I remember hearing about a problem with Avery HP vinyl a while back. Does anyone know when the "bad batches" of Avery were?
I just saw a customer of mine that I lettered his truck and trailer. I did his truck first and then a few months later, his trailer. When I did his trailer, I used a piece of vinyl I had originally cut when I did his truck, but didn't apply it. I saved it to use on a later project, which ended up being his trailer.
WELL, the lettering on his truck AND the one piece on his trailer that was the same vinyl as the truck, has now shrunk about 1/2" and is peeling up in various spots. It looks like it's been on for many years, when in actuality it has only been 2 years?
Was the Avery problem around 2 years ago? I can't believe it would only last 2 years and then shrink?!
Is there anything I can do about it now?
Thanks for any info anyone can remember.
-------------------- Randy Graphic Details Promotional Merchandise Distributor South Glens Falls, NY Posts: 381 | From: South Glens Falls, NY USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Kissymatina: Bad batches were from 2003 & 2004. Can't remember exactly which months. Yup, you've got taken by their crap.
According to Avery...But I have gotten some bad vinyl that was marked as 2005...
-------------------- Mark Kottwitz Kottwitz Graphics Ridgely, MD www.SeeMySignWork.com -------------------------- Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein Posts: 746 | From: Ridgely, MD | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
So, I assume they are still having problems?? Weren't they considered a good product at one time?
Well, what do you use when you want high performance cast vinyl? What brand stands out as a quality and great product that weeds well, performs well over rivets, etc. What brand is regarded as "the best"?
Think I'll take a look at another brand.
Thanks for your feedback.
-------------------- Randy Graphic Details Promotional Merchandise Distributor South Glens Falls, NY Posts: 381 | From: South Glens Falls, NY USA | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Calon II HP, Randy....I've used it since 1998 with nary a problem. I also use Gerber HP white exclusively. Never failed yet. I loved (past tense) Avery for its range of color and ease of cutting/weeding. But I'd never risk using it again. Still holding my breath for comebacks. I've tried the new Oracal cast stuff, and liked it, but time will tell how well it performs. Love....Jill
Posts: 8834 | From: Butler, PA, USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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posted
Randy, We've been using Oracal 751 & 851 series for years with no problems at all.
Yesterday I just repaired a job we did with Avery white reflective that totally broke down and turned to a mottled light grey in 3 years. We have used Avery reflective for many years and this is the first batch of reflective that was ever bad.
-------------------- Lou Pascuzzi www.economysigns.com Fine Hand Lettering since 1973 Danbury, Ct 203-748-4580 "IOAFS" Posts: 341 | From: Danbury, Ct | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
I like Oracal but can only get it in 10 yd. rolls. I don't use much vinyl here so I hate wasting my money on big rolls when I only need a couple feet of a color. That's why we always use Avery because I can buy it by the yard. I haven't had any failures with it other than reflective one time and the customer applied it so I don't know if they did it right.
-------------------- Amy Brown Life Skills 101 Private Address Posts: 3502 | From: Lake Helen, FL, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
Calon II cast(formerly Arlon) is all I use and haven't had any problems. Did use Avery occasionally because I could order it by the foot when a special color was needed. But since so many people started having the trouble with it, I put the brakes on that. Had trouble with "ATSM" cast vinyl, shrinking badly, a few years ago and stopped using that as well.
[ December 09, 2005, 09:41 AM: Message edited by: Wayne Webb ]
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7403 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
After all the discussion on this board about AVERY vinly, anyone that still uses this crap is just asking for it! It WILL come back and "bite" you! Use 3M, Oracal or Calon. You will be able to sleep nights!
-------------------- Tony Vickio The World Famous Vickio Signs 3364 Rt.329 Watkins Glen, NY 14891 t30v@vickiosigns.com 607-535-6241 http://www.vickiosigns.com Posts: 1063 | From: Watkins Glen, New York | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
Amy I get my vinyl from Express Sign Supply in Kentucky. They stock just about everything and they will cut a yard off of anything they got in stock. They also will cut pinstripes off of any thing they got.
Thanks for the tip. I don't like having to wait for anything to ship to me. I usually need it yesterday! I have so many suppliers around here there is no need to pay for shipping.
-------------------- Amy Brown Life Skills 101 Private Address Posts: 3502 | From: Lake Helen, FL, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
Has Oracal improved over the years? I tried some back in 1999 (I think) and it was a nightmare. It had problems weeding and releasing from the backer, seem stiff and non conforming. I lettered a panel truck with it and by the time I was done, swore off the stuff forever. A friend of mine (another sign guy) coined it, "Whore-acal". I use Calon II exclusively. Only problem I've had is with the metallics; they don't last past 5 years.
-------------------- Tim Whitcher Adrian, MI Posts: 1546 | From: Adrian, MI | Registered: Mar 1999
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-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5273 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
I was told this past week, by a knowledgeable source that will remain anonymous, that Avery is discontinuing both the A8 and EZ series of films. A9 will be taking over for the discontinued A8 line.
-------------------- Fred Weiss Allied Computer Graphics, Inc. 4620 Lake Worth Road Lake Worth, FL 33463 561 649-6300 allcompu@allcompu.com Posts: 427 | From: Lake Worth, Florida | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
Tim, I was having the same problems a few years ago with the Oracal (Oracrap). But I recently was in a bind and ordered some again for a quick job and I was really surprised on how much it had improved. I still Keep 3m and Arlon instock also but for the Intermediate its all Oracal. As for reflective.. 3M Only.
posted
Tony... Seems like alot of us only seem to look at these things after the fact. I never had problems before. I have a job that I used Avery for less than 2 years ago that I am in the process of replacing the lexan faces and the vinyl. My supplier has told me that he will go after Avery for the price of the 20 yards I used on the job. I will never think about using this s**t again.
-------------------- Jerry Starpoli Starpoli Signs... since 1952
845-795-2438 Posts: 446 | From: Milton, NY US | Registered: Jun 2000
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posted
Oracal was with us as a Merchant for a couple years. They had a really friendly Letterville rep named Ken Sandlin. Ken was able to convert many Oracal doubters into believers. I think OP was even a convert! Some Suppliers actually listen, learn from their mistakes and come back with a really quality product.
Ken left Oracal to explore other options, and Oracal never renewed the following year. To this day, I still believe the higher powers at Oracal never really understood the good relationship Ken had established on behalf of Oracal. It may be time to reach out and invite Oracal to take another look.
-------------------- Steve Shortreed 144 Hill St., E. Fergus, Ontario Canada N1M 1G9 519-787-2673
posted
Tim, your experience sounds like Oracal 651 they called it something like a hi-performance calendared... it was 3 mil.. (felt like 4 mil or 5 mil due to how stiff it was).. & yes... they even had a known issue with difficulty releasing from the liner... but some of the praise above was for what I believe is their 2 mil stuff... 751 or 851 I have quite a few rolls of 651 & am very careful what I use it on.. short term stuff only.. but it does have a nice gloss for intermediate vinyl.
[ December 12, 2005, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: Doug Allan ]
posted
I'm curious about Avery down under- I never used to use it, but started a couple of years ago- using the 900 series premium cast stuff, which was about as expensive as the 3M-7725 series, only a couple of suppliers went out of stocking 3M altogether, and I was given no choice.
I tried a bit of the Avery 700 series cheap black calendered vinyl for temporary jobs, and was surprised how little tack it had at all. I'm not convinced it was normal, but so far no shrinkage to complain about... I have no idea why the suppliers began an 'anti-3M purge'.
Here's hoping...!
-------------------- "Stewey" on chat
"...there are no limits when you aim for perfection..." Jonathan Livingston Seagull Posts: 7014 | From: Highgrove via Toowoomba, Queensland, Australia | Registered: Dec 2002
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