posted
Back in 2000, I remember posting about a customer changing their mind on a logo I started for them. They put down 40% and for some reason, communication stopped and I didn't hear from them again. I had done proofs and had gone back and forth. It was my assumption they may have simply changed their mind. This customer was nervous at the get go of the project for he didn't know what he wanted and he was apprehensive about paying someone to figure that out for him.
It's now 2006 and his office has JUST contacted me and asked if there could be a reimursement for at least some of his deposit. (LOL) He did not use any of my designwork I did for him. (I just checked his website)
To begin with, I didn't offer him an hourly rate, but a contracted price. His deposit covered sending proofs to him. He chose not to use what he recieved and moved on.
If I went purely by hour, I could say I owe him $100, even though that's not how the contract read. Obviously the idea was to carry the project to the end result.
In a good faith gesture, I could offer him the $100, and hope that our biz could still prosper somehow from him in the future. I'm doubtful though, we haven't even been in contact for 6 years.
In a proper biz sence though, to me my sketches and communication were within a reasonable $ amount for the deposit that was made. That is why I allowed the contract to be null and void and didn't request further payment.
I'm debating saying so with perhaps if there was any future vehicle lettering within 2006, perhaps I could offer a discount of some sort to offset the logo investment. I just don't want to come across that he was overcharged.
I feel badly for the end result to finish like this.
posted
Donna - seems like 6 years is a little long & very petty of them - I would politely decline to refund any funds but would do their work with another deposit. . .
-------------------- Carl Wood Olive Branch, Ms Posts: 1392 | From: Olive Branch,MS USA | Registered: Nov 1999
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posted
I think I would laugh and laugh and say to them that after six years they can not be serious. Next thing they will want interest.
-------------------- Steve Eisenreich Dezine Signs PO BOX 6052 Stn Forces Cold Lake, Alberta T9M 2C5 Posts: 774 | From: Cold Lake | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
I can see them saying they are finally ready to move ahead on the project, well not really, but wanting the deposit back is even weirder. I think the statute of limitations would have run out in anyone's book by now.
My mind wanders. And that's not a good thing, 'cause it's too small to be out there alone. Posts: 3129 | From: Tooele, UT | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
I would really wonder if this is a serious inquiry, & would hesitate to put anything in writing. I would tell them that to reopen the file would cost you time & money. If they want to invest time in visiting you at your shop, then maybe you might have time to look into the file & discuss it face to face. Then I would tell them it was writtent off as a loss already, so they are free from further obligation, & express an interest in keeping the door open for further work together.
posted
Quite often our contracts don't make it all the way to completion. Our projectts are complex... many things can happen ... financing doesn;t go through, can't get zoning... whatever.
If I take a deposit for design and I do the preliminary design and the customer halts it... I get to keep the money.
If I have done more work than the deposit pays off I then bill for the extra at a fair rate.
A deposit is just that... its a retainer to buy your ideas and time. And it's non-refundable no matter what.
After 6 years I wouldn't sweat it. I don't think it is fair they do either.
-grampa dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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This may be helpful for you in the future. It spells out deliverables, and 'kill' fees, etc. Lays it all of for them so that expectations are clear. My attorney wrote it up - havent had one person refuse to sign it.
"Some are born to move the world, to live their fantasies. But most of us just dream about the things we'd like to be." - Rush Posts: 1192 | From: Washington, NJ | Registered: Feb 1999
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Donna, its silly for them to think you owe them anything. They paid a deposit, you rendered a service and they failed to follow through without explaination.
Something tells me he's in financial trouble and is looking for any possible sources of money. No one simply comes back after six years looking for a partial refund on a deposit.
posted
"I'm debating saying so with perhaps if there was any future vehicle lettering within 2006, perhaps I could offer a discount..." ------------------------- Do what??? Let's see if I have this right:
1. Client did not follow-thru original job; in fact, 2. He used somebody else's product, and now 3. He wants a refund.
That's 3 strikes. You would give him 4? Occasionally you come across a hustler tactic that is truly breath-taking. It's like telemarketing and spam: Try something totally outrageous, decency be damned. It may offend 999,999 people, but maybe there's 1 in a million who will believe anything. The desperate have nothing to lose. Since you asked, I'd tell this scavenger to keep on looking.
-------------------- Bruce Williams Lexington KY Posts: 945 | From: Lexington, KY, USA | Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Donna, the brunt of the work involved in logo design is the creative thought process ... the ideas. You've done and presented that work for them. Whether or not they actually put those ideas to use is a moot point. They very well could have. In either case, you lived up to your end of the bargain and gave them creative time for a fee.
Nettie
-------------------- "When Love and Skill Work Together ... Expect a Masterpiece"
posted
Actually Dan S., the word "retainer" has a nice ring to it. I feel that it implies a higher standard than a "refundable" deposit. I'm going to start using that one And Donna, I probably would have laughed out loud if a client asked me a question like that. When you added up your hours, did you figure your full profit into the job too? When dealing with contracts and change orders, by law you are entitled to full payment of profit that you expected from that job, even if the client down-sizes or reduces the scope of the project. So, if you intended to make a $100 profit off the completed design, you are entitled to keep it.
Havin' fun,
Checkers
-------------------- a.k.a. Brian Born www.CheckersCustom.com Harrisburg, Pa Work Smart, Play Hard Posts: 3775 | From: Harrisburg, Pa. U.S.A. | Registered: Nov 1998
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posted
You should have horse laughed them Donna. Thats freakin' stupid of them.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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posted
I'd send them a letter with a lot of the what you posted above in it. 6 years is way too much time for them to even consider a response from you.
If the letter fails........call Dick Cheney!!
-------------------- Tony Vickio The World Famous Vickio Signs 3364 Rt.329 Watkins Glen, NY 14891 t30v@vickiosigns.com 607-535-6241 http://www.vickiosigns.com Posts: 1063 | From: Watkins Glen, New York | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
Totally bizare. But I've had it happen too. If you seriously think there is a possibilty of getting some work from them I would give them a $100 credit towards their next order. Make sure you get a deposit and payment on completion with whatever that is.
posted
Donna, This has happeded to me too. After I told the guy no, the next morning I found the back window of my pick-up shot out! Simply explain to him that you already spent the time on the projest, that is what deposits are for. I would not spend any more time in thought about a loosing project like this one. Next!
-------------------- John Arnott El Cajon CA 619 596-9989 signgraphics1@aol.com http://www.signgraphics1.com Posts: 1443 | From: El Cajon CA usa | Registered: Dec 1998
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I like your idea of giving them a $100 credit toward NEW WORK though. Getting new work out of the deal for a $100 discount sounds reasonable.
Simply giving back $100 for nothing is out of the question in my opinion.
-------------------- Jim McLain McLain Studios 1203 Main Street Asbury Park, NJ 07712 jlm@mclainstudios.com Posts: 42 | From: New Jersey | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
If you feel the need to give them the $100, do it to clear your mind.
But I would send it to them in unrolled pennies, covered in goat droppings, in a 100 condoms, the lubricated kind, tied in knots, filled with water(so the droppings would float), incased in several porn tape cases, the freaky kind, in a bright orange box with a label that said "Beastality r us"
just for the fun of it
-------------------- Snow's Sign Works 865-908-0076 snowman@planetc.com www.snowsigns.com
I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message... Posts: 1640 | From: Sevierville, TN | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Originally posted by jake snow: If you feel the need to give them the $100, do it to clear your mind.
But I would send it to them in unrolled pennies, covered in goat droppings, in a 100 condoms, the lubricated kind, tied in knots, filled with water(so the droppings would float), incased in several porn tape cases, the freaky kind, in a bright orange box with a label that said "Beastality r us"
just for the fun of it
Jake, do you happen to keep that stuff in a locked storage cabinet in the back of your shop? You know, just in case an occasion like this comes up?
Yeah, I wouldn't give any portion of the deposit back if they backed out at any time, much less 6 years later.
-------------------- Mark Kottwitz Kottwitz Graphics Ridgely, MD www.SeeMySignWork.com -------------------------- Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein Posts: 746 | From: Ridgely, MD | Registered: Oct 2000
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Why not turn it into an opportunity for a sale? Put a dollar figure on it..."$100 credit toward your next purchase of $1000". For all you know, he might tell a pile of people how fair you are and send more business your way - and what does it cost you, really?
-------------------- Jon Aston MARKETING PARTNERS "Strategy, Marketing and Business Development" Tel 705-719-9209 Posts: 1724 | From: Barrie, ON, CANADA | Registered: Sep 2000
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Jake, do you happen to keep that stuff in a locked storage cabinet in the back of your shop? You know, just in case an occasion like this comes up?
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