install, so very little will get done on any of these signs, but we will all pick up right where we left off on Thursday.
Sign-making is alot like anything you take on in your own life or work. Think of it as that home-improvement project you have slowly been working on for the last 3 months, or the costume you have been working on for your child's play at school, or that long report you have been working on at work. No project gets 100% of your attention all of the time. We get little bits of projects done, in between the "urgent" interruptions that litter our day, and then finally make one big push at the end to finalize it.
So what's the "bottom line" of this discussion?
I know that customers want to know how long a project will take. What I want to warn you against, is choosing a sign company based on how long they SAY a project will take. Choose a sign company because they have a great reputation, or you love their work, or they were so friendly the first time you talked to them and they have answered every question you have had with an infinite amount of patience.
Choose a sign-maker who you think will do the best job on your sign. Pick the sign company that will give you a sign that everyone will see and marvel at each time they pass. Find a sign company that will give you a sign that will make people want to see what is behind the door of your business.
Don't pick a sign company because they said the project will take a week less than the other company said. That would be like picking a brain-surgeon based on the guy that does the quickest job.
If you are worried about the time-frame on a job, or you put your sign-buying decision off to the last minute, buy a temporary banner and put it up, and wait for the best sign company you can find to give you a sign that you will be in love with for the rest of your life...
~ contributed by J.D. Iles of Lincoln Sign Company
-------------------- Lincoln Sign Co 166 Pollard Rd Lincoln, NH 03251-4248 Posts: 25 | From: Lincoln, NH | Registered: Aug 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
I hesitate to ask this question. We were sorta hoping someone else might bring it up. It's not a big deal, just annoying.
Let's say you have decided to start your own sign business. There's a Family up the street that has been successfully running a fulltime sign business for 12 years. You want to do the same thing, but find a way to do it faster, without making the same investment in time and money the old guy did..
A ligtbulb goes off in your head! Why not just drop into the other guys place of business, ask some questions, and use the oportunity to hand out as many of your own business cards as possible? This way you can promote your own venture and avoid the advertising costs, as well as the all the other hard work and dedication that goes into building a longterm, reputable business?
I think it's a good guestion. The only decision we need to make is whether we discuss the answer here or at www.signsneversleep.com ?
-------------------- Steve Shortreed 144 Hill St., E. Fergus, Ontario Canada N1M 1G9 519-787-2673
posted
I think JD has a lot to offer, but I have to agree with Steve that stopping by the meet that never ends, and wanting to chat about "How long a sign takes to make" is the reason Letterville exists. This would NOT require the scattering about of JD's website links.
I consider it bad taste to acquire a network of related links to his site, by posing it as a genuine topic of discussion in Letterville. I think that it may not be a big deal, but it is without any doubt self promotion, which is a fine & necessary thing to do, but it usually costs money to do it to someone else's captive audience.
The fine line that may exist regarding merchant privileges & the posting of links to be a helpful Letterhead, directing traffic to non merchants, may be a grey area, however I think Steve has every right feel that posting multiple links purely for self promotion is out of line.
If JD just says "for my blog" people would still have answered the question, so if that is really all he hopes to acquire out of the question, hopefully he will see Steve's point, and quit linking.
posted
Well, I kinda see your point, guys.... I'd discuss it there, but it doesn't appear he has a forum for discussion. And I totally respect Steve's rules, but he did say we could DISCUSS it, so I'll present the other side...
The way I read it, other than the possibility of a little link-backing for page rank, I'd hardly think of his post as 'advertising' on this site. I'd guess about 99% of Letterville's readers are signmakers, so I'd think this would be the worst place to try to sell signs. For someone in his area to run across this post and buy a sign from him based on this 'free advertising' is also highly unlikely.
He does have an 'Advertise with Us' link that doesn't work, so I guess there is the possibility he's trolling for advertisers, but I didn't think it came across that way...
So if he's not providing anything that is in competition for this great forum, and is not receiving any advertising business from here, what is a few posts about his site hurting? We are not his target audience. I don't see anyone getting on Grampa Dan or others for making a periodic post about their websites every time they change a picture or two on it.
Doug, as far as the 'scattering about' of JD's website links, he has 21 posts, so could really have the maximum of 21 posted links. You on the other hand have over 8,000 posts that have YOUR website link posted, so what up?? And I believe you've even had a couple of posts dedicated to the betterment of your website....
/Doug, was reading through a few of your old posts recently. //I think they rubbed off on me... ///(I hope y'all know, I really don't care either way, just feel like arguing)
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged |
I had no idea you felt this way, and you should have spoken up sooner.
I didn't really see any type of conflict, as we target our sites at very different audiences. You have built a site and resource for sign-makers, and I have absolutely no interest in doing that.
Signs never Sleep is squarely targeted at the sign buying public. It is to be a resource and portfolio for the potential sign customer, and nothing more. (as it says on the ABOUT / FAQ page on my blog).
I don't want there to be the chance that any of my motives are questioned, so I will make sure that this is not an issue from here on out.
posted
I don't care either. I came to JD's defense on this same issue recently on another forum, because he appeared to be offering a genuine contribution, and those complaining were not the site owners.
I have absolute respect for JD's sign work, and his marketing diligence.
In this case, I think his post could have been less about receiving help thinking of a question, and more about riding Steve's coat tails, and Steve seems to see the possibility of that too. I believe it's uncomfortable for Steve to have to be the only one here looking out for Steve's interests, so once I read his post, I am showing some support for his point of view.
Believe me, I can be the king of playing devils advocate, and seeing the other side of an issue is a plague that haunts me without end...
...so I don't feel like arguing, but I also don't feel like Steve's point should simply die away without a little support, because if I put myself in his shoes, I might feel exactly the same way.
posted
Here is my 15 cents worth (Yeah, yeah, I admit I have an over inflated sense of self worth! )
First I do not believe JD's intent was to take advantage of Letterville. If he had a forum or plans to open a competing forum I think I might have a different view of that. We all do a certain amout of self promotion on Letterville, some a great deal more so than others.
That being said, I believe that Steve and Barb have very valid feelings of being taken advantage of at times, and I do understand Steve's reluctance to allow the repeated linking.
There are some good and honourable people here who do the right thing and become merchants because they fall into that grey category as to whether they should pay and have merchant status. It is very frustrating for them to see others gaining constant publicity for their businesses or ventures for free. Unfortunately there are so many overlapping areas in both intent and content that it is hard to define a line in the sand. I've spoken to two people that were interested in advertising on the site, but were too unsure of their possible gains by advertising here, and it says a great deal about their moral standards that they refrain from scoping a bit of free advertising. I've also spoken to others who I really feel are gaining a good deal of financial gain by their self promotion on Letterville, but do not feel the need to pay for it. In the end it has to be a personal decision, but I believe the decision does end up reflecting on the fibre of those involved.
There are also those who blatantly take advantage of the Letterville database for advertising purposes, who stage "innocent" promotional posts through third parties and who basically thumb in Shortreed's faces.
Both Steve and Barb have admitted to not being the best business people. Letterville is still the result of their dream that exceeded all expectations. The idea of it being an on going Letterhead meet with free exchange of ideas and resources is great. Unfortunately over time things tend to take a life of their own and it takes a great deal of dilligence to manage those who would sidetrack it or try to mold it into their idea of what it should be. It's the Shortreed's play ground, they get to make the rules and whether or not you agree with or like all of them, it is what it is, and in my mind it's pretty darn spectacular.
In the end the gauge as to whether you require merchant status should be the Shortreed's suggestions. I think that is the pertinent factor. If you are in that grey area I would also suggest you consider how your actions may be justifying or validating decisions of others.
Maybe I owe you guys 15 cents for listening.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Nope, but if you want to model for the Farmyard Friends gallery I will .... ya donkey.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
This topic was posted simultaneously on Signs 101 and got about the same response. Love....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Well, probably the thing that's hurting Mr. Iles is he has not made many posts other than to discuss his blog. If he was a resident (hint, hint ) it might indicate his support to this site and not come across to some as an ulterior motive.
I totally agree with the idea that this great community should not be taken advantage of by enterprising individuals. I've wondered about a few things myself occasionally.... just for example, all the workshops that are advertised here. Many cost thousands of dollars to attend and a large part of their attendees see their posts on Letterville.
I know we've all seen the posts about how they just break even, they are not making any money on these workshops (supposedly) but if 10 people are paying $1,000 a piece to attend a seminar, that's $10,000. You can't tell me there isn't a way to budget $500 to become a merchant out of that amount... especially if there are ongoing scheduled workshops.(hypothetical numbers, some of these workshops are higher than that, but you get the idea).
Well, that's none of my business.... that's between Steve and these individuals. They may be compensating Mr. Mayor in some way other than money... (don't want to know how) but as an onlooker, I would say that those posts are a lot more geared towards actual advertising to readers of this site than a discussion about one of the 133 million blogs out there on Mr. Gore's internet.
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
All I can say is you are right Jon. Letterville is not just a another blog or hobby. For almost 12 years now, this website has been our only source of income. Without going into details, there are arrangements made with most that directly benefit financially from the website.
I'm going to lock this post up and give JD a call on the phone. That's what should have happened in the first place.
-------------------- Steve Shortreed 144 Hill St., E. Fergus, Ontario Canada N1M 1G9 519-787-2673
Topic Closed
![[Bash]](graemlins/bash.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Rolling On The Floor]](graemlins/rolf.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
)
Printer-friendly view of this topic