posted
I'm repairing a HDU sign that was damaged by hail. I removed all the copromised/bruised HDU and now I need to fill the resulting holes. I thought of sculpt or smooth, but I am concerned that the repairs will show up as shiny/smooth areas under the paint. I seem to remember a post with the solution a while back, but I can't find it. Will West Systems or PB Resin work with HDU crumbs?
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
I'd be just a bit cautious about using steam/heat to remove "hail dents" from a surface that had been already painted. While I don't doubt that it could work, my concern would be the potential for blistering the paint. Heat guns were originally intended for use as paint strippers, after all, and they do a good job.
Try it on an experimental panel initially, and perhaps it might give a satisfactory result.
[ July 01, 2008, 12:44 AM: Message edited by: Ken Henry ]
-------------------- Ken Henry Henry & Henry Signs London, Ontario Canada (519) 439-1881 e-mail: kjmlhenry@rogers.com
Why do I get all those on-line offers to sell me Viagara, when the only thing hardening is my arteries ? Posts: 2684 | From: London,Ontario, Canada | Registered: Feb 1999
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These were a little more than dents..ask Duncan about hail in Saskatchewan. The holes after removing the crushed and UV degraded material are about 1/2" deep and 1-2" in diameter, or golf ball size no steam iron was going to save this one, although I was amazed at what was accomplishable!
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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I don't believe you've given us enough information as to the extent of the damage. As Steve just posted, is the surface going to be stripped off. I guess it will be brought back to your shop.
Joe
-------------------- Joe Crumley Norman Sign Company 2200 Research Park Blvd. Norman, OK 73069 Posts: 1428 | From: 2200 Research Park Blvd. | Registered: Sep 2001
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I have the sign in my shop. I don't want to strip it because it has a bunch of layers that have been stacked, including dibond embellishments. The areas that are worst damaged are along the top and bottom edge of a protruding frame. There is also some damage on the gilded carved letters, but it is easier to deal with. I'm replacing the ones that were worst hit. The main face of it was made of insulation foam and hard coated and held up nicely. The top edge was also hard coated insulation foam and has a couple of areas that have cracked (like a stone chip in a windshield) and I plan to patch them with West Systems. They can't be seen, so I am not as concerned with them. The frame where most of the damage occurred is wood grained with latex paint. There are holes every 2-3 inches mostly along the top edge. One corner was broken off which I will glue a new piece of HDU to. I'd like to fill the holes, sand it over and repaint, but I'd like to work the paint so that it blends with the old on the areas that are not damaged. I don't want to take the whole sign apart in order to get at the areas under the Dibond elements. They are holding nicely and I think I might cause more damage trying to do that.
[ July 01, 2008, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: Kelly Thorson ]
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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Kelly, if you can drill the dents out cleanly, you could get a plug cutter and make plugs out of matching HDU. You make the plug by drilling into a piece of HDU without going all the way through, then slice off the plug on a band saw or table saw. Then you epoxy them in, sand and fill any gaps in the seams with Coastal Enterprises FSC 360-WB. It is a super thick crack filling latex primer.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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Thanks everyone. I remembered I had a product that Rodger MacMunn had recommended called Quick Wood Epoxy. It comes in a tootsie roll that you just slice a piece off and knead. I had used it about three years ago to fix a mistake, so I went and looked and it is holding up fine. I went with it. If I remember correctly the finish is a little less plastic than smooth. Hopefully I won't need to do too much to make it blend. If anyone is interested it is from Lee Valley Tools
[ July 01, 2008, 01:40 PM: Message edited by: Kelly Thorson ]
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
I'll file that good idea for future use Dave. Thank you.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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posted
Dave's idea of a HDU plug should give the proper texture. And if gorilla glue is used there shouldn't be any seams.
The tootsie roll stuff makes me want to head for the refreshing cabinet. A dry martini would be in order......
Joe
-------------------- Joe Crumley Norman Sign Company 2200 Research Park Blvd. Norman, OK 73069 Posts: 1428 | From: 2200 Research Park Blvd. | Registered: Sep 2001
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I've used that epoxy putty for years. Great stuff.
Billy Maze (I think) is selling mighty putty on the TV. Looks like the same stuff for quite a bit cheaper than Woodworkers Supply. Haven't checked out Lee Valley's price yet.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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I agree Joe, Dave's idea was probably the best one, unfortunately I had already done the repairs. I have to do a road trip and want to combine three jobs (reinstall of that included) so I was in a hurry. Next time. dave I hink that stuff is about $8 for a 2oz roll at Lee Valley.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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How are you? We make a few products that can help with hail damage. The FSC-360 putty will work great (thanks Dave for mentioning it), we also have the PB Resin (epoxy) and the PB Hard Coat. The PB Hard Coat we actually used at the Tomahawk LH Meet to fix a hail damaged sign. It's a powder and acrylic resin that you mix to the consistency that you want. It's a really cool product, have you tried it? (I know you've used the PB Resin)
Let me know if you'd like a sample.
Thanks! Kellie
-------------------- Kellie Miller Customer Service Mgr. Coastal Enterprises Company Mfg. of Precision Board (800) 845-0745 www.precisionboard.com hdu@precisionboard.com Posts: 118 | From: Orange, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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Hi Kellie, I'd like a sample. Actually I wouldn't mind a small sample of your HDU. I understand there have been some improvements since I last used Precision Board.
I did finally manage to get some PB Resin and I really like it. I'd love to buy some Hard Coat but have run into some of the same troubles trying to get it as well as the Fast Set and Texturizer. But in all fairness I just asked my supplier to bring it in and let it drop when I had no luck, and I realize it isn't a "hot" item for them.
It's nice to see you here, I like it when merchants take the time to field questions.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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Yes, we've made a lot of improvements with Precision Board since you've last tried it. We've actually changed the formulation, and are now manufacturing it with eco-friendly 'green' polymers! It's also easier to carve, prime and paint.
We have a new distributor in BC that is stocking PB. I'll send you their information, and they have various branches. (I know it was a difficult time with the PB Resin and I apologize for that)
I'll get the samples out to you, and find you later to hear what you think.
Thanks, it's nice to see you too. :-)
Take care, Kellie
-------------------- Kellie Miller Customer Service Mgr. Coastal Enterprises Company Mfg. of Precision Board (800) 845-0745 www.precisionboard.com hdu@precisionboard.com Posts: 118 | From: Orange, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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Russ.......one part of the PB resin goes solid very quickly, like in 4 - 6 months. However, just put the container in a pot of boiling water or in a big microwave & it becomes liquid again. It's not a fast mover for distributors, so I've bought it with the one part solid. No problem. Sometimes we use a lot of it & then none for a while. I've had to liquify it more than once on occasion & the resin still performs the same.
-------------------- Rodger MacMunn T.R. MacMunn & Sons C.P.207, Sharbot Lake, ON 613-279-1230 trmac@frontenac.net Posts: 472 | From: Sharbot Lake, Ontario | Registered: Nov 2003
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Ditto to what Rodger said. Uh, don't try to melt it with short microwave blasts - sometimes I get real stupid ideas. Russ, mine must be 3 or 4 years old and seems OK.
[ July 03, 2008, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: Kelly Thorson ]
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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It can be true about the Part A of PB Resin becoming harder and more crystalized. (we've noticed that happening if the kit gets too cold)
Yes, you can heat it back up by putting in hot water, setting it outside where it's warm, or even the microwave idea. (Kelly, it's actually a great idea, why didn't it work for you?) You don't want to get it too hot though, or once you mix it you're already into your working time. (if you want to know more, please call)
Once the PB Resin is back to working condition, it is fine. I've frozen it many times and heated up and worked with it again. I've also frozen a piece in the middle of it curing and once it went back to room temp, it continued its curing cycle and was fine.
I would recommend that you put a UV clear over the finished piece so it will last longer outside. There are UV prohibitors in the PB Resin, but it was too cost prohibitive to add more, when most people have a UV clear in their shop.
If anyone wants any samples or needs additional information, please let me know.
Thanks! Kellie
-------------------- Kellie Miller Customer Service Mgr. Coastal Enterprises Company Mfg. of Precision Board (800) 845-0745 www.precisionboard.com hdu@precisionboard.com Posts: 118 | From: Orange, CA | Registered: Feb 2002
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-------------------- Jane Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, Il. 61764 815-844-7024 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 4102 | From: Pontiac, IL USA | Registered: Feb 1999
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Great stuff too, I mentioned my concerns in this particular situation the first post.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
The holes after removing the crushed and UV degraded material are about 1/2" deep and 1-2" in diameter, or golf ball size ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
no steam iron was going to save this one, although I was amazed at what was accomplishable!
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
I had a product that Rodger MacMunn had recommended called Quick Wood Epoxy. It comes in a tootsie roll that you just slice a piece off and knead. I had used it about three years ago to fix a mistake, so I went and looked and it is holding up fine. I went with it. If I remember correctly the finish is a little less plastic than smooth. Hopefully I won't need to do too much to make it blend. If anyone is interested it is from ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
I have to do a road trip and want to combine three jobs (reinstall of that included) so I was in a hurry. Next time. ![[Mad]](mad.gif)
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