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Hey, I've seen a few posts and heard some folks about using MDO as a carving substrate. Am I nuts or is this just inviting disaster? I spend a good amount of time coating all the edges of my MDO signs with waterproof glue before painting. I get all paranoid if the paper ovelay gets damaged on the face. So, am I being way too cautious with MDO? Can it actually BE carved and last outdoors? Because it sure is a heck of a lot cheaper than HDU if it can be used like that. Someone please clarify. Thanks, M
-------------------- Mark Rogan The Great Barrington Sign Company 2 Stilwell Street, Great Barrington, MA 01230 mark@gbsignco.com
"Sometimes I think my head is so big because it is so full of fonts" Posts: 332 | From: Great Barrington, MA | Registered: Mar 2003
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lol (that lil' face sez "eek")..an' rightly so,'cuz you kno' what Mark? I kno' SQuAT" about carvin', but I'm like you, I think that sounds insane . . .
But since I personally believe nothing is impossible...I look foward to hearin' from who can & how
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I'd have to agree with you Mark. Why take so much time on a product that's intended for temporary signs. As soon as you break the face you expose the wood same as the edge. Not a good product choice for carving.
-------------------- Jon Harl 5731 Meridian Ave. San Jose,CA 95118
jonharl@comcast.net Posts: 99 | From: San Jose, California | Registered: Jan 2004
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I've used exterior grade MDO, carved and gilded on pub signs in Belfast. However, make sure all edges are slightly rounded (NO sharp edges or corners!!!). Paint 3 coats u/c and 2 gloss (BACK AND FRONT!!!) before adding detail colour or gold leaf. Sit back and enjoy the result for years to come! Although MDO is harder to carve so what you save on HDU you put in more labour hours on MDO. I imagine your biggest concern is the 'sponge effect' where water enters the MDO and it grows like a sponge. Use ONLY exterior grade, but this is more expensive than interior grade, and if you haven't coated properly....the sponge is just dying to appear and haunt your profit margin when you are asked to fix an unfxable job. Since I learned of HDU I would be happier charging the customer more money for a 99.9% guaranteed job. But as they say on quiz shows...."the choice is yours." Good luck.
-------------------- Mike Meyer Sign Painter 189 1st Ave n P.O. Box 3 Mazeppa, Mn 55956
We are not selling, we are staying here in Mazeppa....we cannot re-create what we have here....not in another lifetime! SO Here we are!!!!!!!
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PS.... That last post was actually mine. I forgot to log Mike's name off before posting. One sign painter still left in Mazeppa.
-------------------- Brian O'Prey Brian O'Prey, Artist and Designer 5 Old Movilla Road, Newtownards County Down Northern Ireland BT23 8HH Tel. 028 9181 3517 email-brianlionzion@hotmail.com Posts: 91 | From: Newtownards, County Down, Ireland | Registered: Aug 2003
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Are we not confusing MDO & MDF? Carving MDO would be kinda like trying to poke butter up a wildcats butt with a hot poker - possible, but damned difficult. Got to admit, I tried sandblasting it once. I thought that once I got through the Kraft paper, & into the top layer of fir or spruce it would be interesting - well, lets just say it WAS interesting - not very attractive or saleable, but interesting. It's got so many voids, & all that crisscross grain. TR
-------------------- Rodger MacMunn T.R. MacMunn & Sons C.P.207, Sharbot Lake, ON 613-279-1230 trmac@frontenac.net Posts: 472 | From: Sharbot Lake, Ontario | Registered: Nov 2003
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Actually.......I believe youz guyz are talkin' 'bout MDF(nedium density fibreboard) and not MDO(medium density overlay). I've never tried carving MDO plywood, but could just imagine the results. I have carved MDF, and like it alot. The problem is that the stuff here in the States won't hold up to the elements like the stuff overseas. It's a "heavy sponge" kinda thang...........but I could be wrong, again.
-------------------- Mike"Spud"Kelly zipperhead design Westminster, MA Posts: 367 | From: Westminster, MA | Registered: Mar 2001
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Yes, you're right....I was thinking of MDF.....sorry. Ah well, those who want to know about MDF now have it!
-------------------- Brian O'Prey Brian O'Prey, Artist and Designer 5 Old Movilla Road, Newtownards County Down Northern Ireland BT23 8HH Tel. 028 9181 3517 email-brianlionzion@hotmail.com Posts: 91 | From: Newtownards, County Down, Ireland | Registered: Aug 2003
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I dont think that butter & wildcat things sounds like such a great idea...but I will be trying the MDF next chance I get.
-------------------- Phil Steffen, 29 Van Rensselaer St City of Saratoga Springs DPW Saratoga Springs NY 12866 Posts: 563 | From: beautiful Saratoga Springs NY | Registered: Aug 2001
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SONGPAINTER Original Sign Music by Sign People NOW AVAILABLE on CD and the proceeds go to Letterville's favorite charity! Click Here for Sound Clips! Posts: 1974 | From: Orleans, MA, Cape Cod, USA | Registered: Nov 1998
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The new Extira carves like butter. If Karen Bush's piece of Extira comes out of her brook in any shape other than a sponge then I'm trying it. 1.25" 4x8 is $71 in my neck of the woods.
-------------------- Rob Larkham Sign Techniques Inc. Chicopee, Ma Posts: 607 | From: Chester, Ma. | Registered: Apr 2002
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When i was working while in school for a company with a CNC router we made a few carved signs usind MDO thats right MDO. I am not sure how they lasted but i do know that we sealed the letters before painting them and putting the gold in. I actually did one for a friend and it still looks great, ( it is inside thought ). They were selling them for outside use for a short time though.
JAKE
-------------------- Jake Lyman Lyman Signs 45 State Road Phillipston, MA 01331 Posts: 635 | From: Phillipston, MA | Registered: Sep 2002
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Spud, Extira is a new brand of MDF making claimd that it will last outdoors. Medex made these same claims but failed miserabley. Karen Bush has a piece of extera that has been inher brook for a couple of months and someone else around here has a piece in a bucket of water. We are patiently waiting the results. In my neighborhood there are a lot of Medex carved signs. They are a little swollen but not in terrible shape.
-------------------- Rob Larkham Sign Techniques Inc. Chicopee, Ma Posts: 607 | From: Chester, Ma. | Registered: Apr 2002
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Sorry about your keyboard, Joe. Jake, I'm confused about how you'd rout MDO on a CNC. All of the woods they use as the layers in MDO are prone to tearout, & once you're below the first layer, you'll have knot voids to deal with. It should last fine outside,though,as long as it's well primed. I wouldn't even try to put a routered edge on MDO - with that alternating grain you'd get nearly as neat of job with dynamite. TR
-------------------- Rodger MacMunn T.R. MacMunn & Sons C.P.207, Sharbot Lake, ON 613-279-1230 trmac@frontenac.net Posts: 472 | From: Sharbot Lake, Ontario | Registered: Nov 2003
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Robert Let m know how heavey the Extira is.. I POP a nut just lifting 3/4 I would hate to see what the 1 1/4 weighs.. I love MDF for cnc work it machines nice and smooth and sands like a dream. JUST MAKES ALOT OF DUST. MDF works great out here but we dont have the Moisture you east and southern folks have. We're lucky if we get above 5% Humidity when its raining
[ February 13, 2004, 02:07 PM: Message edited by: William DeBekker ]
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A side note for Karen... Get that stuff outta the water!!!
Even regular CD interior plywood will not delaminate under water. Leave it in the water long enough to get good and wet, then pull it out and lay it in the sun. When the sunshine starts pulling the water out, then you know if you have an outdoor product or not.
-------------------- Don Hulsey Strokes by DON signs Utica, KY 270-275-9552 sbdsigns@aol.com
I've always been crazy... but it's kept me from going insane. Posts: 2273 | From: Utica, KY U.S.A. | Registered: Jan 1999
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actually the piece(primed) with 4 screws in it is out in a snow bank...it's on the south side of my house so it gets hit with the sun too...i plan on putting it in the brook for a few weeks, then leaving it on my deck to bake in the sun...i'll kept yas posted.
-------------------- Karyn Bush Simply Not Ordinary, LLC Bartlett, NH 603-383-9955 www.snosigns.com info@snosigns.com Posts: 3516 | From: Bartlett, NH USA | Registered: Jan 2001
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I ordered a sample of Extira and go the local suppliers number. The supplier practically laughed at us and told us go to the lumber yard to buy it. They said we couldn't buy it directly from them unless we were in an industrial area, even if we picked it up. I plan to call the Extira people back.
-------------------- Amy Brown Life Skills 101 Private Address Posts: 3502 | From: Lake Helen, FL, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Wow, I've learned all kinds of stuff here. but the most interesting is that I've been using a "tempory" substrate for a coupla decades.. Crap, I might as well start refunding my customers and let them know The cut out and routed MDO letters I did long ago wil probably delaminate any minute now.
-------------------- Ron Costa Sign and Design 28 Ingerson Road Jefferson, NH 0358 Posts: 620 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Oct 2002
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MDO? Personally, I hate the stuff, but that may be explained by the fact that I got a half a lift of it that totally delaminated...seven large signs that had to be replaced!.All we can get here is industrial crap that is used for concrete forms. However, in the olden days I have made large cutout letters from it, but the labour involved in sealing it was onerous. Can't see carving it. For all other applications we now use Dibond, Signply or Intecel. Extira sounds interesting, tho'. Should be available in Canada in about twenty years, I imagine.
MUR
-------------------- Murray MacDonald OldTime Signs 529 Third Ave S Kenora, ON. P9N 1Y3 oldtimesigns@gokenora.com Posts: 781 | From: Kenora, ON | Registered: Jan 2003
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lol (that lil' face sez "eek")..an' rightly so,'cuz you kno' what Mark? I kno' SQuAT" about carvin', but I'm like you, I think that sounds insane . . .![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
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