First, let me say that its not something I'm proud of. Just thought I'd share an experience. Perhaps someone will find it useful or have some insight on how to handle it. Keep in mind that I don't own the business even though I pretty much do manage the day to day operations and production. About the only thing I don't do is the office work and cut checks. I'm the boss's kid who will most likely take over in a few more years.
Sorry if this rabbles a bit.
Three weeks ago, a customer who was one of my dad's regular customers when he was running the shop came in needing a sign for a subdivision he had built. He needed it right away. That same week, in fact.
Now as some of you may already know, I've been busting my chops for the past several months working 10,12 and 14 hour days 6 and 7 days a week. I've had some problems with help not showing up for work and having a rather expensive air compressor stolen a few weeks ago. Difficulties but not impossible situations.
Anyhow, I told him that there was no way I could get the sign done for him that same week and that I was really doubtful I could have it done in two weeks. I explained to him that depending on the type of job, I was running about 4 -6 weeks out; that I couldn't promise anything other than I would try my best to get it done sooner.
I've done work for him in the past. He's a bit pushy and doesn't seem to understand the word "no" unless he's saying it. Over the years, I watched him talk a lot. One time he just showed up out of the blue and insisted that I ride with him to a Sam's Club that was 30 miles away in another town. He saw some aisle signs that he wanted for his own retail furniture business. I think Dad sent me with him just to get this guy out of his hair. Long story short, I did a layout and a quote and didn't hear back from him. I found out later that he had another shop do them. The signs that were done were not what he had asked me to quote on. I only lost about 3 or 4 hours on that one. I figure it had only cost us about $200 in lost production time.
He wasted a lot of our time by having us to do design work and then never stopping by to pick it up or bothering to return our calls. There was one time when he finally did call back 6 months later insisting that he needed to get with me about the project right then. And when he was told that the next day was the earliest I could meet with him, he simply hung up without saying a word and had another shop to do the job. I should add that this happened two days after we suffered our second flood a few years ago and that he was already aware of our situation. Since then he sent all of his work to a local franchise shop.
Well, that franchise shop finally folded last year. And last Fall, he began to send some customers to us. They have all been pleased with the service and have come back for more signs.
Well, lo and behold, the prodigal customer returned a few weeks ago and placed an order for a subdivision sign. Nothing fancy. Nothing all that difficult other than I am simply buried with work from regular customers, many of whom buy well over $50k worth of work from us every year without any hassles and always pay on time.
So, as I said earlier, I explained to him that I was swamped and that I couldn't promise to have the work done any sooner than what I told him. My boss called him later that day with the deposit amount. Well, instead of paying the 50% down as requested, he went ahead and paid for the whole thing in advanced. I didn't know he had done that until after he showed up two weeks later wanting to know why I didn't have the sign finished yet. He made a point of telling me that he paid for the job in advanced half implying and half demanding that I get his job done sooner. I explained to him again the situation and that while I appreciated full payment in advance, it doesn't add any more hours to the day for me. I can only work but so fast and that I had quite a few customers ahead of him.
This morning he walks past the office, through the lobby and into the production area where I'm cleaning out a paint brush. He begins to lecture me about how I had promised to have the job done within two weeks and how I let him down. And how that its now been three weeks and I still don't have the job done.
I'm irritated. I don't like being irritated. I get irritable when I get irritated.
I told him I said no such thing and attempted to remind him of what I said only to have him interrupt me repeatedly. He continued to dress me down and began suggesting that maybe he just needed to get his money back. He was tired of me letting him down all the time (huh?).
That was it. I told him I have a real simple solution to the problem. I led him back through the lobby and to the main office. With him standing right behind me, I told the boss in a rather loud voice to "cut him a refund check and that I wasn't about to deal with a**holes who waste my time and don't listen".
I walked out of the office leaving the two of them together and went to the other production building to fabricate some posts for another job.
I didn't care about the fact that I had already bought and cut about $600 worth of HDU material for his job. I just wanted him out of my hair and wasting someone else's time.
I found out later after the guy left that we still have the job. The boss promised him that I would have the job completed and ready to go a week from this Friday. She also told me that he was in tears after I stormed out of the office.
Part of me is disappointed in myself for losing my temper. I was told that I had used a few choice four-letter words about him with the two of them standing there. I really don't remember. Its been a long time since I had lost it like that.
But at the same time, an even bigger part of me wishes we had just given him his money back. Its hard to shake off the memories what this guy did in the past and how many hours upon hours we let him cost us.
So, I'll get the job done and I'll do it to best of my ability. But, if there is ever a next time, I'm going to sock the price to him. Irritability has its price and its gone up.
Thoughts?
.
[ September 26, 2006, 06:38 PM: Message edited by: Glenn Taylor ]
posted
You should have done it sooner. This guy will walk all over someone until he's shown exactly where the line is. I suspect that he'll continue to come to you & be nicer about it.
That is a tough spot for someone who doesn't own the company. The ideal situation would have been for you to explain the scenario to the owner and let her give you a solution, or to let you handle it how you see fit. Since the customer just barged in and started spewing, I think your reaction was normal, even if it wasn't appropriate
If it WERE your company, the only part of your actions that I would say was "over-kill" were the 4 letter words. Owners are allowed to "Fire" clients. Sometimes it's fun!!! If a client is too demanding, or wastes your time...Show them the door!
Time wasters are the number one reason that we don't have a retail storefront. By appointment only is the way to go!
-------------------- Tom & Sharon Giampia Creative Image Design Port Chester, NY Posts: 285 | From: Port Chester | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
..."he was in TEARS"??? NS? ...client has gone beyond the sign job, and into emotional teritory. ...just more good reasons to go solo. ...you've got problems w. your boss lady? This may be a good time to ask her for a raise.
I don't care if it is your Mom's company ... customers like him are a very large PITA! There is no reason to put up with their offensive actions! With the number of hours that you are putting in every week, obviously you don't need him.
If a customer tried that with me ... he would be coverd with contusions and abrasions.
-------------------- Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
si.allen on Skype
siallen@dslextreme.com
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Never mess with your profile while in a drunken stupor!!!
Brushasaurus on Chat Posts: 8827 | From: La Mirada, CA, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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You and I havbe worked together on several projects, and if you lost it, he musta really pushed it! Hope you added the customary PITA charges
However, I think his twin brother resides here in Michigan. My artist did some freelance work for a client of mine. He was so difficult to deal with, (ie: constant changes & contradictions), that she told him she no longer wished to work directly for him. If he wanted any further work done, he needs to go through me and she will do the work through me. He actually refused to listen.
He called me and ordered 5000 brochures, and said he is waiting for the final design from my artist, who he feels he has enlisted!!!???
This should play out in an interesting way.
Reminds me of the Simon & Garfunkel lyric: "All lies & jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest."
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3484 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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My mom own's the shop. I was made VP by her a couple years ago so I have full authority over pretty much everything except writing checks (which is fine with me). She pretty much handles the office and some of the customers who come in.
I've no problems with the "boss lady".
The business is in debt to the tune of about $750k due to the three floods we endured since 1999. If the business folds, she loses everything including her home. I won't let that happen. I volunarily took a rather steep pay cut to help keep things floating.
Business this year has been extraordinary. The only thing that has held us back is the lack of help. Even though we offer the highest wages for the industry in our area, its been difficult to find any willing to work let alone finding anyone actually qualified.
In spite of raising my prices significantly, I'm still struggling to keep up with the orders while at the same time I've been told by several people that some of my competitors are struggling. I was told by a competitor's employee who came by the shop today that they may be closing their doors. I don't say any of this to be bragging or anything. I'm trying to make the point that I must be doing something right. Over the past few years, I've cut out some of the types of work that we used to do because it wasn't as profitable as it needed to be. I have also "fired" (in a nice way) a few customers because I couldn't afford to spend 2 hours selling a $25 license plate to them.
Because of the changes I've made, we are generating the same gross sales we did 7 years ago with 2/3's fewer people and profits are higher.
I'm with Tom about going "by appointment only". Mom is reluctant and fears that doing so may unintentionally chase some of our more important customers away.
posted
Glen, I know what you mean about keeping your cool, but if you consider how hard you have been pushed, emotionally, physically, you name it... I think it was overdue! Actually, what better person for you to blow on than the one who needed to hear it the most?
And to think he was in tears, you hit him right where he needed to hear it! You don't have to feel guilty because obviously you are not a nasty natured person, but a good natured person. Sometimes it takes an awful lot to really get that result from a person like you.
And you know what? After seeing how good your business is doing despite the floods, I would say you & your mom have been BLESSED!!!!
-------------------- The Word in Signs Bobbie Rochow Jamestown, PA 16134
724-927-6471
thewordinsigns@alltel.net Posts: 3485 | From: Jamestown, PA 16134 | Registered: Oct 2002
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One of my stories...from the past...(15 years ago or so.)
Local flea market had called us numerous times over the years to come out and give quotes on jobs at the site. This, too, was when I was working for my father and had the 'conveinience' of going out and making quotes. This included doing sketches and a full breakdown of the prices involved. Never got any of the jobs... and all of the work that he had done by another shop were for s**t.
Finally, the guy calls again requesting another visit for an 'offer to bid the job'.
I told him that there was no way that I was going to go all the way back out to his site to meet with him and spend the time to present a fair and reasonable quote as it would be a waste of my time.
He started to get all beefed up about that and was YELLING at me over the phone. I maintained my composure for a while and tried to explain that I would go out there and quote his job for a reasonable fee. That really set him off.
(Paraphased)"What do you mean that YOU will charge me to come out and price a job that I might be giving YOU! YOU should feel lucky that I called YOU to see if you want the job!".
I still remained calm and told him that I had been out there four times to price jobs and had never gotten even one and that I had other customers that were waiting on me to finish the jobs that they had already ordered.
He continued on his tirade and started cursing at me.
I lost it...
I told him to stop yelling at me and never call my fkng shop again - go and get your gdm shty signs from the lousy sign shops that he'd been using in the gd past. I don't need your work and obviously you prefer substandard signs.
He was silent for a while and then said...
"Well you're an A$$hole and obviously you don't know how to keep your customers happy"
My reply was..."well you're the a$$hole...and how would you know if I keep my customers happy since you aren't one of them!
He hung up after that.
I was fuming.
My dad came in the room right after that and put his hands on my shoulders and said...
posted
Some people just need to be told no. Glen you did yourself a service by firing this customer and I really think you should send him his money back in a certified letter explaining that his business is no longer welcome. I am willing to bet that if you do his job the first thing out of his mouth will be that he should get a discount for the time he had to wait or that he isn't happy with the sign. Most people that have this type of mind set do not snap out of it just because you yelled that them once.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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I'm not the bosses son and I've built my business one customer at a time and after reading the whole (longwinded) story I wouldn't have done anything any differently.
My favorite expression of late is " I'm dancing as fast as I can" meanwhile I am adding to shop capacity with new toys.
-------------------- Mike O'Neill
It has yet to be proven that intelligence has any survival value. - Arthur C. Clarke
posted
It's up to us how we allow others to treat us. You may have finally got through to him that his actions are unacceptable. I hope so for your sake. Sounds to me like it's time to fire this customer imo. Why would we allow such treatment to continue?
posted
You've always seemed level headed in every post I've read. It sounds justified, so don't beat yourself up over it too much. I think we've all lost our cool and regretted it.
Sit down and talk rationally with him in the next couple of days (or when you deliver the sign is probably the best time) and try to patch it up and make him understand. If nothing else, you will feel better.
Sounds like you're about over you're cold. I got my wisdom tooth out. See, we always make it through somehow. To quote Ali: "I should be on a postage stamp, that's the only way I'll ever get licked."
quote:"cut him a refund check and that I wasn't about to deal with a**holes who waste my time and don't listen".
I love it.:)Customers that treat us the way he treated you deserve no less.
quote:After you finish the sign...pee on it.
Now that little piece of wit made me laugh hard for about ten minutes Pat.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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posted
Wow Glenn, I think you took too much crap off him before firing him; you went a lot further than I would have. Life is too short to deal with aholes and it sounds like you don't really need the work. Hire you some more help man.
Pat that was a great story!!
-------------------- Ricky Jackson Signs Now 614 Russell Parkway Warner Robins, GA (478) 923-7722 signpimp50@hotmail.com
"If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants." Sir Issac Newton Posts: 3528 | From: Warner Robins, GA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Well, since you asked for thoughts, here's mine, for whatever they're worth.
I think that you're attempting to do an admirable thing by sticking by your mom and doing all that you are to help her out. The event you've described seems totally out of character for yourself, and is probably the direct result of the stress you've placed yourself under. It isn't so much about an irritating and obnoxious customer....we all have those from time to time. It's more about your state of mind and well-being. What happened is probably a warning sign that you're stretched too tightly, and this guy triggered a reaction that made you snap and lose some control.
Hopefully, the 'boss" recognizes this and the precarious situation that seems to be developing. In all seriousness, Glenn. What will happen if you should become overly stressed and are unable to continue at this pace? Who is she going to find who'll step in and perform as you've been doing? Money is important, but not so much to risk your health and well-being over. Give some very serious consideration to slowing things down to a point where you're more in control, and less stressed.
This guy may have been an alarm bell going off, and you know how you reacted isn't "typical". It may well be that this situation is a warning that you're approaching a state of "burn-out", and that won't be good for anyone....yourself, your family, or the boss.
These thoughts aren't intended to be malicious or mean, but are expressed because I honestly feel that you're in some jeopardy, and should be examining your situation, and why you reacted so uncharacteristically.I hope that better days lie ahead for you Glenn.
-------------------- Ken Henry Henry & Henry Signs London, Ontario Canada (519) 439-1881 e-mail: kjmlhenry@rogers.com
Why do I get all those on-line offers to sell me Viagara, when the only thing hardening is my arteries ? Posts: 2684 | From: London,Ontario, Canada | Registered: Feb 1999
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posted
Get in your truck and leave him standing.Don't say anything...mess with his brain..let him wonder where you are..mail him a refund check and forget it.If he comes back, leave again..make up your lost time by intruding into his.Sooner or later you will loose this beligerent pest.I know..I've been there.If none of these sugestions doesn't work, ask him to go to lunch with you..get a table...converse with him for a minute...then go to the bathroom...and leave again.By now he's probably got it!
-------------------- Bill Wood Bill Wood, Sign Artist 3628 Ogburn Ave., NE Winston-Salem, NC 27105-3752 336-682-5820 Posts: 397 | From: Winston-Salem, NC | Registered: May 2006
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That one is to good to be true, I have a great story to tell you like yours... Hang on for a moment the phone is ringingggg.
I'll be right back! ...................................................................................................................................................................................... .............................................................................................................
[ September 27, 2006, 06:57 AM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
-------------------- Stephen Deveau RavenGraphics Insinx Digital Displays
Letting Your Imagination Run Wild! Posts: 4327 | From: Lower Sackville, Nova Scotia, Canada | Registered: Jan 2000
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posted
Thanks for sharing this! I think everyone has went though something very similar!
I have found that customers that are very demanding don't usually run a business in tip top shape, themselves, and take it out on distributors of their own the way they get treated, which is unfortunate and very adolescent. The chances are that this person doesn't really have anywhere else to go, even though you said he is a long time customer. You know darn well he's checked out other places - and prices!
Chances are others have gotten fed up with him or he found better quality through your company and he goes back to you guys because you never give him any grief. When he came back after weeks and said go-ahead and cancel the project - that is usually (almost always) a bluff. I'll tell you why. Would he like to wait that much longer at another company who has to start the project from scatch? I don't think so. Furthermore, a person should really tell him that if he CAN go somewhere else and get this done quicker to go ahead and go there. After saying that, you can tell them that they will find out WHY that company said they could get it done so much faster in the quality of the work that will be produced. - then add that there's a reason we we're so SWAMPED and just couln't quite get it done within your standards.
Great work takes time. Any quality or custom business owner knows that, and will understand that. Anyone else - forget 'em. They may complain a little, but who listens to a person like that anyway? Anyone who knows the guy will let it in one ear and out the other. You can't please unpleasable people - and you can't cut your own throut trying to.
I would like to add to this - Don't ever tell your barber you're in a hurry.
-------------------- Jessica Woodrow P.O. Box 212 Edgar, WI 54426 Posts: 16 | From: Edgar, WI | Registered: Jan 2000
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posted
Good job Glenn. 2 things: 1) Timing is everything, you hit him at a time when he was emotional obviously. Maybe you sacrificed yourself because it obviously bothers you what happened, but imagine what he does to everybody else around him- "perhaps" he learned something from this. 2) cut bait- send him a cheque Why deal with the emotional overload every time this guy comes into your shop? You are busy. You don't need that kind of crap.
-------------------- Deri Russell Wildwood Signs Hanover, Ontario
You're just jealous 'cause the little voices only talk to me. Posts: 1904 | From: Hanover, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Dec 1998
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posted
I dunno Glenn, I disagree with the others. I don't think loosing your cool with a client is a good thing that deserves a pat on the back, even if it was well deserved. The problem now is the client now thinks you're a real jerk. In his eyes, you acted in a totally unprofessional manner, and he's now going to inform others of the way you conduct your business. So, I think your next step is to formally apologize to the client, then figure out a way to reduce the stress level within your company. I realize that it's much easier said than done, but if you don't do something in the very near future, your mental and physical health are going to suffer. When that happens, your business will suffer too.
Good luck,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
Glenn, been there, done that... with a school-teacher who wanted me to re-do a rush, design-approved laser-engraved plaque for her 3 times because she didn't quite like it. Plaque was perfect, she just didn't like the way the design looked after it was burned, "It's looks different on the plaque than on the screen.." Anyway, I've told on here before what I did with her plaque finally... After burning the second one with her changes and she still didn't like it and she insisted I burn a THIRD re-do for free.. I told her I obviously wasn't going to be able to please her, she needed to go somewhere else for her plaque, and tried to ring the trash can about 15 feet away with it, missed and it bounced merrily across the floor... you should have seen the look on her face.
ANYWAY - I hate to argue with Checkers, because I respect his opinion, but she was high up in the school system, and I did LOTS of work for this school... (this was the only plaque SHE'D ever ordered tho) I never heard anything bad from them and they ordered just as much after that, if not more...
Other customers who know these jerks, know how they are and don't put much stock in their opinions. They are probably more likely to think.. "HAHA, you had it coming, buddy... glad someone finally put you in your place.."
-------------------- Jon Jantz Snappysign.com jjantz21@gmail.com http://www.allcw.com Posts: 3395 | From: Atmore, AL | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
That's cool Jon, thanks for the complement.
I like arguments and heated discussions; IMHO it shows that we're passionate in what we believe
Don't get me wrong, I also have a lot of respect for Glenn and would never expect something like this from him unless it was justified. But, to complement him and give him pats on the back is not right. How would you like it if the shoe was on the other foot and you were the one getting scolded? That's the reason why I say Glenn should apologize. It’s the right thing as a professional to do, plus, as an employee of an organization, it would reflect better on the company that he will eventually own.
I agree that if you have a problem, or can't work with a demanding client, you should fire him. But, this client sounds like it could be a good client. So, before you fire him, it may be worth the extra effort to meet with him to establish some rules on how things should work. With exception to your tossing the plaque across the room, the way you handled your firing of a client is ideal.
The real problem is that there are some other underlying issues that need to be addressed. The big question is why is Glenn so stressed? And what can he do to alleviate that stress? Because, if he doesn’t do something soon, he’s going to burn out, or worse, end up in a hospital because of a heart attack.
Sincerely,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
I have to agree with Checkers on this one. This type of outburst is highly untypical of Glenn, and I'm sure that it's related to all of the stress that he's been under. There's also another thing that has to be addressed, and that's his feeling that still tells him that he'd rather they should have refunded this guy's money and be done with him.
That's something that should definately be worked out with "the boss". In this instance, she really didn't back him up, but choose to keep the money and subject Glenn to "having to" deal with this customer, in spite of his aversion of doing so. Perhaps she too had best consider that her interests are hanging from a thread that's being stretched to the limit, and something has to be done to alleviate that precarious position.
Should Glenn go down for any reason, who's going to step in and do what he's presently doing?
Time out for a heart-to-heart discussion might be best for all about now, and the overall work load adjusted so there's less stress to a key person.
-------------------- Ken Henry Henry & Henry Signs London, Ontario Canada (519) 439-1881 e-mail: kjmlhenry@rogers.com
Why do I get all those on-line offers to sell me Viagara, when the only thing hardening is my arteries ? Posts: 2684 | From: London,Ontario, Canada | Registered: Feb 1999
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quote: I disagree with the others. I don't think loosing your cool with a client is a good thing that deserves a pat on the back, even if it was well deserved. The problem now is the client now thinks you're a real jerk. In his eyes, you acted in a totally unprofessional manner, and he's now going to inform others of the way you conduct your business.
IT don't matter. The day one lives in fear of being human is the day we all should die. I do not for one second feel this person has ANY credibility with his peers. They all know he is an @sshole. They will take whatever he says with a grain of salt. In over 30 years of being a busines person I have learned one thing. That is not to live in fear what one other single person has to say. Personally I do not listen to what some really bad @rsshole has to say about any one else. No one has to tip toe around any customer. No one has demean themselves just to be something they are not. Glenn is a human who is fed up. Good to see he has some stones. And, I'll bet that customer watches what he has to say too.
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5273 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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Checkers has a point, it's hidden well under his hat but.....anyway ..... I did a similar thing one time quite a few years ago. The customer was very similar to yours and I snapped just like you and basicly told him to drive quickly to my shop for I was about to throw his sign out into the road.
When he came to pick up his sign, which was not done, but our dealings where, I gave him his deposit back, ( I also wanted to make sure he wouldn't return ) and then politely appologized for "the way" I handled that situation. Not for throwing him out for he was a badgering customer, but how I handled it.
[ September 27, 2006, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: Bob Rochon ]
-------------------- Bob Rochon Creative Signworks Millbury, MA 508-865-7330
"Life is Like an Echo, what you put out, comes back to you." Posts: 5149 | From: Millbury, Mass. U.S. | Registered: Nov 1998
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Have you ever worked as a bouncer in a bar or maybe a cab driver? Sometimes kissing butt just is not going to work, I did the cab driver thing for about 2 years and some people just need to be scolded it is the only thing some people respect.
It does look like Glen will end up doing the job and we will find out then what the true colours of this customer will be. Hopefully for Glen it will turn out better but he has nothing to be sorry for.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
Checkers Glenn should be thankful that this sicotic person would tell his so called friends. They probably attended the same screw you out of patience class he attended.He should let a bunch confused associates who is this mans so called buddies take their business elsewhere.The road to hell was paved with good intentions!Some customers like traveling on it.
-------------------- Bill Wood Bill Wood, Sign Artist 3628 Ogburn Ave., NE Winston-Salem, NC 27105-3752 336-682-5820 Posts: 397 | From: Winston-Salem, NC | Registered: May 2006
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posted
I have lost my cool with a customer or two. But I didn't use profanity. Not that anything like that didn't run across my mind.
The last one, I told, in an angry tone of voice, not to bother calling me for another quote. He proceeded with "you know what your problem is...." (click)
That felt good.
[ September 27, 2006, 06:15 PM: Message edited by: Wayne Webb ]
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7403 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
Hey Steve, there's not much that I haven't done before becoming a sign maker
I feel your comparison does not apply here. It's not like we're dealing with a bunch of drunken sailors. The problem is an aggressive, and probably very successful, business man who did not hear the word NO. And since Glenn did not use the word NO, the client understood his reply as a YES (the sign will be completed in 2 weeks).
And it's not about, fear (Curtis), kissing butt or being a suck up. It's about being professional and running your business in a professional manner. From what Glenn stated, he pretty much knew he couldn't get the sign completed in 2 weeks. So, right then, he should have said “no, the sign can not be completed in 2 weeks”. Then, if the client was not happy with the reply, Glenn should have turned the job down.
Like I said previously, I feel that it takes a lot to get Glenn riled up and his actions may have been justified. But, this scenario is something we’ve all done at one time or another. No one likes to say no to a client or the extra business, but taking on extra work when we shouldn’t sometimes backfires. Under most circumstances and with most clients, this wouldn’t have been a problem. But, this time, it just didn’t work out.
I’ve lost my cool a few times too. IMHO, that’s not bad considering I’ve been working directly with the public for 25+ years. Twice was with senior management, and man it felt good. But, one time cost me my job. The only time I lost my cool with a client was about 21 years ago. I, like Glenn, was not proud of what I did.
Only Glenn knows what actions to take next and how this will eventually pan out. As usual, I’m sure he’ll use his good judgment to benefit to all parties involved. I’m just sorry to hear that he had to go through it to begin with.
So, Glenn, if you need any help, let out a yell. I’m not cheap, but I am easy (to work with).
Cheers,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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Hay Checkers I guess we will not know for sure what exactly was said and what was heard and I do agree for the most part if a conflict can be avoided then it is always best. But I do have to say that I was not talking about a bunch of drunken sailors, it's the people that have no excuse for the way they act.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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Hey Glenn, Had a similar stituation with a client, burst through my door wanting everything yesterday carrying on like a boof head! Champagne tastes on a beer budget. Just turn around and say... "NO MORE! THAT'S THE LAW, THERES THE DOOR!" Life's too short to deal with tossers. It will all seam better in the morning.
-------------------- Clinton Cooper General Manager ASGI Posts: 43 | From: St Marys NSW Australia | Registered: Sep 2006
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"I found out later after the guy left that we still have the job. The boss promised him that I would have the job completed and ready to go a week from this Friday. She also told me that he was in tears after I stormed out of the office."
Played......... This guy goes tire kicking and when the other shop goes out of business, he comes back thinking he will have his way. When he doesn't get it through you, he does through the boss and, without shedding a tear, wins. That's where the real frustration lies.
Since it was mentioned, being a bouncer for years always went better when my partner and the bar staff were all on the same page. We all knew the rules and, when they were broken by a customer, we all supported each other's decisions....without exception. Any second guessing the customers heard only lead to the situation being dragged out longer and giving them reasons to plead their case longer.
Seems like Glenn did everything he could to make this guy understand that there simply wasn't enough time available to do the job, but he kept looking for someone who'd say "We can do it." until he found one...in this case, the owner.
Just an example of how good in-house communication is a plus. If everyone is aware of the scheduling and time it takes to do a job, customers don't have the opening of miscommunication to use against them...and they sometimes will.
my 2 dracma... Rapid
-------------------- Ray Rheaume Rapidfire Design 543 Brushwood Road North Haverhill, NH 03774 rapidfiredesign@hotmail.com 603-787-6803
I like my paint shaken, not stirred. Posts: 5648 | From: North Haverhill, New Hampshire | Registered: Apr 2003
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I've been watching this thread, feeling Glenn's pain, yet not having any good response or advice. But it must have stuck in my head.
Let me preface this by saying one year, when the school spirit catalog came home with one of the kids, I was appalled at the horrid window stickers they offered. You know, the ones with a megaphone in the middle that say CHEERLEADER on top and Buffy on the bottom & such like.
Called the name on the flyer and offered my services. "Oh, we prefer to NOT buy from local businesses" was the lame answer I got.
Fast forward two years. I do a banner fairly cheaply for the wrestling club. Wow I think. Maybe I will get more work.
I also do banners & coro for the soccer club, but the softball club invariably buys Hellvetica abortions on a stick from some franchise shop. The neighboring school district bought $4K of sunbrella pole banners from me in January. My school district bought them elsewhere. No biggie.
Last week the wrestling lady calls again. She's bought the dreaded canopy and needs it lettered. I offer to make a banner instead, as we all know what a pain it can be to try to paint on a canopy or attempt to stick vynull to it. She says OK. She calls back the next day saying they have decided to use the banner they got from me two years ago instead. OK fine...whatever. I was polite to her tho.
Then Justis brings home the usual school spirit flyer. Again, they are offering atrocious window decals. But this time I notice that the woman I had spoke to about the wrestling was the contact person. I make a mental note to call her again, telling her I can make better stickers. But I am too busy with a big sign job.
This happened just today: I am sitting in my den, attached to my office, with the kitchen door open. I'm exporting to my plotter, busy at the computer. I hear someone open the door and walk in. It's the wrestling lady, who didn't even bother to knock/ring the doorbell.
She says "I was on my way back from ____ Signs in Butler. We decided to get him to fix our canopy, but he wasn't in like he said he would be." My blood starts a slow simmer. "The canopy is out in my car...can you take a look at it?" (it's raining cats & dogs here)
I already have made up my mind that even if I can help her, I won't. But just for the helluvit, I show her the decal brochure and offer again to make better products for her. "Oh, the principal says we have to keep ordering from that company." (probably the principal's nephew) "Oh, Okay," I reply. "It's a good thing that Knoch school has kept me so busy with signs lately." (now I'm getting catty, but she just doesn't get it)
I get my umbrella and follow her out to her car to LOOK at a fricking canopy. It looks like a fricking canopy. "____Signs said he knows someone who can sew letters onto it, but he wasn't there! I need this for next week!" (_____Signs specializes in custom motorcycle painting...he isn't going to bend over backwards for a canopy job that might net $75) I said "I'm sorry, but I don't sew banners. You will just have to keep checking on ____Signs to see when he's in. I have to go now, I'm busy."
GRRRR That woman, after picking my brain for what she needed, drove PAST my shop 10 miles to get her fricking canopy fixed by another sign shop! I am SO glad he wasn't reliable, because she's stuck with him now. I should have told her to get fabric paint at Michael's and do it herself...hahahaha. I really hate people sometimes. Thanks for letting me vent!
I've also decided that even if they are about to shut off my electric, I will not kiss people's butts to get cheap sign jobs. Who was it here that said "I would rather starve to death on my couch than working for peanuts"? Love....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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There's also another thing that has to be addressed, and that's his feeling that still tells him that he'd rather they should have refunded this guy's money and be done with him.
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