posted
I just bought a new laptop and it has Vista. I hate it with a passion. It will probably be great when I learn it but its like having to go from CorelDraw to CAD.
-------------------- Laura Butler Vision Graphics & Sign 4479 Welch Rd Attica, Mi 48412 Posts: 2855 | From: Attica, Mi, USA | Registered: Nov 2000
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...Sorry Laura. Unless you are a PC holdout, (and you 'had' to buy one) why would anybody buy a PC (or anything sold by Bill Gates) after all of the warnings and negative rants that woefull PC users have already and repetedly been posting here? Did you miss the clue that these products will cause problems? It's like taking up cigarette smoking... perhaps, not such a good idea anymore.
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Well Laura, I'm sure you'll get used to it. Just like XP when it first came out, and all the other ones. It's just a matter of spending some more time with it. I was considering getting a new 'puter but decided to leave it until all the bugs are worked out. It CAN'T be that complicated or they wouldn't be making it the operating system for the masses. ( I can say that because I haven't tried it yet.) Keep plugging away girl.
-------------------- Deri Russell Wildwood Signs Hanover, Ontario
You're just jealous 'cause the little voices only talk to me. Posts: 1904 | From: Hanover, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Dec 1998
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Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6714 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Laura, you'll get it figured out, just give it some time. You can reformat like Rick's saying but like it or not, I'm sure Vista is here to stay so you might as well learn it now. Just keep your production computers XP for now while your learning Vista on the new one.
W.R. You better watch it! The mere mention of the word Mac to some around here is despicable and you'll be sure to be labeled an elitist.....LOL
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Laura, you can get an iMac in that price range and they're pretty SWEET, both in aesthetics and performance! The whole computer is packed right in behind the LCD and the whole package is only 2" thick. It sits on a nice pedestal and hardly takes up any room, but if you want the ultimate desktop space saving you can even hang it right on the wall.
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The 2.0Ghz 17" iMac would be in that price range. It's a nice machine.
Keep in mind there will be a learning curve, regardless of what the Mac evangelists tell you. Not everything on the Mac is intuitive.
Software and fonts are going to the be biggest problems you face. You have to make sure you can get Mac versions of the software you like best, unless you run the Parallels software, which allows you to run the Mac OS and XP at the same time.
My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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As my husband is in the computer industry, he too is not happy with Vista. He told me it is going to be a mess when I switch, but I plan to hold out for a long time. We had enough problems with XP.
And since I just got a new PC at the Beginning of this year, I am set for a while!
Good luck to those of you taking the plunge! T
-------------------- Theresa N. Hoying Visual Concepts 130 South Lester Avenue Sidney, Ohio 45365 937.492.2110 Posts: 176 | From: Sidney, Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I've never had any issues with fonts on my Mac. Fonts that I've been using for 10 years on PC work just fine on the Mac.
Software? Well all the main design, accounting, bookkeeping programs are all set for Mac. Sign specific programs are out there, I know there's a few Macheads here using them. There might be some specialized stuff that's not Mac friendly though.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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Laura, lets think about this. You are going to switch what you already have to avoid a learning curve, so that you can buy a different system, with a learning curve?
Really?
-------------------- Deri Russell Wildwood Signs Hanover, Ontario
You're just jealous 'cause the little voices only talk to me. Posts: 1904 | From: Hanover, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Dec 1998
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Laura, If your at all curious there is an amazing Mac User Group that meets close enough for you to visit. Wouldn't be a bad introduction and maybe you could find some other Mac/Sign folks. It's OK you can say Mac. http://macgroup.org/ Russ, No Corel, although there used to be. Just plain couldn't compete with Illustrator's already huge Mac base. They do have a mac version of Painter though. Deri, It's not only a learning curve, it's the farce that Vista became after 5 years of promises and postponements. It's another poor copy of what OS X was 5 years ago. In another couple of months Apple will releas OS X 10.5, Leopard, and the gap will widen even more.
If your really need some horsepower here's the new dual quad. http://www.apple.com/macpro/ As MacDailyNews puts it, "For when you absolutely, positively have to sequence the entire human genome before lunch."
-------------------- Bill Modzel Mod-Zel screen Printing Traverse city, MI modzel@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1356 | From: Traverse City, MI | Registered: Nov 1998
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We have been using Vista on some of our machines for a couple of weeks now, and although I will admit there was a learning curve. Now that I'm getting the hang of it I really like it. We do have a problem with our plotter not having drivers right now but that should be fixed before too long. If you have multiple computers I would keep at least one running XP. As far as switching to Macs there will be a learning curve with that too, and although alot of Mac users are super loyal, I see no real advantages to switching. And yes I have used a mac, and I am about equally familiar with both systems. What is your exact problem with Vista? Maybe it is something that can be solved easily, or something we already went through when setting up our system.
posted
Laura, I was just on Dell's website looking at computers because my good one had a total meltdown. According to their site, they are still shipping computers with XP until the issues with Vista are resolved. You might want to look into it.
-------------------- Kimberly Zanetti Purcell www.amethystProductivity.com Folsom, CA email: Kimberly@AmethystProductivity.com
“Organizing is what you do before you do something, so that when you do it, it is not all mixed up.” AA Milne Posts: 3722 | From: Folsom, CA | Registered: Dec 2001
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I've toyed with the idea of moving over to Mach but like Janette mentioned, get ready to find some extra money. Can you imagine having to buy a replacement verison of Enroute $5000 or ArtCam $7000 or Flexi %4000 not to mention all the other pc itmes. It's a real deal breaker.
For all those who taut, making the move over to another system, PC or Mac, should be more considerate. Even if one of these systems it superior, for many of us it's not ever going to an option.
-------------------- Joe Crumley Norman Sign Company 2200 Research Park Blvd. Norman, OK 73069 Posts: 1428 | From: 2200 Research Park Blvd. | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
With $79 "Parallels" software, you can run PC programs right in the Mac OS environment. I have CorelDRAW X3 that runs right along with the Mac stuff.
2 computers for the price of one-- it was a no brainer for me! I got the 24" imac for about $2k and a Macbook laptop for about $1100.
-------------------- Michael Clanton Clanton Graphics/ Blackberry 19 Studio 1933 Blackberry Conway AR 72034 501-505-6794 clantongraphics@yahoo.com Posts: 1736 | From: Conway Arkansas | Registered: Oct 2001
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posted
I never thought to try a PC font on a Mac. Interesting. I tried it with two fonts today. One worked, and the other one didn't. Both installed fine, but one wouldn't show up when I tried to type something with it in Illustrator. I gave an error about not being able to preview. The other worked like a charm. I opened the failed font in Fontographer, saved it as a Mac font, and it worked fine after that. Anyway, I'm glad for that bit of info. Thanks Mike.
My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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Deri, If I am going to have to learn new software/computer it had better be worth it. A new OS like Vista is just not worth it to me. I guess that I am getting to that age that I am just tired of learning new software.
One of my concerns with getting a MAC how much of my existing software could I continue to use and how much was I going to have to purchase. I sounds like I could use pretty much everything.
Ben, I can't figure out how to create new identities in Microsoft Mail. I use my husband's dial up account at home and then create identities for about 3 different emails. It doesn't appear that I can do that now without having to log off and log on as a differnent user.
[ April 04, 2007, 11:50 PM: Message edited by: Laura Butler ]
-------------------- Laura Butler Vision Graphics & Sign 4479 Welch Rd Attica, Mi 48412 Posts: 2855 | From: Attica, Mi, USA | Registered: Nov 2000
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posted
OLD ADAGE FOR PC OWNERS....ALWAY STAY ONE VERSION BEHINF NEWEST AVILABLE VERSION!!!!! ive alway stuck to this, and have had little problems moving from 95 to 98, wasnt dumb enough to load MILLENIUM...went to xp after the 1st SERVICE PACK was out a couple months..... VISTA is the MONOPOLY PACKAGE for M/S!!!!! it makes you pay and pay and pay....
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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quote:Originally posted by Russ McMullin: I never thought to try a PC font on a Mac. Interesting. I tried it with two fonts today. One worked, and the other one didn't. Both installed fine, but one wouldn't show up when I tried to type something with it in Illustrator. I gave an error about not being able to preview. The other worked like a charm. I opened the failed font in Fontographer, saved it as a Mac font, and it worked fine after that. Anyway, I'm glad for that bit of info. Thanks Mike.
The fact that PC fonts will work on a Mac, but Mac fonts WON'T WORK on a PC speaks volumes to me.
I use a Mac for my work from home and a PC at my part-time job and I can honestly say that once Illustrator or Photoshop (or Dreamweaver etc. etc.) are open, there's virtually no difference between the two platforms.
I wonder if Adobe allows you to upgrade from the PC version to the Mac version. Anyone know?
-------------------- Paul Bierce - Designer pabierce@hotmail.com www.paulbierce.com Posts: 330 | From: Dix Hills, NY | Registered: Jan 2005
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Mercy! What's all this fuss about. Vista works fine for us. I like it. It's not THAT much different!
Why would you suggest to somebody to switch to a Mac just because they're getting their feet wet on a new operating system? Why would you want to scold somebody for their choice of computer systems instead of trying to help them out? If you don't have something helpful to say on this forum move to another post.
I've heard it before on other updates, and I heard it when people moved to XP. People like to rag and 2 weeks later when they finally get it they're singin' praises.
Give this some time and you will like it as we have.
-------------------- Bill Diaz Diaz Sign Art Pontiac IL www.diazsignart.com Posts: 2107 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Dec 2001
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posted
So, Laura, let me get this straight, you hate Vista because you can’t get the mail to work? And so you are planning on switching to a Mac platform where you have to learn even more? I’ve used Macs quite frequently and I’ll admit OSX isn’t that hard to learn but I don’t think Vista is that hard either. But I do know this: the amount of things you would have to relearn if you bought a Mac greatly outnumbers the things you need to know to switch to Vista. Like my Dad said it isn’t that different from XP. And He’s an old guy!!!!
As others suggested before, you could load up other software or XP on to a Mac so that you can run you Windows compatible software. But doesn’t that defeat the purpose. It sounds to me like you are having problems with the OS not the computer it’s self. It doesn’t make sense to me to trade in a perfectly good machine to buy a completely different one only to have to reload Microsoft software.
I don’t think these Mac fans are being helpful at all… the advice they are giving you is bad. To me it seems like they want you to switch systems just to support their claims that Mac is better then PC, not to help you, It seems like they see this post as a another chance to bash PC users and make them feel inferior. Just another chance to complain about an OS they haven’t even used.
I suggest you give Vista a chance. We love it here. And if that’s not an option, if you really hate Vista, reformat and put your older XP on it. But you don’t need to buy a whole new Computer and OS, mainly because that won’t solve your problems. You will have to learn a new system (which it sounds to me like that’s your problem in the first place) and you will most likely spend even more money.
I can possibly help you with your problems with Windows Mail. To add new users go to “Tools” then “Accounts” then the “Add” button, simply fill out the information for the additional accounts. It’s also very possible to install your older Mail program on Vista. That is always an option
Also, feel free to call us if you need any help.
[ April 05, 2007, 10:52 AM: Message edited by: Joseph Diaz ]
-------------------- Joe Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, IL 61764 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 538 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Aug 2005
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Give it some time and you will probably adapt to it fine Laura. I guess when you post in frustration with a title "I HATE Vista" you are basically inviting all the "switch to Mac and your problems will be over" posts. I find that I get really frustrated when I have to work with a new OS as well. I quite enjoy working with new software, but an OS is in your face all the time. There are diehard Mac fans and diehard PC fans here, those who I have spoken to that operate with both seem to think that there isn't a huge difference although they lean slightly towards the Mac for performance and slightly to the PC for software compatability. I think that switching platforms is going to have a learning curve as well. If you have the time to handle the learning as well as the finances to replace software then maybe this is as a good a time as any. But I do think you should seriously consider whether it will be the right solution for you. Good Luck whichever road you take. Eventually your choice will become familiar and comfortable to you.....and then they will change it again.
-------------------- “Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again?” -Winnie the Pooh & A.A. Milne
Kelly Thorson Kel-T-Grafix 801 Main St. Holdfast, SK S0G 2H0 ktg@sasktel.net Posts: 5496 | From: Penzance, Saskatchewan | Registered: May 2002
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Well, I think a lot of people are really getting disgruntled with Windows in general so I really see no harm in recommending something different. It's so easy for me to spend your money....LOL
IF YOU ENJOY THE GYMNASTICS OF KEEPING WINDOWS SECURE THEN BY ALL MEANS CONTINUE ON.
As Michael so elegantly pointed out the so called Holy Grail of sign making (Corel) can be run on a Mac along with all your Cad programs. Have many times does it need to be pointed out, that all these old arguments of "it will cost you way too much money to move to a Mac. You'll have to replace all your software" and on and on and on, no longer hold true!
A learning curve is a learning curve no matter which OS. But again like Michael said, for $79 "Parallels" will allow you to run XP or Vista right along side OS-X....no rebooting, just like jumping from one program to the next. You will need a legal retail copy of Windows too.
I've seen 20" refurbed (same warranty as new) iMacs at the Apple store for a little over $1000.....For about another $120 you can buy Apple Care and the entire system down to the mouse will be repaired or replaced for 3 years if anything should go wrong. This also includes technical phone support for the whole 3 years so any questions you have about how to operate the new OS will be answered and anytime I've called Apple I was talking to an ENGLISH SPEAKING human being from the US not India or God knows where, in max of 5 mins.
So in a nut shell you get two computers. One that is extremely secure and stable, that you can start to fall in love with and eventually maybe switch over completely to and one that is extremely un-secure and finicky, that you can continue to run all your existing software on.
posted
Joe, so what you suggest is to buy a Mac and load it up with OSX and Vista? How does that solve the problem she’s having? Now she would have to learn two new operating systems, and pay for both of them too. So even if she gets the replacement Mac that cost the same as a PC she will still be spending more and learning more. And… chances are if she were to do what you suggest she would be using windows the majority of the time anyway to run windows based software that she already owns, she wouldn’t be taking advantage of all the superior features that you claim Mac has. She is having an issue with learning new “software” so your advice would be to change the “hardware”? I don’t get it. I’m not trying to say one system is better than the other, but I wonder if your advice is helpful.
-------------------- Joe Diaz Diaz Sign Art 628 W. Lincoln Ave. Pontiac, IL 61764 www.diazsignart.com Posts: 538 | From: Pontiac, IL | Registered: Aug 2005
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Joe, NO she can load XP, it doesn't have to be Vista. Laura is familiar with XP correct? So instead of learning two OSs like your saying, just one really good one OS-X
posted
I hated Vista at first, but am getting a little used to it. We don't have it on our computers but I've done a couple doc/prog/file swaps for people getting new computers and it seems to work pretty good. The problems I had were more with getting the internet to work well, but after I went in and turned off a bunch of the advanced services, it seems to have fix the problem...
I agree with Kelly, it may just take a little time to get used to it. My dad is the world's worst for resisting changes to new programs. He even had an old Win98 box running just so he could use his DOS CAD program. He'd updated to the new ones but didn't like them as well... when I started doing CAD for him, I used the newest and loved it so much I got him talked into using it and now he can't believe he used to like that old DOS program better...
As far as the Mac to PC debate, you hear a lot of these sign/graphic guys touting Macs but they have their problems too... I'm sure if you type in 'Mac problems' in g00gle you'd see tens of thousands of hits...
I worked at a PC sales/repair place for several years and we sold on average probably 5 or 6 systems per day and had a bunch of techs running around, with MCSE, CCNE, RHCP, and other cool initial certifications... none of them knew how to fix a Mac. We did get a fair amount of people bringing them in with problems, and we didn't even know where to send them. We didn't know of one repair shop in the Pensacola/Mobile area (about 1.5 mil people) that dealt with Mac repair.. I think there may be one place in Pensacola now, but it looks like a fly-by-night outfit and still don't know if I'd send anyone there.
I guess my point is, Macs are great, I've operated them but never owned one, but for the normal user who would like to be able to go out and get local service, you need to realize you have a lot less options...
LOL... A SIDENOTE: I wondered how many hits I'd get so I typed "Mac Problems" into Google... hmm.. 75.8 million results, so SOMEONE SOMEWHERE is having a problem, they ain't perfect.. hehe.
[ April 05, 2007, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: Jon Jantz ]
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
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Only 173 million hits for "windows problems" and only 32 million for Vista so far...how long has that system been out? Maybe I'll switch over....just kid'n!
I must say that when I first upgraded to Mac's OSX from OS9, I was a bit freaked out. There were a few things I thought I didn't like very much. I could easily switch back to OS9 whenever I wanted to (it was built in to the upgrade), but the new features in OSX soon won me over and I never looked back.
If you give Vista a little time Laura, I'm sure you'll get used to it.
posted
Honestly...I'd never buy a Mac that is built along with the lcd....I've had too many lcd's go out and if your computer is part of it - you're screwed....
To me...the desktop quad would be the way to go. If the monitor takes a dive, you can quickly hook up another...
-------------------- Todd Gill Outside The Lines Potterville, MI Posts: 7792 | From: Potterville, MI | Registered: Dec 2001
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All these Mac users are trying to get you to convert. Next thing you know you're gonna be sittin in the middle of a field waitin for Hale Bop and they'll be askin you to drink the juice. Just kidding Mac users only drink blood.
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Sorry Jon, I came up with 73.1 Million for Mac problems..
and 202 Million for Windows problems.
Not that *all* those results in either search are even specific to computer issues though.
Laura wants a new computer, she's buying new hardware either way.
If she buys a Windows system now she's going to get Vista. Now, it sounds like her current mail problems are an easy enough fix, but what about all her other software? Will she still have to upgrade to new Windows versions of her current software so it all works bug-free under Vista? Adobe isn't supporting their current software under Vista so if she's using any of it and has problems that mean downtime for her business, she'll have to buy *completely new seats* of everything because upgrade versions based on the previous installs will still not work right. Actually, if she's adding a computer to the game and not just replacing one with something new, she'd have to buy all new seats of software anyway. What about her sign-specific software? Does it all work bug-free *today*? If the sign software companies plan to update their software for Vista that's all well and good but what about the work that needs to get done today?
OK, she could format the new system and install XP to get around those issues. She'd have her familiar OS back, she could keep using all her current software, and she'd probably have killer performance on that new system using the less bloated software too.
So, if she goes one way she has bugs to contend with, maybe software and dongle compatibility issues. Another way she's having to reinstall an OS she already has.
Well, there's a third way here. She could buy Apple hardware. The hardware is hardware, Mac or PC it doesn't matter, it all works the same. The new hardware will come with a new OS that she'd have to learn, which is a boat she's already in anyway with her current new setup. If she's going to take the time to format a new system to install XP, which she already owns, she could just install it on Apple hardware right along the existing OSX. With her familiar XP she can now use her other current software without buggy issues.
She really hasn't lost anything by going with Apple hardware. She has her new sleeker faster hardware, she's got her familiar OS and software so she's in business and cooking with gas and no bugs in the soup.
She also has a new OS to mess around with, one that could bring her a different computing experience. She could take her time to explore it and see if she likes it, without risking productivity in her business because all her previous software works just as it used to. Maybe at some point she decides she likes it and upgrades her software to Mac format one title at a time. If she doesn't like it, no big loss, her computer still works just the same with her familiar OS and if she decides to jump into Vista again in the future, she can still put it on her Apple hardware.
There's nothing at stake, nothing to lose by trying out an Apple.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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