posted
A very nice retired GM employee friend of my brother-in-law is a 'gentleman farmer' and was sent to me for lettering of his farm semi doors.
He brought a very interesting board from a small trailer his father had. The board contained some neat sign-painting from an old fellow from a few years back.
Apparently, the guy doesn't paint anymore - which is how I came into the picture.
I was pretty impressed with the painted board, frankly.
Anyway... he wanted something VERY close to how the painted board looked.
My main criticism was that I didn't personally like the 'swooshes' that the guy painted on.
Here is a look at the board:
Here is what I came up with - but I did my own little hand-vectored swirly-gigs.
The RED color is actually the color of the semi door - so it's background only.
Nothing earth shattering...but I think it looks alright.
I tried to talk him out of the humped up farms in lieu of something different, but he wanted the distorted word as is.
He also did NOT want the border...as a side note.
I'm thinking my design could have been better with some different way of approaching "FARMS."
So... here is the design without the word "FARMS" and I'd like to see what solutions you might have suggested.
Just a note - it's already a done deal - it's what HE wanted, which is fine...but I thought it would be a nice game to play for educations' sake.
What say Ye?
Oh... I should mention...he didn't want to pay much and I reluctantly gave him more than the 1-color I originally told him I would do for the money...but, he was sooooo nice and it's approaching Christmas...where's Cam when you need him??
Here's the file sans "FARMS"... change anything you want and give me your honest critique. Let's let this be a fun learning thing.
posted
Todd, try using something like Stymie, which is closer to the original. It looks somewhat better distorted. I would have liked to move "FARMS" up tighter to the name but didn't want to mess with the scroll. Also, I would avoid making FARMS in black as there is not enough contrast. Love....Jill p.s.s. I do not care for the grey/silver drop shadow. If anything, use black or burgundy.
[ November 24, 2008, 08:31 PM: Message edited by: Jillbeans ]
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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Just from a first glance, I think I would put some height on the name to balance with the way farms is stretched.
Try thinning down the strokes on the pinstriping, maybe make it a little more calligraphy style instead of all equal strokes, they just seem to over power a bit.
-------------------- Sam Staffan Mackinaw Art & Sign 721 S. Nokomis St. Mackinaw City, MI dstaffan@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1704 | From: Mackinaw City, MI | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Nice find with the old sign! I think your "scrolls" are a bit too modern, tribal, biker, vampire looking. Doubling up the original "scrolls" could make them work (a more farm/country simplicity). I don't mind any of your font choices but certain things bug me ... mainly the way the letters kind of slant, but not evenly, on the main copy (B= no slant, U=slight right slant, H's=slight, OLZ= way right slant). And what Jill said about farm being black. Here's my take on what you got... maybe some orange something in the corners also
.........oops, I meant "swooshes" not "scrolls" ......
....edit again (I should really read what I'm responding to first)... I think a border would tie it all together as long as it's not a predominant feature (why I went with a black one)
[ November 24, 2008, 09:39 PM: Message edited by: Mark Matyjakowski ]
-------------------- Compulsive, Neurotic, Anti-social and Paranoid ... but basically Happy Posts: 2677 | From: Rochester, NY, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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-------------------- Sam Staffan Mackinaw Art & Sign 721 S. Nokomis St. Mackinaw City, MI dstaffan@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1704 | From: Mackinaw City, MI | Registered: Mar 2004
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The fellow (I forgot to mention this) specifically said he hated the orange flick of color in the current painted scroll....don't know why, but he didn't like that little swoosh/color.
Also - re also specifically did not want the border.
I kinda of like the border myself....
Definitely like the reverse of the white vs black - good call!!
-------------------- Todd Gill Outside The Lines Potterville, MI Posts: 7792 | From: Potterville, MI | Registered: Dec 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Todd Gill: Looking good people!!
The fellow (I forgot to mention this) specifically said he hated the orange flick of color in the current painted scroll....don't know why, but he didn't like that little swoosh/color.
I kinda of like the border myself....
Definitely like the reverse of the white vs black - good call!!
Tone the swoosh down to a deeper color and show it with and with out the frame.
You maybe need to remind him of the Seinfeld episode- "The Soup Nazi"
My Way or--- "NO SIGN FOR YOU!"
-------------------- Sam Staffan Mackinaw Art & Sign 721 S. Nokomis St. Mackinaw City, MI dstaffan@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1704 | From: Mackinaw City, MI | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
I can't see any way to improve on Mark's design.
The only thing I would suggest is... If the guy is dead set against ORANGE replace it with Imitation Gold(Not as effective, but not Orange)
Then explain to him that while the white border was a little distracting, the black border really helps tie the whole thing together. Also having the name extend slightly beyond the border adds emphasis to the name.
-------------------- Don Hulsey Strokes by DON signs Utica, KY 270-275-9552 sbdsigns@aol.com
I've always been crazy... but it's kept me from going insane. Posts: 2306 | From: Utica, KY U.S.A. | Registered: Jan 1999
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posted
The only thing I can suggest which may help, is to lift the black outline & shadow of Farms off it a bit, and have an outline of background colour immediately around the letters, so the shading & outline more closely matches that of Buchholz.
As it is, the black right against the white of Farms makes it stand out a little too boldly for my liking, especially the M. I wouldn't mind seeing little mid points on the vertical strokes, like in Buchholz also, possibly. Maybe not...
Or else give Farms a smallish slab serif like Buchholz...I'm not so keen on the vast difference in the serifed fonts. I'd rather see no serifs on Farms, than differing ones, I think.
Buchholz is clearly of a thick & thin,(or thick & thicker) font, while Farms is a more evenly stroked font. I'd prefer if there was more similarity of style, I think.
I'm just trying to link Farms with Buchholz in some other way than just the white colour, that's all. I'd like to see some harmony or consistency across the words- not necessarily total duplication of font at all, but some consistancy, I think.
Maybe I think too much...it's late & I'm off to bed! Good work, Mark! Fun job, Todd- I'd tackle it with a brush & some good music, & leave the plotter turned off!
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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posted
Good suggestions Ian - and valid one's in regards to the "FARMS".... I might just go ahead and tweak that so it does have the red space between the letters and black outline....makes sense.
Still debating the font choice... time's running out!
-------------------- Todd Gill Outside The Lines Potterville, MI Posts: 7792 | From: Potterville, MI | Registered: Dec 2001
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posted
Ian's comments make a whole lot of sense. The point about the red space is especially important. Notice how the white in Buchholz looks warmer than the white in Farms and the town name. This is a result of the eye mixing a little of the red into the white, "optical mixing".
-------------------- George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@bigriver.net
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
posted
David, Grand Ledge would be better in process blue helvetica, I feel.
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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posted
Never think I don't appreciate constructive criticism. I pay attention and take the advise to improve my layouts. Dawud nailed it--a skull is needed. However, since this is a farm, I thought a cow skull would be nice.
I have such respect for Ian's input and have made the changes he suggested. As a personal tribute to Ian, I also included a tractor, complete with pinstriped carriage wheels. A few sunbursts and...
I stink I'm done!
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5102 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I like William's "Farm" and can appreciate the inline of red (the "optical mixing" ... I like that, learn something new )
That Boone is a wise man, I can see where a rectangle border might even look odd competing with body likes ... in that case I might leave the box around Grand Ledge, run the double lines out left and right and loose the border above that... or maybe turn the border 90 degrees and run it down the door ... or ... I don't know it aint my job, I'z just having fun.
David, you can't be done ... none of the lettering has bevels.
-------------------- Compulsive, Neurotic, Anti-social and Paranoid ... but basically Happy Posts: 2677 | From: Rochester, NY, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
You guys are NUTS! (But funny) PS How 'bout some barbed wire?
-------------------- Phil Swanson Lake George Lettering 151 New Hague Rd. Hague, NY 12836 lakegeorgelettering@yahoo.com Posts: 24 | From: 151 New Hague Rd. Hague, NY 12836 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Phil is on to something. No farm sign is complete without "bob wahr"--that's "barbed wire" for all you funny talkin' folks who ain't from Texas.
Todd, with all the input you've gotten to date, I think you should insert a digital print and upsell him to a full wrap.
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5102 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Hey, I recognize that last layout. There's a bunch of van's running around Pensacola with that same design. I've never been able to figure out their company, so I'm gonna guess they are a plumbing outfit.
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
I think it needs a few airbrushed bullet holes in it now- that'll make it look really 'homely'!
(P.S. if you needed some real bullet holes, I'm sure I read somewhere that Roy Frisby was cutting up some of the smaller oil-well holes he was selling, into smaller packs- some might even be bullet-sized. It's worth an enquiry...)
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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posted
And now that the final draft is done, here is the best part.
We can print them for you for $0.25, no $0.15 sq.ft.
And you can have them in 24, wait no 12 hrs no um Ok 6 hrs, and we will throw in free shipping, Oh and we will laminate and cut them to size. But you have to buy at least two to make it worth our time.
[ November 26, 2008, 08:07 AM: Message edited by: Sam Staffan ]
-------------------- Sam Staffan Mackinaw Art & Sign 721 S. Nokomis St. Mackinaw City, MI dstaffan@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1704 | From: Mackinaw City, MI | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
See, this is where you guys all screw this up.
The first part of the Toddler's post talked about wanting something just like the first guy painted. Notice the inclusion of the five-letter word - P A I N T. So here's what you do, Todd. Most of us are getting a four-day weekend - just enough time to drive that rig over here and let me letter it up with P A I N T.
Too damn far, you say? Hell, take it over to Mike Meyer, or find one of the last two or three sign guys in Michigan who still knows which end of a brush gets wet, and give the customer what he WANTS - which is a painted sign. The fact that the original was no masterpiece isn't the point - he likes that because it was real and human and organic, not designed and produced by a machine.
Does anyone else get that? Or am I just pi$$ing into the wind over here?
-------------------- "A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle
Cam Bortz Finest Kind Signs Pondside Iron works 256 S. Broad St. Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379 "Award winning Signs since 1988" Posts: 3051 | From: Pawcatuck,Connecticut USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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OK I will do it for $0.10sq.ft. and I will do it on Thanksgiving day, but that is my best offer
-------------------- Sam Staffan Mackinaw Art & Sign 721 S. Nokomis St. Mackinaw City, MI dstaffan@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1704 | From: Mackinaw City, MI | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Sam's gonna have to reprint these, but since he's getting all our business and can reuse the ones he's already done if he just cleans the ink off, I think he should do them for a dime a square foot.
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5102 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Ok David. That looks AWESOME. I'll take 20 prints of that. But first I want to make SURE your printer is Pantone calibrated and I need the gray to be PMS 4233, the tractor Pantone 2353 and the skull PMS 9384.243... on the blue lettering, I like the PMS 299.5 but you MIGHT want to bump it up to a 300. And do you know, until I took that online tutorial on logo design, I thought PMS stood for something completely different!
Oh, and just a couple things I'd like to see adjusted, shouldn't take you more than a minute. Could you move the flames up about 3/8"? And I'd like to see it with the tractor facing the other way... I think it would convey more of the spirit that we are reaching 'out' instead of looking 'in'. Also, the cows skull is missing a few teeth and we don't have redneck cows here. Just add a few in there to make sure it looks appropriate. Also, I may be looking at it wrong but to me, the little tail thingies on the letters look like they may be just a little bigger on the 'B' than the other letters... can you just shrink them a tad?
Other than that, I LOVE IT. I guess you'll be printing them as soon as you make the changes. Can I just wait on it?
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
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Maybe scale Farms down in height a tad.
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