This must be the "Host" part of a meet. IDEA (1): Concerning Panel Designs for other shops,as suggested by Matthew Broadus!Lets do it this way,Anyone and everyone wanting to get involved can sign up when they get to the Duck Soup Splatter Jam at the Registration Table.From there we will draw names!! IDEA (2): Concerning Panels to be painted and brought with you to share.The "theme" for this meet is DUCK SOUP!(as easy as....) IDEA (3): Concerning registration fee.$20.oo per person attending(includes food,t-shirt,door prizes,etc) The sooner this is addressed,the easyer for the host. IDEA (4): Concerning the meet and what will go on. Prepare to have a GREAT time!!Very informal with no seminars on any perticular subject. (If you would like to know a trick or tip,JUST ASK)someone will be willing to help. Things to paint Things to eat Things to do IDEA (5):Any and ALL "First timers" invited and encouraged to attend. IDEA (6):You can find registration info at the "Future Live Meets" section of this BB <---------------- over thar
Thanks Duckie & Duckette Pat & Bobbie King your host & hostest
56days,3hours,50minutes,15seconds LEFT!!!! ------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
[This message has been edited by PKing (edited July 21, 2001).]
Posted by Steve Shortreed (Member # 436) on :
I've had this wild idea floating around in my brain with all the Prozac for sometime now. It's a race between today's technology vs yesterdays.
The project in this case is a 3x8 banner with some simple copy such as For Sale or something along that line. On one side we have someone armed with a projector and paint. The other guy or gal has a computer and cutter. Who will have the job done first?
Besides being an interesting contest, this whole exercise could serve as a great learning experience for those on both sides of the vinyl/paint issue. At the very least, it would demonstrate there is more than one way to do a job.
Hey that is a good idea too Steve! I'm game and I'll have the laptop and cutter with me at Pat's.
hehehehehe.......... I'll even load Win 3.1 and Corel 4 on it to make sure the puter is runnin real fast!!!!!!
Or would ya rather I lose by being the guy with the projector and brush!!
------------------ Dave Grundy AKA "applicator" on mIRC "stickin' sticky stuff to valuable vessels and vehicles!" in Granton, Ontario, Canada 1-519-225-2634 dave.grundy@quadro.net www.quadro.net/~shirley
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
The right tool for the right job Steve.Anything over 6-8 inches tall I know for a FACT that I can produce it faster!!!! Seems the drying time would be the factor here.Of course I don't let my customers run my shop.So when its dry its DRY!!! If they wanted it sooner,they should have ordered it sooner.Case in point would be the Baby Doll banner.A digital print of Dave would have dried with no other promblems.The route that was choosen turned from bad to worse.Now we have an infringement of other talented artist work already done,with the quick fix sponge bath cluttering up not only work done,but ALSO multitudes of color along four(4)corners un-nessesaryly literaly boxing in any hope for future signatures to have that hand painted flow to it.Although I don't think it is a vinyl VS paint subject.As much as it is The rigt tool for the right job and the stick to what you know subject.Rather than the try to do everything NO MATTER WHAT. This is not a put down on Dave,heck we all make mistakes.Plain old common sense
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
Posted by Steve Shortreed (Member # 436) on :
The scenerio could go as follows. A customer wants a For Sale banner. The enamel receptive banner size is 2 1/2x8 ft. and already has grommets. The desired layout is already done for you in scale. It has to be rendered exactly like it appears here.
The banners are already stapled side by side to the work bench. On one side we have a computer with a 20" plotter. The other guy has paint, brushes and a projector. Drying time isn't important on this project.
Who wins and what is your decision based on? No wagering please.
[This message has been edited by Steve Shortreed (edited July 22, 2001).]
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
OK! I'm willing to take on the plotter!
------------------ Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA (714) 521-4810 ICQ # 330407 "SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
95% of all accidents occur immediately after the words "Hey...watch this."
Brushasaurus on Chat
Gladly supporting this BB !
Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :
YER ON Si!!!!! Ya Old fart!..
------------------ Dave Grundy AKA "applicator" on mIRC "stickin' sticky stuff to valuable vessels and vehicles!" in Granton, Ontario, Canada 1-519-225-2634 dave.grundy@quadro.net www.quadro.net/~shirley
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
Looks like half an hour either way. Suppose it wasn't done with a straight outa the can font though? and maybe two more colors in it? or a blend? It would then require one of those printers that you run the banner through and it prints directly on the banner cloth, then you need to add the sewing time and adding the grommets. Sounds like a good competition to me.
Could be a bit juicier. If the computer wins, he gets the brush that he opposed, and vise versa.
------------------ The SignShop Mendocino, California "Where the Redwoods meet the Surf"
[This message has been edited by Rick Sacks (edited July 22, 2001).]
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
Does the hand letterer have to use a projector?
------------------ fly low...timi/NC is,.....Tim Barrow Barrow Art Signs Winston-Salem,NC http://artistsfriend.com/signs
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
GOOD Question Timi;Do we base the effectiveness of the banner doing its job ie. "selling the property" or getting ad agencies and art critics involved? Seems to me all the customer ever wants is that the sign works!!!!!!!!!! After all,isn't that the sign persons entire reason to be in business......... To make "Other" people MORE money? via signs? sure we should get paid for accomplishing this.The guy that makes it happen more often always stays the busyest and can demand higher prices! In this case I think Paint(colors)Design (readability)wins hands down! Pretty pictures and type stlyes meant to be read from 28''(arms length)such as "desktop publishing will have that advantage. Clearly this is no contest at all,rather an excercise in futility. I am game as long as we determine what the objective is. Of course at the Duck Soup Splatter Jam we will be having way to much FUN to take time for any contest other than the banner relay I have planned that will involve EVERYONE with no winners or losers.
Hurry up ya'll only........ 54days,22hours,12minutes,17seconds Left
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
Pat what I meant was that if the computer cut vinyl person has to scan & trace & or lay type & kern to match the layout Steve presented does the hand letterer have to use a projector to trace it or can he or she just layout & do the kerning etc to match?In all fairness layout time in this sort of competition is gonna be the key to the fastest produced end product.It might even be best to wait till the competition starts to show the exact example to be used in the competition! Oh yea,...in all fairness the layout would need to be to scale so both the computer operator & the brush mechanic can measure the layout accurately!Say 1/2" =1',..thus the end printout would be 2.5"x 8".
[This message has been edited by timi NC (edited July 22, 2001).]
Posted by George Perkins (Member # 156) on :
Well it's gonna depend on a couple of things. First, just how precise does this thing have to be? Secondly will be who the brushslinger is. I've been to a lot of meets and have watched a lot of folks swing a brush, the differences in speed are unbelievable. My guess on time to layout and paint this banner could vary between under twenty minutes to over two hours. If the race was to see who could produce the banner the quickest using your own layout, the brush wins hands down. Timi is right in saying the layout method is the key here. The font used in for sale is a pain to layout by hand, however the phone number can be easily done single stroke with a scratch layout.
------------------ George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@ionictech.com
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
According to my scenerio, this is the design the client gives you and he wants it exactly the same as the drawing. I know that probally wouldn't happen on a real world simple For Sale sign, but this could be a logo or "reproduce my business card" type job. Let's consider the copy For Sale to be his logo in this case. The final banner has to look exactly like the layout.
The design is already done to scale. It's ready to be setup to cut, projected or hand drawn onto the banner. We'll consider the job done when all the lettering is done and the layout lines cleaned off. The question about sewing/adding grommets or using a ready to go banner isn't important as both contestants will have to do that.
If I was doing this job, I think I would project it right onto the banner and start painting. Tracing the projected design first is an option I would probally choose, but many skip this step.
[This message has been edited by Steve Shortreed (edited July 22, 2001).]
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
I get it now.The projector would be used for exactness and take as much time as scanning then cleaning up for the vinyl cut.RIGHT? Now how Large would this For Sale Logo wind up being? As once again,I think that would be a determining factor.
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
Posted by Steve Shortreed (Member # 436) on :
One of the benefits of using a projector is that there is no need to worry about size or scale. If your artwork is to scale, as in this case, the border should line up with the banner edges.
I'm not sure what the final letter height of For Sale is, but I estimate it around 15 inches. The computer team would know that exactly once the artwork is in their cutting program.
The purpose of this whole exercize is to explore different ways of doing a job. I know there are fans of each method, but this should not become a race. It is important that we do this job like we normally would. "Winning" isn't as important as the learning value here, for those on both sides of the vinyl vs paint fence.
OK, I get it , it's a race...but winning isn't important? Steve, it's obvious you've never done any serious racing
Shoot, I'm game, I'll volunteer to man the brush if nobody else wants to. Duckie, you got a projector? I've got a big ol opaque I can drag along if I need to, course we'll have to dim the lights and that could be dangerous what with some of the people that will be attending
------------------ George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@ionictech.com
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
[This message has been edited by Mark Fair Signs (edited July 24, 2001).]
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
Oh No,WAIT now! If this is a Speed thing.DON"T let George Perkins do the job.It would take him FOREVER!! using that 00 Mack brush of his!!!!!!!!!!!he he he I have both an Overhead & Opaque projector to use. Yes Mike a "round track" race car will be here to be lettered along with a Harley & Goldwing motorcycle for stripes (hope a pinstriper shows up)Not to mention the DJ's trailer needing a "Killer"jukebox and letters.IF we can drag anyone away from the "Splatter Jam/Panel Jam"Building.Oh Yeah did I mention for everyone to bring thier paint kits and brushes? You will need them for the Banner Relay to be done(if time allows)is 3 days enough? everyone got started on the Duck Soup Theme panels to bring with ya?along with portfolios? I am in a CONSTANT state of preparing the grounds and shop for this Dixie Letterhead Ho-Down I don't know about you people but...... I'm getting excited with the prospects and only 53days,4hours,27minutes,47,seconds left on the countdown clock.
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
Posted by Mike Clayton (Member # 723) on :
Hi Pat,
Thanks for the info, I'm really looking forward to your meet and learning new things, as well as offering what I can. Harris Kohen is riding down with me and we should be there Friday morning sometime. Sent the check out, you should have it by the end of the week.
MC
------------------ Mike Clayton MC Graphics Barnegat, NJ http://www.visualnoise.com/mcg/ mike@visualnoise.com
"Youth and enthusiasm is no match for old age and treachery!"
Posted by Cheryl Lucas (Member # 1656) on :
All I can say is:
I'm practicing "the brush" at this meet! Anyone dare to allow a novice to pull a stroke on yer banner?
BrushStrokeAnnie, Cher.
------------------ Cheryl Lucas a/k/a "Shag" on MIRC Vital Signs & Graphics, Etc. Cape Coral, Florida VSignsNgraphics@aol.com
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
Great Mike ya'll come on down,we will be waitin' Cheryl,you "brush"up now,you can paint on anything here(it is a paint shop ya know!) We got lots of "PANELS" to practice your craft on. See ya'll in Sept. 51days,20hours,56hours,11seconds,left on the "countdown clock"
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
OPPS! got excited 'bout this meet
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
[This message has been edited by PKing (edited July 25, 2001).]
Posted by Mike Clayton (Member # 723) on :
*bump*
------------------ Mike Clayton MC Graphics Barnegat, NJ http://www.visualnoise.com/mcg/ mike@visualnoise.com
"Youth and enthusiasm is no match for old age and treachery!"
Posted by George Perkins (Member # 156) on :
Hey Mike, glad to see you're going to make the meet, this is gonna be a good one for sure, it will be fun to "tawk Joisey" I get to say "you guys" and "ya'll" in one weekend
------------------ George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@ionictech.com
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
How about a third category for "anything goes" - the only criterias are done right and speed.
I think the winning combination would be a good speed press operator, with a fast vinyl cutter. But that is only at this banner size. Also, there might be someone who would vinyl one line and paint the other. Vic G
