posted
I'm pulling my hair out here - new, potentially good customer who you want to make a good impression on jitters.
He has a cube van with a 8'x19' box, 4 rows of tightly spaced rivets. He wants it lettered both sides, on the front over the cab, and in the rear on a panel door. There is only about 3' vertical on the panel door to work with, as he has a lift mounted there. Copy - red, black and blue, no outlines, shadows or special effects, but it will fill the area nicely. I haven't done a job just like this since I've been tracking my hours, but I figure around 27 hours total, plus $250 worth of material, for a bid of $1695. Am I anywhere close????
-------------------- Patrick Wedel North Country Signs Barron, Wisconsin Posts: 72 | From: Barron, WI | Registered: Dec 2004
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If you are having trouble conceptualizing that cost. Break it down this way. Would you even consider doing a 3' by say 17' area of signage for anyone for for less than a thousand bux? (and that's just the dimensions of the actual copy space, on only one side of this vehicle ...with rivets no less!)
You are providing them a billboard of advertising space. A rolling billboard at that. That has significant value.
Don't sell yourself short on this stuff. ~nettie
(Incidentally, I lettered a van for a repeat client this year for 1200.00 It was a design I've done for them on 3 other vans, which is why I kept the price the same as the original, which was done 3+ years ago.)
-------------------- "When Love and Skill Work Together ... Expect a Masterpiece"
posted
Just punching it in by sq. ft. I came up with about the same price as Nettie. I think you're at least $1,000 low.
-------------------- Ricky Jackson Signs Now 614 Russell Parkway Warner Robins, GA (478) 923-7722 signpimp50@hotmail.com
"If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants." Sir Issac Newton Posts: 3528 | From: Warner Robins, GA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
That bid seems low even to me, and I'm usually on the cheap end of the spectrum. It's easily worth $2K or even more. I'm thinking your materials cost will be closer to $400, and your design time, cutting/weeding/masking, applying... and the rivets too! Don't sell yourself short! Isn't it something like $1500 to wrap a VW Beetle? Love....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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posted
Its interesting the vibes you get from people. I shot him a bid in the ballpark of what I had in my original post. It was the classic "$-,---? What kind of guarantee do you have? How long have you been in business, kid?" vibrations. Vibrations that you have left some money on the table. Argh! The stupid thing is, he probably could get it done at a substantial discount from what I quoted him at the right places around here. Its amazing the lowball numbers some shops give out, and some try and jack up the cost after they do the job. One thing I have learned, and am constantly working on, is to get a price system established and stick with it. Sometimes you will be high, sometimes low (compared with other shops) but overall you won't lack for work, and you'll make money.
Anyway, thanks for the input guys.
-------------------- Patrick Wedel North Country Signs Barron, Wisconsin Posts: 72 | From: Barron, WI | Registered: Dec 2004
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posted
Think about what a YP ad would cost him for just one month. Think about how well this big truck will advertise for him. If he gives you the old complaint about your price being too high, say what Pierre Tardif says: "You will make more money from this sign than I will!" That usually shuts them up. Love.....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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posted
FIRST stop worrying about what the other shops will charge!
Price your work at what will make you a decent profit! If other shops are willing to work for peanuts, that's their problem! They won't be around long...and no sence you going broke along with them!
If you are getting more than 60% of your bids...your prices are too low!
-------------------- Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
si.allen on Skype
siallen@dslextreme.com
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!
Brushasaurus on Chat Posts: 8831 | From: La Mirada, CA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Although the size of the box has a lot to do with it...so does the design. We get some jobs that are a simple logo, a phone number, a punch list of bulleted items and maybe a slogan or website. This can be laid out to fill the area with proper balance of negative space and proportions of copy. Also shifting the graphics one way or another can help avoid rivet coverage.
What I'm saying is, a job like this can go a lot faster than 27 hours (especially if you have two people working on it) Bottom line, your price could be OK. If you could post a pic of the layout, I'm sure you would get better and more accurate feedback on your question. If it really is going to take the equivalent of three production days to do one cube truck, your price is definitely too low. Good Luck
-------------------- Tony Lucero Eagle Graphics Waterford, MI www.eaglegph.com Posts: 305 | From: Waterford, MI, USA | Registered: Apr 2000
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If it takes you 27 hours, that means an average $53/hour to cover labor.
Unless you have considerable profit built into a shop rate, you're not making any profit.
Using your estimates for time and materials in my own pricing structure I have $3k for starters. I ran the numbers again using an easy-breezy pricing method of Material$ X 10 that puts material costs at only 10% of the total cost which is pretty fair, add in some extra for dealing with rivets, and it's right back around $3k. I'd be wincing inside and preparing for "WHAT?!?!?!" when I present the estimate to the customer but that would be my bid.
-------------------- "If I share all my wisdom I won't have any left for myself."
Mike Pipes stickerpimp.com Lake Havasu, AZ mike@stickerpimp.com Posts: 8746 | From: Lake Havasu, AZ USA | Registered: Jun 2000
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![[Smile]](smile.gif)
but that would be my bid.
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