In my quest to continue this learning process of the eternal sign maker, I have another question…
Transferring a drawing!
I have in the past used “Sally’s wax free graphite transfer paper,” but found it to be extremely messy and time consuming. I am trying for the first time a Photo and Drawing Enlarger but am concerned with blurring and distortion at the extremities of the drawing/type.
Also, I know that the computer, as it pertains to type making is probably the “preferred” route. I would like to know what programs are the best and approximately how much they cost. I took computer courses throughout college and became very familiar with Photoshop, QuarkXpress and dabbled with Painter. We used primarily Macs and were brainwashed to never buy a PC because they were the devil’s tools. Since then I’ve denounced my Apple religion, even though I still think they are the best computer for art-related tasks, and have purchased a nice PC.
My question is, is there such thing as a wading pool in this ocean of professional sign making, or do I need to auction my son of on EBAY to purchase the necessary equipment? I hope it doesn’t come to that extreme but he IS testing me with this whole potty-training bit! (Just kidding with the selling of my son on the Internet, he’s really awesome and I hope he can throw a 95mph fastball left-handed!)
I thank you all for your advice and really appreciate your input.
The Art Teacher
-------------------- Jeff Margeson High School Art Teacher 49 Kincaid St. Bolivar, NY 14715 jmargeson@brcs.wnyric.org Posts: 29 | From: Bolivar, NY | Registered: May 2008
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Hi Jeff...You will get all sorts of differing replies to your question about computer software programs, so I'll stick my comment in first!!!
Check out Corel Graphics Suite. It gives you a great vector drawing program, a raster editing program and has an excellent trace program for converting bitmaps to vector.
I believe that the US price for full version of the latest, X4, is around $425 with the upgrade version going for $200. Well worth the investment. You can probably get X3 for much less.
-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
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Jeff, get thyself an overhead projector. Heck, you could probably buy a used one from the school. Best investment I've ever made. Love....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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You don't think the overhead distorts the picture the further the illustration gets from the center?
-------------------- Jeff Margeson High School Art Teacher 49 Kincaid St. Bolivar, NY 14715 jmargeson@brcs.wnyric.org Posts: 29 | From: Bolivar, NY | Registered: May 2008
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I am with both Dave and Jill on this one. Corel is a great value and you can eventually hook it up to a signmaking plotter some day. The projector does slightly (depending on the amount of magnification) distort the image, but if it is for a sign, it will be so slight as to not be noticed. You could bring your corel files to a signmaker to have them make you a pattern for transferring using powdered charcoal or chalk dust.
-------------------- Rick Heller Ohio Technical College 1374 E. 51st Street Cleveland, OH 44103 IOAFS Posts: 210 | From: Cleveland, OH | Registered: Nov 2001
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Jeff, I also use all those tools, but you can always use the good old fashioned grid method to replicate images or lettering. It strengthens your drawing skills also.When you get into it you'll want a plotter.Flexi and Signlab are good software but expensive compared to using Corel and some other bridge program to plot vinyl or paper patterns.A paper pattern can be plotter pounced, electro pounced or just use a cheap hand pounce wheel and a pounce bag with carpenters chalk.
-------------------- Darcy Baker Darcy's Signs Eureka Springs. AR. Posts: 1169 | From: Eureka Springs, AR | Registered: Nov 2007
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Sometimes I think I need a "Signmaking for Dummies" book, because the last time I was "electro pounced" I wet the bed while covered with an electric blanket...
...any explanation of the "pouncing" technique would be much appreciated...
as always...thanks for the patience!
-------------------- Jeff Margeson High School Art Teacher 49 Kincaid St. Bolivar, NY 14715 jmargeson@brcs.wnyric.org Posts: 29 | From: Bolivar, NY | Registered: May 2008
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So it might have a slight bit of distortion? Who is going to know? we won't tell!
I have an old Art-O-Graph projector. It works very well. I like mine a lot. Worth every cent I spent on it.
-------------------- Bruce Bowers
DrCAS Custom Lettering and Design Saint Cloud, Minnesota
"Things work out best for the people who make the best of the way things work out." - Art Linkletter Posts: 6451 | From: Saint Cloud, Minnesota | Registered: Jun 1999
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Hiya Jeff, For the most part, you are correct in that assumption. However, better overhead and opaque projectors have higher quality lenses and/or mirrors that minimize distortion. Another way to work around this is to design your graphic at a size so it doesn't fall into the distortion or project and draw it in several panels. Unfortunately, I can not recommend a good projector. But I can add that in the shops I worked where there was a lot of hand lettering going on, most used opaque projectors. I haven't seen one used in many years.
Havin' fun,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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It depends on the direction you want to take. I vote for Corel and a scanner. But if you want to stay in the only-by-hand realm a projector and pounce work just fine.
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You learn to compensate for the distortion of the OHP. You can rub chalk or charcoal just where you need it on the back of paper to get a home-made transfer type paper.
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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Jeff, pouncing is just making a series of holes through your paper pattern to allow chalk to pass through to you target surface.get a $5 pounce wheel from Fellers or Mr Art.Use kraft or pattern paper from your sign supply.place your pattern on a surface like a cork bulletin board or get a piece of that foam or pressed fibrous type insulation board to put under your pattern.Roll your spikey wheel over your pattern then you just pat the holes with your chalk filled pounce bag and you've got your image. It saves time over re-tracing with transfer paper on multiple panels with the same layout.I've got an old 1000 watt American optical opaque projector I paid about $1000 for back in the 70's. One just sold here in the classifieds for around $50. Keep your eyes peeled for an opaque.The are nicer than overhead even though harder to find.A school is probably a good place to look
-------------------- Darcy Baker Darcy's Signs Eureka Springs. AR. Posts: 1169 | From: Eureka Springs, AR | Registered: Nov 2007
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Jeff, you can get the Academic version of Corel X4 for less than $90.00. Since my wife works for the school district, she bought me a copy to play with, although I'm not sure she knows it just yet. I just loaded X4 and am toying with it. So far, I like X3 much better, however much of that may be my familiarity with X3 and the fact they changed the interface so much on X4. Starting out fresh, Academic X4 would be a good, inexpensive move. It's supposed to import all the latest Adobe stuff.
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5089 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Real "old Skool" - In the past I have drawn the design on kraft or butcher paper in pencil, put it on top of a scrap piece of styrofoam (or above similar substrates) and just used an airbrush needle (or even a toothpick) to poke the holes to make the "pounce pattern". It really didn't take very long and was kind of relaxing. That's the way some of the old masters would make patterns (with a sharp stick instead of an airbrush needle) Then just take an old sock and fill it with charcoal (or chalk powder,etc.) then just lightly pat the "chalk bag" on the pounce pattern and voila! your pattern is transfered.
I also have an electro-pounce machine (I love the smell of burnt paper...) and an ancient opaque projector that works well.
-------------------- Michael Clanton Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio 1933 Blackberry Conway AR 72034 501-505-6794 clantongraphics@yahoo.com Posts: 1736 | From: Conway Arkansas | Registered: Oct 2001
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Jeff. if you go the pounce pattern route, you may need to lightly sandpaper the back of the pattern to open the holes. I have found that perforating the paper with a pounce wheel will tend to leave small dents around the holes, on the back of the paper, sanding will make it much easier to use. When you rub the chalk or charcoal powder through the pattern, without sanding, it can cause the holes to close up. With an electro pounce you will not have this problem as the holes are burned through the paper. Hope this helps. Don
-------------------- Donald Miner ABCO Wholesale Neon 1168 Red Hill Creek Dobson, NC Posts: 842 | From: North Carolina | Registered: Apr 2006
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