i was not suprised at the volume of email i got from people willing to print the stickers. what suprised me was the variation in costs -- evrything from about $0.39 each to over $2 each.
i thought the Edge was pretty simple -- stick in the cartridge and tell the machine go "go". i guess its more than that.
so, here's what i'd like to learn, for future projects: what is the Edge best at, and when do you want something else? this is a serious question, because i don't know anything about these "new" systems. i don't know when it is appropriate for me to consider sub-contracting something like that, and when it makes sense to use inkjet prints or other types of prints.
(i'm hoping this doesn't turn into a paint vs edge topic -- i just want to know about Edge for now, please).
Posted by David Wright (Member # 111) on :
At 39 cents each, the Edge isn't good at making money. At least for some people.
Posted by Rick Chavez (Member # 2146) on :
Hey Scooter! By brother had some edge printing done, they turned my design into a jpg and printed it, and it came out all jacked up! aaargh!!!! I called the place and told them I wanted them to use the vector file and match the colors and they tripled the price. My brother went for it and what a difference! It looked great. I used to use the first Edge system but I had no real training on it, but in order to get it to look right, it took some tweaking to match the colors colors. I curious about the price difference and the quality too. Rick
Posted by Bob Burns (Member # 268) on :
On my colorcamm.....$1.56 ea.($37.50 sq.ft.) 4-color process....no banding....contour cut.. no setup with a good file (eps or BMP....NO JPEG). 2 hr.turnaround.....what's the problem?
Posted by Bob Gilliland (Member # 28) on :
Scooter,
For some that’s all it is, stick the cartridge in and go. For others, its much more then that. Same machine and consumables, but different operators, different skill levels, different overhead; different approaches.
To give you a fundamental education will take much more then a few words in a post. The question you ask is very basic, however, the answer is not. Depending how one goes about answering the question for you may prove that a .39 cent decal is one of the most expensive prices you will pay and that a two dollar price is a bargain.
For some specifics on your job: At that size I hope who ever does the job utilizes chokes and spreads. Also, again at that size, if using a tint to produce the highlights on the “SIGN” copy, they use something other then the default halftone setting. Hope that you would like to see it produced in spot color using vector information as opposed to rendering it in process, as some of your colors may not produce very nicely in process, and once again, at that size….. Hopefully the individual/shop that does the work is competent and discusses these issues with before hand.
The range you give, is that an apple-to-apple comparison or is that a range using cast vinyl/third party foils compared to OEM cast vinyl/foils? That makes a huge difference on how most price Edge work, while for others, material is only another deciding factor in the equation and not the factor.
Hope you get some good feedback on the question Scooter, excellent (but loaded) question!
Posted by Rick Chavez (Member # 2146) on :
I have used the Color Camm as well and I have never been able to throw the disc in and start printing either. Most files can not be set up to start printing, unless you send them a pms print out from your printer, so the Designer can set the colors up themselves, otherwise it's up to the guy outputting the job to color match. Thats where the difference in price might be, I have prints from different graphics houses for color matching for final output, and each very. And I have what I thought was a good printer for test prints and color matching (Tektronics Laser Printer). Digital printing is a tricky business, it cost to get it done correctly, in the projects I work on, good enough usually does not cut it. It would be a great experiment to get a test print from each person and compare output techniques. Rick
Posted by Bruce Evans (Member # 44) on :
I wasn't one of those who quoted you, but I think Bob would be about in line with the price I would have come up with. I would have used a spot yellow, a spot blue and a spot black. I would have halftoned the highlights with the spot blue foil.
I would have asked you for the file in Vector format.
2.5 ft. x $13 sq.ft. $42.50 in labor (1/2 hour)
Total = $75 or $1.50 per decal
[ July 19, 2002, 12:51 AM: Message edited by: Bruce Evans ]
Posted by Doug Allan (Member # 2247) on :
It's usually true that "you get what you pay for" Someone charging $2 is probably intending to put energy into a better looking solution. Not always of course, but buying from another neighbor here in Letterville, I don't think you would be that likely to run into the rare exceptions to that rule.
I would probably go less then $2, but I would encourage you to order more. I don't usually touch the edge for less then $100. I'm here running it at 9:00 pm, so you get my drift.
I think halftone blue on your bevel would look very bad. it is not the same hue in your post, & at that small size you could count the pixels trying to look like light blue. At 2.5 linear feet, why not spend the extra $1.60 to run an olympic blue foil? In fact splurge another $1.60 for a darker blue on the bottom bevel, or a shadowcast overprint.
[ July 19, 2002, 03:16 AM: Message edited by: Doug Allan ]
Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :
Scooter,
Looking at the logo, it can be done one of two ways.....a 3 color print or a 4 color print.
If you go with the 3 color print, a screen tint would have to be used for some of the shading effects. Using Oracal 651, I come up with a price of $1.42 each wholesale. Using Gerber 220, I come up with a price of $1.54 each wholesale.
If you go with a 4 spot color print which would eliminate the screen tint, I come up with $1.53 and $1.64 respectively.
If someone is willing to do it for 39˘ each, please have them to e-mail me. I'm going to start subbing out a lot of work to them before they go under.
Posted by Bob Rochon (Member # 30) on :
Scooter,
You've recieved all the correct info so far.
In making your best educated guess, remember this is your logo and I'd use the best materials I could afford.
I will agree this particular size, anything bu solid spot colors would look horrible. Also make sure your selected party knows his how to eliminate those pesky white lines between each color
This, is the difference, and so should be reflect in the prices.
Posted by Bruce Evans (Member # 44) on :
I'd have to agree with Glen about going with the $.39 guy. Get them while you can. You are essentially handing your customers money. No sense giving them $2.00 when you could give them $.39 instead.
Posted by EPatzer (Member # 135) on :
my price on something like that, 'die' cut (contour cut), printed on Avery PremiumCast vinyl, 4-color process on a Soljet would be about .65 a piece. If you want me to weed and cut each apart, $1.20 a piece...
Posted by Neil D. Butler (Member # 661) on :
Just curious how do you guys price up something like that, I have a set price per sq.ft for each color, and then I multiply it depending on how many colors. What do you guys normally charge for 4 color process printing? It seems that you guys are charging a little more than I can, and that's not considering the exchange rate. quite a few years ago, before I had an Edge, there was a franchise shop in Florida who used a guy I know here in Nfld for his edge work, he did this for a couple of years before he purchased his edge... go figure.. he was probably marking the decals up by 400%.
Posted by Mike Pipes (Member # 1573) on :
Scooter, here's an honest question for you..
Why spend $100 for 50 Edge printed decals, when for another 100 bucks you can have 950 MORE decals screenprinted?
You could even bypass the setup charge for the contour cut die by providing artwork setup in a sheet size, complete with registration marks. Then you can cut the contours on your own plotter with your own material, give the printer these cut sheets with the registration marks weeded out and they can line the screen up over it perfectly.
Posted by Doug Allan (Member # 2247) on :
Get Mike to screenprint them!... before he goes under
1000 pcs. 4-color spot from Gill-Line: wholesale price .76 each, incl. die -cut allow for shipping costs.
Posted by Rick Chavez (Member # 2146) on :
This brings up a sub topic, that has been brought up before in years past, does anyone here have a minimum order amount? I know most if not all would give a fellow letterhead a break on a small order like this, but how do you make this kind of order profitable, even at 2 bucks a pop. Rick
Posted by EPatzer (Member # 135) on :
something like this, minimum order 1, cost $15.00
Posted by Bruce Evans (Member # 44) on :
Mike, who's doin your screen printing? I just looked at my Stouse catalogue and I figure $522.50 plus $128.00 for the die. With a 50% discount it would end up $325.25 plus shipping.
This is using the 6-10 sq. inch price and 4 spot colors.
That's a great price if someone will print 1000 of them for $200
Posted by Neil D. Butler (Member # 661) on :
You see this is where the edge shines.... 50 3x4" decals , takes up 3.5 ft. 4 colors at $20.00 sq.ft = $70.00 devide that by 50 for $1.40 In Canadian dollars, great deal for you Americans. Contour cutting included.
Posted by Doug Allan (Member # 2247) on :
That's 2" x 3" Neil
Bruce, thanks for that quote, I just got Stouse on the phone to send me my catalogue. I actually had a 1997 on the shelf, but being a creature of habit I've always ordered from Gill-Line thinking they had to be about the same. Amazing difference. on both the price & the discount.
Posted by Mike Pipes (Member # 1573) on :
Bruce, it's a local guy here in Havasu, and I'm not 100% sure that would be his price, but based on past work he's done for me that's what I come up with.. and it's based on a 4x6 sized decal, 3 color prints using gold and silver inks on white film with a black overprint to put a sharp edge on the gold and silver areas, which I have paid 69 cents each for in the past in quantities of 1,000pcs. That's 24sq in. which is 4 times the material and more labor since they cant fit as many on a single sheet (ie: they have to spend more time printing).
He might charge more for a job like that, who knows, he quotes each job independently but it's a pretty simple quick knock-out job compared to some of the things I've thrown at him. His company is also no stranger to mass production, they can run multiples of millions and it doesn't phase them, they have the throughput, the staff, the means, and the drying rack storage to pull it off. He might even use the really big jobs to offset the cost of smaller runs to give those customers a break, I dont know, it's his business.
Posted by Mark Matyjakowski (Member # 294) on :
Along Mikes thinking ....
Scooter, If I remember right you screenprint and have a cutter right? add an hour of down time and away you go
Posted by Neil D. Butler (Member # 661) on :
That's right Doug,my mistake on posting 2x3" takes up3.5 ft... anyway you cut it the edge shines.
Posted by Doug Allan (Member # 2247) on :
![[Smile]](smile.gif)