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Hi Leonard, My experiences with ministers (usually high church of england) is that they are mean mean business men and not a great deal of theology there. So I think they must teach them this.
I recently had to do gold leaf on a blue vinyl strip with the new incumbents name because they wouln't pay for the whole sign to be done. So they had a faded tatty sign with a bit of vinyl stuck on it and nice lettering!!
Also have you found that they never say thank you. I alway just get a check in the envelope and nothing else at all. I guess that's better than nothing, but you do expect a bit more from men of the cloth. Love Barb
-------------------- Barbara Murrell 4 Elements (Global)Ltd Ware Herts England barbara@4elementsglobal.com Posts: 87 | From: England | Registered: May 2003
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I think a larger majority attend that class from what I have encountered.
That and the Fred Sanford move of clutching your heart after hearing the price, the indignation of how dare I be any higher than the other bids and so on.
Lately it's been a dogfight with any bid over $500. I went to pick up a deposit on a $2,500 job yesterday after many weeks of conferring on this with design changes etc. As soon as I sit down, this realtor pulls out every negotiating tactic and cry of poverty I've ever heard. I suggested to him that tradition is you negotiate on the front end of a bid, not it's acceptance later on.
-------------------- Wright Signs Wyandotte, Michigan Posts: 2786 | From: Wyandotte, MI USA | Registered: Jan 1999
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My dad used what he called "the Preacher's Disount". Up 20%, then down 10%. I tend to stick with it.
You can figure that if you aren't dealer with the Minister (which is obviously fun) you will be dealing with a committee....ARGH. Lose-Lose.
At a shop I used to work for, we had a preacher drive up in a Corvette to get a "for sale" sign for his waterfront condo, and when we told him it would be $35.00, he says to the owner, "Well, I guess I'll put another diamond on your finger!"
-------------------- Joe Endicott NEXCOM (Navy Exchange Service Command) Signing Programs Specialist Virginia Beach, VA jeendicott@msn.com
"I want to be Stereotyped....I want to be Classified." Posts: 681 | From: Virginia Beach, VA USA | Registered: Mar 1999
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We did a sign for a church and about 8 years later... The pastor shows up to ask us when we can make a new sign? We say, anytime. He says o.k. We say lets do an invoice. He says no, you should make a new sign for free because the sign has lost its new look and it should be guaranteed to be like the day it was put in the ground.Boss jumps in and says, O.K. you put a guarantee together on paper that I'll go to heaven and you got a deal. The day I go to heaven you'll get your new sign. GUARANTEED..............
Try that one on for size!
CrazyJack
-------------------- Jack Wills Studio Design Works 1465 E.Hidalgo Circle Nye Beach / Newport, OR Posts: 2914 | From: Rocklin, CA. USA | Registered: Dec 1998
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I have NEVER had a promblem with the Churches I have delt with,after referring to such Biblical cases as..."a workman is worthy of his hire" and "you father owns all the cattle & all the hills" As spoken by Jesus Christ
hope this helps
-------------------- PKing is Pat King The Professor of SIGNOLOGY Posts: 3113 | From: Pompano Beach, FL. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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I learned from dealings with some Asian-owned restaurants to add at least 50% to my price and offer 10-15% off as a discount. Gave another 5% when the 'no receipt' idea was suggested by the customer! Always questioned whether it was ethical in a sense but it was better to land the job quickly rather than having to negotiate on price for an hour.
But I did notice that you can't sit down and try to lower the prices they charge for food, been there and tried it!
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Most businesses draw from the passerby witha sign. You can frequently sense the quality of the product or service by the sign presentation. Do you think a church gets congregants this was also? Can you anticipate the doctrine or mannerisms from the sign? It might be different with this group. I've never been stung by them, never made much money from them either. Done lotsa churches.
-------------------- The SignShop Mendocino, California
Making the simple complicated is commonplace; making the complicated simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. — Charles Mingus Posts: 6779 | From: Mendocino, CA. USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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Interesting to see Aisian Restaraunt owners and Ministers mentioned in the same post...for years they (both) have been the biggest pains in the butt to deal with.
I have always bid both high but I have to admit I don't negotiate with the "restraunt" owners...mostly because I know their boss isn't capable of sending me to hell!
I do however get 1/3 down and balance on completion from both.
"Get the money"
-------------------- "Werks fer me...it'll werk fer you"
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I guess that's better than nothing, but you do expect a bit more from men of the cloth. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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