The Letterville BullBoard: Feelin guilty for over charging???

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Posted by Corey Wine (Member # 1640) on :

O.K. I did a job recently that involved many different signs from magnetics to MDO to, the ever popular, coroplast.
I feel good about the job except the MDO. (6) 18" X 24" white signs with "CAUTION OPEN PIT" on them in Red and Black(straight text-no artwork). Charged him $55.00 each for them. $330.00 MDO
It was for a construction co. who everyone knows, likes to spend $$ without blinking an eye....most of em anyway. Also, he wanted them in a real rush (1 1/2 days for the whole order). Did I overcharge???
I'm new at the OWNING part of the sign trade and often cross analyze and second guess my quotes.
In a similar story, when I arrived at my job today,(the employer that I will eventually NIX) my boss mentioned he would match the price for an 18" X 24" real estate sign another co. did. Double faced 2 color with artwork for $30----for just 1 of em.
Now, did I overcharge. He knows of my new business and often reminds me of the low overhead I have from starting up out of my home where as my employer is a huge manufacturer with a sign dept....with more overhead. How can he sell 1 sign for so cheap? Or am I, the guy with low overhead, way overcharging?

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Corey Wine
signCONCEPTS
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
The ex-Californian Canadian
signconcepts1@home.com

"I cooked a meatloaf recipe that I downloaded off of the internet. A day later, I got a stomach VIRUS....Coincidence?"

Posted by Tyler (Member # 2093) on :

Well, he paid it, so you must not be overcharging. Seriously, though, I think that price is fine, I definately wouldn't feel guilty about it. It isn't as if he traded you his soul for them. As to what your boss said, Just because you have low overhead doesn't mean you shouldn't be making money. I work from my home and have little overhead as compared to a large shop, but alot of overhead compared to a guy who works for someone else. Get what you can for your work, just make sure you take care of your customers and do great work, and you will be fine.

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Tyler Malinky

A Step Above Signs
Cleveland, Ohio
440.479.8129
440.842.1894 fax

www.astepabovesigns.com
tmalinky@astepabovesigns.com or exmayors@aol.com

Posted by George Perkins (Member # 156) on :

You definately have a better idea about pricing than your boss does

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George Perkins
Millington,TN.
goatwell@ionictech.com

"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"

http://goatwell.tripod.com

Posted by Shane French (Member # 2098) on :

I'm sure your boss is happier with this than you undercutting his prices.

If you really feel that guilty, give the guy a break next time he places an order. But if that's the price you WANTED and think your work is worth....no worries!

-shane

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Halo Graphics
Clearlake Oaks, CA
http://www.halographics.com
ntshane@halographics.com

Posted by Bob Rochon (Member # 30) on :

I come up with 56.34 for 1/2" MDO Good 2 sides, lettered one side. 2 coats of primer and only one coat of enamel. Lettered using Gerber Hp vinyl. This is for 6 signs.

Sounds like your right in line!

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Bob Rochon
Creative Signworks
Millbury, MA
bob@creativesignworks.com

"Some people's kids"

Posted by Samazon (Member # 408) on :

If the customer didn't complain, why worry about it? Especially since it was a rush job - those should cost more!

Also...keep in mind that while your overhead is low now, it may not always be low.

If you produce quality, charge accordingly. And smile all the way to the bank.

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“Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage.”
- Anais Nin
www.samazon.com
sam@samazon.com

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

Well now as I see it"" you should of had a BOOM and then a couple off Bang, Bang`s,,

I charge one price for the first"" then lower as the aggervation warrents.....
I also have in my mind the cost of the material,,
That way I KNOW my Bottom Line

you get a feeling after a BUNCH of Years,, to know how much time it will take....

This is a (IOAFS) job....

You Overcharge this guy,,

Why""... cause You feel it"""

I"" You"" and anyone elese in this bizz"" who is...... of a """good fellow" ,,,,,,has no problem approching the coustomer and telling them,,,""""""while going over the paper work on there job you notice a (possible) over charge,,, and you would like the oppertunity to make it right>>>> OR not......Twain,.TBuk

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Ted Bukovscak
BUKOVSCAK SIGNS
S/California
tbuk@nethere.com

Posted by Rob Larkham (Member # 2105) on :

Your overhead has nothing to do with it. A sign is worth what a sign is worth. Whether you work out of your basement, the mall, or an out house. Your price was fine!!!

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Rob Larkham
RL Graphic D-Sign
Chester, MA
rldsigns@aol.com

Posted by Felix Marcano (Member # 1833) on :

I'm working on 5- 16" x 6" "shelf wood" signs @ $40. ea. I've never used MDO, but it sounds cheap to me! I work out of my backyard too...

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"He who asks is a fool for 5 minutes. He who doesnt ask, remains a fool forever."
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Marcano-Welch Signs Luquillo, Puerto Rico
787-889-6608

Posted by Corey Wine (Member # 1640) on :

This guy (in Calgary) works for a major corp. with its main office in California. He basically told me when he was paying me the balance that his Superiors get mad with him if he questions the price and if he doesn't pay his subs off as quick as possible. Don't think he should have been telling ME that but, oh well. Didn't think I was overcharging until the signs were done. Thought about knocking a little off to keep his business but I think he'll call me back since his boss doesn't care about $$$ and before you say it...knowing what I know about his bosses procedure...I STILL won't screw the guy......but I sure as hell won't lowball em either!!!!hardy har har

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Corey Wine
signCONCEPTS
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
The ex-Californian Canadian
signconcepts1@home.com

"I cooked a meatloaf recipe that I downloaded off of the internet. A day later, I got a stomach VIRUS....Coincidence?"

Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :

Corey....RUSH jobs usually get charged 50% extra! Besides...construction companies WILLINGLY pay extra to get a job done on time! Delivery schedule is MORE IMPORTANT than price to them (unless they are a small 2 bit outfit)!
Enjoy your profits!

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Si Allen #562
La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
ICQ # 330407
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"

95% of all accidents occur immediately after the words "Hey...watch this."

Brushasaurus on Chat

Gladly supporting this BB !

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

SI", with respect I disagree,,, to this point...

If you are engaged in a bizz that is wam'a'bama"",,, meaning that you have customers waiting at the counter>>> then I would go along with the """stick um theory"", I"m to busy to get to you RIGHT NOW''''JUST Look at ALL the people BEFORE you......... but""" In the world of the "sole painter"" LOL ( kinda like that sound""" sorta of Jazzy""").. auummmmmmmm where was I ,,.......................

O" I remember"""

If it's a HEY"""" I'm. go'na''' ,,, give you some duckets for you to get off your dead ASS,,, and make me a SIGN <<<<<<< THAN,,, YUP,,, I do BELIEVE""" ya gots to treat um,,,, like,, the first lady ya told,,'Aaaaaaaaaaa to....Twain.TBuk

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Ted Bukovscak
BUKOVSCAK SIGNS
S/California
tbuk@nethere.com

Posted by Shane French (Member # 2098) on :

Anybody got a TBUK to English translation dictionary laying around?

-shane

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Halo Graphics
Clearlake Oaks, CA
http://www.halographics.com
ntshane@halographics.com

Posted by Corey Wine (Member # 1640) on :

No kiddin Shane!
That "green stuff" out there in San Diego must be pretty "green" however, he is right next door to Mexico, and with the prices he charges, can only get the brown stuff.
Don't misread me....I haven't been a browny or a greeny for years!

TBUK
What would you have charged?

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Corey Wine
signCONCEPTS
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
The ex-Californian Canadian
signconcepts1@home.com

"I cooked a meatloaf recipe that I downloaded off of the internet. A day later, I got a stomach VIRUS....Coincidence?"

Posted by John Deaton (Member # 925) on :

Your pricing is right on Corey. You done him a good job when he wanted it. That price for mdo is almost exactly what I would have charged, and do charge. Keep it up pal.

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John Deaton III
Deaton Design
109 N. Cumberland Ave.,Harlan, Ky. 40831 606-573-9101

john@deatondesigns.com
www.deatondesigns.com
"Don't tailgate, or I'll flick a booger on your windshield."-Larry Richmond, 11th grade english class.

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

48 first,, 42 each......258.00,,,, mdo is 35.....223...paint and a bier,,, is 18 ....205........cig, and toliet paper cost is 5..........200 it took you 1 hour to prime and bk/grnd@ 50 per hr (shortreeds rate) 150 it took you 30 min to cut @ 25........ ya got 125 dollars left to stick some zhit on 6 piecesssss of fricken wood,,,,LOL,,,,,,,,,,NOW leave me alone,,, i,m gona go get STONED..........on some payote'''' and have me another gin,,,,shoot me some Jonez,,, toss me down a few reds""and just freeze out for the rest of the Nite....Twain,TBuk

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Ted Bukovscak
BUKOVSCAK SIGNS
S/California
tbuk@nethere.com

Posted by Dave Draper (Member # 102) on :

Hi Heads,

This is sort of out of line with the thread, but related so bear with me.

I was talking to a friend of mine that got into the "quicky-sticky" biz about 13 years ago after retireing from the military down around the St. Louis area.
We have helped each other out over the years and keep buying identical equipment/software so we could help each other out on the learning curve.

Anyway, I asked him a couple weeks ago what he was charging for a 4x8 MDO realty sign.
"$225.00" was his reply. Later in the conversation we discussed banner pricing.
He told me he just did a 4x8 banner for $165.

I asked him why he charged $165 for the 4x8 banner and $225 for the 4x8 MDO and it stopped him cold. He had no explanation other than the difference in the cost of the material....which is not $60 difference.

I see a lot of this inconsistant pricing.
I see sign guys charging banner work by the square foot, so that one banner that has 4 words on it prices out the same as a banner with 150 words on it. Makes no sense to me.

Sorry this strays a little from the original thread.

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Draper The Signmaker
Bloomington Illinois USA

Get To A Letterhead
Meet This Summer! See
you there!
309-828-7110
drapersigns@hotmail.com
Draper_Dave on mIRC chat

Posted by Diane Crowther (Member # 120) on :

All of the American responses thought $55 was fine, and if they're thinking $55 US, then the Canadian price should have been more like $80 CDN

Actually, Corey, your price is about right for a regular job, and maybe a little low for a rush job. As someone else mentioned here, it often costs your customer a lot more to wait.

As far as $30 for a Double-sided two-colour sign, well...that's just insanity. Single-sided one-colour is pushing the envelope at $30.

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Diane Crowther, Metaline Graphics Ltd., Nova Scotia, Canada, ID #285

Posted by Cam Bortz (Member # 55) on :

YOU GO ROB LARKHAM!!! That was a no-BS response. A sign is worth exactly as much as a customer will pay for it. If it's not worth enough to the customer for you to produce at a profit, don't do it. On the other hand, value is all about perception. Next time you think you might be overcharging, check out the rates for designers, newspaper ads, or any other form of visual information or advertising media.

Your client has a boss "who gets mad if he questions prices or doesn't pay subs promptly"? I'd like to see that boss open a business management school. His attitude goes a long way to assure he gets good work done on time with fewer headaches. Or maybe he owned a sign shop in a previous life.

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"A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. - Raoul Duke (Hunter S. Thompson)

Cam
Finest Kind Signs
256 S. Broad St.
Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379
"Award winning Signs since 1988"

Posted by Corey Wine (Member # 1640) on :

TOUCHE' TBUK!!
GOOD ONE!

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Corey Wine
signCONCEPTS
Airdrie, Alberta, Canada
The ex-Californian Canadian
signconcepts1@home.com

"I cooked a meatloaf recipe that I downloaded off of the internet. A day later, I got a stomach VIRUS....Coincidence?"

Posted by Cheryl Lucas (Member # 1656) on :

Corey,

When I saw your topic, I thought awhile before entering in to see exactly what it was all about.

When I start to second guess my prices there are two things I evaluate:

1) What's my time worth?
and
2) Perceived value...

Sometimes after pondering the latter of the two, the price even increases.

I think your price is in line.

A customer that appreciates quality and service will pay the price. Keep up the good work!

Cher.

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Cheryl Lucas a/k/a "Shag" on MIRC
Vital Signs & Graphics, Etc.
Cape Coral, Florida
VSignsNgraphics@aol.com

Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :

There are three types of customers:
1. Quality and service are more important than price, and willingly pay for it.
2. Want quality, service, AND price...but are reasonable about it.
3. Price is THE only thing.
Your customer fits under the first type. As for the third type:
Customer has a Truck Driving School. Decent tractor, old Box Trailer, says he is going to remove the old decals and have it repainted. Wants stars and stripes and lettering in red, white and blue! In a hurry, needs it quiclky! How much? Did a quick thumnail sketch and gave him a price. Will get back to me! Month later I see it on the road .... plain black letters...OVER the top of the decal glue that didn't peel off! Looked like crap!!! A "Joe Wino" quickie!!!! Sorry fella! I don't do that kind of job!

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Si Allen #562
La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
ICQ # 330407
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"

95% of all accidents occur immediately after the words "Hey...watch this."

Brushasaurus on Chat

Gladly supporting this BB !

Posted by Bob Burns (Member # 268) on :

I NEVER EVER "overcharge"!!!!!!
I get what it's worth....and I think it's worth A LOT!!

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Bob Burns
Bob Burns Signs

1619 Oregon Ave.
Prescott, Az 86305
1-520-778-5879

Posted by roger bailey (Member # 556) on :

Because someone works "at home" should not have a bearing on prices.

When someone with low or no overhead starts charging based on that,they begin a bad jurney down a dead end road.
If the "prevailing rates for 4x8 mdo is 80.00(or whatever prevailing rate is ) then EVERYONE should be charging that.

One guy starts sellin cheap cause of low overhead, he screws up the entire market for everyone !!

Just my buiss. opinion.

Roger

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Roger Bailey
Rapid Tac Incorporated
Waikoloa, Hawaii

Posted by david drane (Member # 507) on :

G'day Corey, If you are feeling a little bit guilty about overcharging, then how do you feel when you realize you have undercharged?? We have a little saying that goes like this; "you pick up on the merry-go-round what you lose on the swings". seems to work out that way a lot.

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Drane Signs
Sunshine Coast
Nambour, Qld.
dranesig@dingoblue.net.au
Downunder
"Choose a job you love, and you will never have to work a day in your life" - Confucius

Posted by Tim Whitcher (Member # 685) on :

Over-charging? What's that?

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Tim Whitcher
Quality Signs & Design
107 E Adrian St
Blissfield, MI 49228
qualitysigns@cass.net

Posted by Chris Elliott (Member # 1262) on :

What's over-charging?? Simple, that's when you charge for something they didn't get!!! In all other cases you just got a good price for your work!! If they think it's too high they usually will not go ahead and buy it. Don't sell your stuff too cheap, it's bad for business.

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Chris Elliott
1longshot@msn.com
cell 620-845-0264

Posted by Tim Whitcher (Member # 685) on :

I couldn't agree with you more, Chris. When I first got into the business, I had a business consultant give me one piece of free advice, that I'll never forget. "Charge as much as possible".

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Tim Whitcher
Quality Signs & Design
107 E Adrian St
Blissfield, MI 49228
qualitysigns@cass.net

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