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Hi all! This is not your usual software question but one that may shed some light, for a newbie such as myself. If you could, tell me what features your software has that YOU could not live without and why?
Program name:
feature 1;
feature 2; etc....
Thank you in advance! Jeff
-------------------- Jeff Umsted Posts: 35 | From: home. Lapeer, Mi. | Registered: Mar 2004
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Gerber Omega 2.02 / Adobe Illustrator I have used Flexi, and I gotta say Gerber/Illustrator has it hands down! Especially since my new Graphtec will cut off Illustrator directly!
""Good judgment comes from experience; and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" - Will Rogers Posts: 3485 | From: Beautiful Newaygo, Michigan | Registered: Mar 2003
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-------------------- Dave Grundy retired in Chelem,Yucatan,Mexico/Hensall,Ontario,Canada 1-519-262-3651 Canada 011-52-1-999-102-2923 Mexico cell 1-226-785-8957 Canada/Mexico home
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I use Adobe Photoshop for the most part these days. I do no vector work however.
The feature I like the most is how it works so flawlessly with my Wacom drawing tablet.
-dan
-------------------- Dan Sawatzky Imagination Corporation Yarrow, British Columbia dan@imaginationcorporation.com http://www.imaginationcorporation.com
Being a grampa is one of the the most wonderful things in the world!!! Posts: 8738 | From: Yarrow, B.C. Canada | Registered: Nov 1998
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Lots of levels of "Undo". I'm usually deep in the mud before I realize I have to get out. I know the more undo levels used, the more resources that are tied up, however, with my current hardware, that is not as big an issue as it used to be.
I like the ability in Corel of being able to select an object, apply some transformation to it and hit "Apply to Duplicate".
Flexi, for all their touting their improved interface from Version 6 up, dropped a user friendly copy function from their menus. I have beta tested for them and griped to no end about that.
Through Version 5.X, the transformations in Flexi had the option to "Copy Object" with the transformation. Now, you have to copy (by any of several means), align it, then move it or use "Step and Repeat". For all the functionality of having Design Central at your fingertips, removing the ability to apply changes to a copy of your object was surely a step backwards in productivity.
Edited typo--much easier done in Corel than Flexi...
[ September 30, 2004, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: David Harding ]
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5084 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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corel, corel, corel,......and PRINT ARTIST FOR CLIPART....heheheheheeh
-------------------- joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 2811 longleaf Dr. pensacola, fl 32526 850-637-1519 BEWARE THE TRUTH.....YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND Posts: 11582 | From: pensacola, fl. usa | Registered: Nov 1998
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Corel Draw. Bob, I'll see your 1-1000 Features and raise you 1-1 million.
Top of the list: The sizing & rotating toolbars on the top toolbar. I use those constantly and really wish a program that will remain nameless (but was already mentioned here) would get with the program and include that.
Cutting from Corel. I am cutting vinyl, not driving over a river, why do I need a freaking bridge?
-------------------- Chris Welker Wildfire Signs Indiana, Pa Posts: 4254 | From: Indiana, PA | Registered: Mar 2001
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The pencil and pen first.... then I am an Illustrator with CadTools on a Mac person myself, keyboard command friendly, easy node editing, superior (to me) type tools, easy tool window use. Started with Corel on PC.
-------------------- Rick Chavez Hemet, CA Posts: 1538 | From: Hemet,CA U.S.A. | Registered: Jun 2001
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-------------------- Judy Pate Signs By Judy Albany, Georgia USA 229-435-6824
Live simply...Love generously...Care deeply...Speak kindly...Leave the rest to God. Posts: 2621 | From: Albany,GA,USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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1.The best scanning options available. I can set perimeters in PrismScan, and it cleans up my original artwork on it's own. I hand letter a lot, and scan it in.
2.It's ability to import almost anything, and successfully convert it to a CDL file.
3.The easiest node editing you'll ever see.
4.While I'm not printing yet, I know that SignLab runs the Edge even better than Gerber's own software. I've seen them both in action.
Signlab: 1. Ease of use - as Judy says it is geared toward signmaking.
Feature i would like to see in Signlab: 1. an object manager like Corel's. When you get a complicated sign it's harder to manage the layers and properties in Signlab.
Corel: 1. You can do anything... i just haven't learned it well enough yet.
Thanks, Steve
-------------------- Steve Racz Racz's Handcarved Signs Posts: 1078 | From: New Jersey | Registered: Jan 2004
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My brother has been a SignLab user since the DOS days and uses it for everything, even blueprints for construction for his carpentry work (when you live in Montana, you have to wear many hats to make a living).
Some features I prefer in SignLab over Flexi are:
Power Weed--a very useful tool. I urged Flexi to put it into their release version. It is supposed to be there but you cannot see the lines and have to trust the software to place them. I don't trust software to do anything correctly. SignLab is vastly superior to Flexi on this.
Spline Curves instead of Bezier Curves--I have been told by software vendors that spline curves are an obsolete and inferior way of rendering the math for curves, however, if it allows for quicker, more intuitive and precise editing, I think it is better.
As has been stated, the software you learned on and became used to is usually what you prefer. I have Corel, Flexi, SignLab and Illustrator. I use Corel 95% of the time and for all the frustrations of Flexi, I can make it do what I wish because I know the program. I flounder somewhat in SignLab and Illustrator for lack of experience with them.
-------------------- David Harding A Sign of Excellence Carrollton, TX Posts: 5084 | From: Carrollton, TX, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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WOW! This is great! I am sure someone down the line will read this thread and be just as amazed as I about the features and abilities of certain programs.
I asked mainly because I am looking at purchasing some software and figure what better place to ask then here, kind of get a feel for certain programs and whatnot. Thank you to everyone that has replied and please keep em coming! I like it.
Jeff
-------------------- Jeff Umsted Posts: 35 | From: home. Lapeer, Mi. | Registered: Mar 2004
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#1- Because I like it and I know how it works. I'm old, set in my ways and too irratible and intollerant to try to learn something new. 20th century technology suits me just fine. "New-fangled" things and people in suits are down-right disturbing. My rebelious nature makes me resistant to change.
Hey, it might be that 'spraying without a mask thing again'!
And i can do anything with this team that any one else can do with a $5,000 sign dedicated program..
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5274 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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well. nope, I dont have an edge. Im goona let kissy and others run da edge and i'll buy wholesale..
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5274 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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I have written here before about how I broke away from Casmate Pro -kicking and whining- and with feelings of disloyalty - when I switched over to Signlab e6 because I had to run my new used Edge, and I entered a phase of counting the days of Casmate withdrawal and Signlab acclimatization and it did not come easy.
Then I discovered the existence of Rob Ivers CD on how to use every little square inch of Signlab's capabilities ( almost, anyway ) and it set me free after a number of sessions of popping in his CD and following the lessons.
After that, after a while, when I had to open CasMate to import a file to SignLab, only rote memory even let me maneuver in the program that had been "my life" for so long.
SignLab e6 has made running the Edge possible for me, and I am not at all a natural with computers and software. I have had good support from the Cadlink, prompt and responsive. And I have had great lessons from Bob Gilliland, whose patience is enviable.
TODAY ....Drumroll....I got my upgrade to version 7 installed. A very stable upgrade from e6, where it looks like the improvements are in the thermal printing module almost exclusively, the environment for Edge printing looks loser friendly to say the least. And it is capable of interfacing with several print output devices, which is not something I need right now, but will in the future.
Until today, I have never been excited about new software. I would look at the stuff uninstalled and sigh. I would always know my life would change for the worse, for a while, because I am just so unable with all of it, and that tears would flow at times for the sign making I used to do in an environment that no longer exists.
Today, when I could not wait to install and switch over into the new SignLab environment, I finally understood the weird look in my son's face over the years, whenever I got new software and all I could feel was fear when he told me I ought to be excited.
posted
I've run gerber on PC, Flexi on Mac....But the BEST of the BEST in my opinion (like RicK B. stated) is to work MAC - Illustrator and cut direct to graphtec thru Illustator plug in...One file to design-save-cut...life made easy and fast.
-------------------- Rick Whitmire Trick Communications & Signs Box 1124, Hudson, WI Posts: 132 | From: Hudson, WI | Registered: Nov 2002
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Photoshop...excellent for photo-type work (I've never used it for signs, tho) In my opinion, it is easier to use than Corels PhotoPaint, but if I could ever learn to use Photopaint, it looks like it could produce results as good as Photoshop.
Illustrator I'm sure is good, but I haven't used it since v4
I use CorelDRAW 12. It's got a quirk or two, but it's a really good program for the money. It's about $325 or so. Really, the features on all these programs are too many to list.
-------------------- William Bass wjb71@bellsouth.net Northwest Florida Posts: 636 | From: Pensacola, FL | Registered: Aug 2004
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Sound like Corel is the most used software among these folks. It's far away less expensive than the true sign design programs.
Advocates of a particular software aren't usually open minded about making any changes to their operating systems. Learnign a new program, even thought it may be far and away better, costs time and energy. I'm a classic example, as I was a Corel user for twenty years and made the painfull change to Illustrator, Photoshop, and the latest version to Flexi. The 3D work is done in ArtCam, Pro.
I think Signlab is also at the top of the pack. Couldn't go wrong there.
For us there is no going back to Photo Paint & Corel.
Joe
-------------------- Joe Crumley Norman Sign Company 2200 Research Park Blvd. Norman, OK 73069 Posts: 1428 | From: 2200 Research Park Blvd. | Registered: Sep 2001
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Uh, just for the record. Some say Corel was / is "just" a desk top publishing program. That is such a small definition for the use of Corel. Corel has and always will be an underused and under appreciated software.
Corel 6 had a cutter module avaliable. I had the cutting module flyer on my desk for months. That flyer was right out of the Corel 6 box. In fact, I called about purchasing the module. That flyer had in its headlines text about making signs.
-------------------- Leaper of Tall buildings.. If you find my posts divisive or otherwise snarky please ignore them. If you do not know how then PM me about it and I will demonstrate. Posts: 5274 | From: Im a nowhere man | Registered: Jul 2001
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Lets see, Illustrator 8 and CS. Not only are the type tools great, but drawing tools are very easy to use. Sometimes I use just the mouse to draw something out and then adjust the vector points to make what I need. Photoshop 7 as there is no other program that has the qualities this one has. Also, you can easily use photoshop and illustrator together. WHen working on a design that I want to add effects, etc. to, I just copy and paste each layer in photoshop out of illustrator, apply effects and tadah! Its what works best for me anyway.
-------------------- Maker of fine signs and other creative stuff. Located at 109 N. Cumberland ave. Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-837-0242 Posts: 4172 | From: Ages-Brookside, Ky. Up the Holler... | Registered: Jul 1999
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If I'm not mistaken, CorelDRAW is still over 90%of the Graphics Software Market. I'd say that is pretty good for a desktop publishing program.
I have used MACs and their programs: Illustrator, Canvas, Photoshop and many that I can't remember.
As soon as there was Photoshop for the PC, I shut down my MACs. I have nothing against someone wanting to use the MAC, but for me I feel more comfortable on the PC and can't think of anything I have had to produce, for printing or cutting that I couldn't do on the PC.
I still prefer Photoshop over Photopaint, but I use both to stay proficient.
-------------------- Rove Gratz Gratz Signs 342 Walden Station Drive Macon, GA 31216 rovegratz@aol.com Home Page: http://rove-342.tripod.com Posts: 861 | From: Macon, GA 31216 | Registered: Jan 2004
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From time to time I take in sandblasted or CNC work from other sign shops who use Corel and have problems with to many nodes which results in lots of clean up.
We are have Corel 7 and have requested our clients, who generate CDR files to save them as AI, Eps, and Cdr's. They all come in with tons of nodes, even when I open them in Illustrator, or Flexi.
One thing for sure Corel, will generate crapy files from good ones very easily unless there is some trick I am missing. Hidden nodes are lots of fun too. I know I am doing something wrong. Illustrator, Flexi, Signlab files are clean and sharp. A real pleasre to work with.
Does anyone have a soultion to this problem?
Joe
-------------------- Joe Crumley Norman Sign Company 2200 Research Park Blvd. Norman, OK 73069 Posts: 1428 | From: 2200 Research Park Blvd. | Registered: Sep 2001
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I am a hardcore Illustrator on a Mac User with a loaded PC as well.
I think that Corel is a great program, especially right out of the box with scale tools integrated in the program. Though it's integration with other programs or support with output or printers make it difficult for website design or print. I think with better integration or better support programs within it's suite on the level of Adobe CS and Studio MX, they can be a force to be reckoned with.
I have worked for 8 shops that used computers, the first 4 were Corel, the last 4 Illustrator. There is no way Corel has a 90% graphics market share or even a signage market for that matter, If I'm not mistaken it was only very recent that Illustrator outsold Canvas, Corel and Freehand combined.
As far as Macs VS PC's are getting equal in every way though PC's have a definite advantage on cost, Macs on true proceesor speed and marginally on reliability. There is no argument, it's just a matter of choice or what you already have. Even though Macs barely have 5% of the computer market they still make up a large majority of computers in the graphics field.
If Jeff has a PC, He cannot go wrong with Corel Draw, if he is going to grow into graphics in print or website as well as signage, Adobe CS or Studio MX is probably a better choice.
If he is on a Mac, since Corel bailed out of the Mac market, then CS, or MW are the way to go.
-------------------- Rick Chavez Hemet, CA Posts: 1538 | From: Hemet,CA U.S.A. | Registered: Jun 2001
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I can see why Corel bailed out of the Mac market. It was the only program on my Mac that would regularly freeze. I tried to learn it but just did not like it.
With so many responses claiming they love Corel, it just proves what many have said before; you love what you're used to. I grew up on Illustrator, have tried others, but have found nothing that I like better. When you learn Corel first, in most cases, that is what you'll love.
If most of you Corel lovers would admit it, you probably bought Corel for your PC because it was much cheaper than a dedicated sign program and you could cut vinyl with it. You got used to it, so you love it. That's not a bash, just an observation. I don't blame you one bit.
Rick is right about the percentages too. My wife was sent by her school to several graphic houses for observing what they do, to relay to her graphic students that wanted to persue graphic arts in college. Every one was 100% Mac. I was involved (and am again) in the ad specialty market. I send files for the artwork to the suppliers who imprint everything from pencils to coffee cups. Every single ASI supplier that I've dealt with, listed Macintosh - Illustrator files as their first choice.
You can't beat Photoshop for image files.
-------------------- Dave Sherby "Sandman" SherWood Sign & Graphic Design Crystal Falls, MI 49920 906-875-6201 sherwoodsign@sbcglobal.net Posts: 5397 | From: Crystal Falls, MI USA | Registered: Apr 1999
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The Mac is my love partner. I use Adobe Illustrator CS, Adobe Photoshop CS, Flexi Sign Pro.. and the Friday i received the new version of Flexi Sign Pro for Mac OS X. I use a PC with Omega 2.02 and Art Cam 7 for drive the Gerber Edge , Summa DC3 , Sabre , and for Sign Estimate Programm.
Design all the jobs on Mac , and continiue on PC for the next steps (Plotting , Routing,,,) And now wait for the new Flexi for Mac OSX and maybe can all the works on Mac.
Mac .....and PC...2 Different Worlds. and for me.......Mac and only Mac.
[IMG]http://www.parthenon2005.com/PC and MAC.jpg[/IMG]
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Hi again! Rick, I like what you have to say and if it helps, for now, I will be doing mainly vinyl stencils for glass work and the very rare window decal for the guys at work. Down the road I could see doing more vinyl work and maybe moving into the sign business a bit more.
I have two great sign shops in town here and I don't want to be "That fire-fighter with a dime store cutter". No one around here does glass signs and I am trying to make that my niche. I don't want to low ball the two other shops because they both have been very helpful and generous with their advise and tips. Both are letterheads too!
I would like to be able to take a quick hand drawing and scan it in then auto trace it, clean it up, tweek the layout, and cut the stencil I need. I have only seen SignMatev6.5 in use and was impressed with its capabilities. Didn't know if $999.00 was a good price for this program and thats why I asked about features that you couldn't live without in your software. This thread has proven very useful for information and I thank all who responded again!
Jeff
-------------------- Jeff Umsted Posts: 35 | From: home. Lapeer, Mi. | Registered: Mar 2004
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Whatever app you choose, spend the time to learn it, there's a lot of great software out there. Kinda like Chevy vs. Ford, both have their strong and weak points, but too, both will get you from point A to point B.
Fancy software is not a substitute for good design skills, sometimes I think all those buttons hinder more than they help, especially if your just starting out. Used to be a 'puter phrase heard a lot; GIGO = garbage in garbage out, still very much applicable.
I start with pencil and paper still, lots of thumbnails (a big thank you to Joe Barry for this skill) to start. Then onto CorelDraw ver 8 and Gerbers GA 6.2. It works and its paid for, I'm a signpainter, not a keyboard jocky.
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SignWizard 4.1 speed and ease of use. lots of shortcuts, less steps etc. click and drag zoom in and out with right click on screen text entry great vector editing all kinds of stuff
I use Corel 9 for file conversions and special effects. Corel PhotoPaint 9 for bitmap effects
-------------------- Wayne Webb Webb Signworks Chipley, FL 850.638.9329 wayne@webbsignworks.com Posts: 7403 | From: Chipley,Florida,United States | Registered: Oct 1999
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We're an all Mac shop here too. Two desktops and a 17" Powerbook to take home on weekends. I agree that for the most part its Corel/pc and Adobe/Mac just because the programs originated on those operating systems.
There's not much that I can't accomplish with the PhotoShop/Illustrator combo. I have a very fast Mac rip called PosterJet loaded on the laptop that I print to the HP5000. On my G4 desktop I can cut to my Graphtec 5100, print to my Gerber Edge and cut to my Gerber GsX Plus all at the same time amd all directly out of Illustrator. There are also 3 HP laser printers on the network that any of the 3 Macs can print to.
With this set up I am able to supply Edge prints to a few local sign shops. One uses Flexi, one Corel and another, the Windows version of Illustrator.
-------------------- Bill Modzel Mod-Zel screen Printing Traverse city, MI modzel@sbcglobal.net Posts: 1356 | From: Traverse City, MI | Registered: Nov 1998
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