The Letterville BullBoard: Does It Work on Sunbrella too?

This is topic Does It Work on Sunbrella too? in forum Old Archives at The Letterville BullBoard.

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Posted by Linda Silver Eagle (Member # 274) on :

I was just wondering...can you add the frog squeezins to 1-Shot and paint a sunbrella awning without having to frog alone first?

Just curious...I apparently have a lot to do and it would be so kewl if I could get these done way faster than the paint and wait fashion we've all come to know and love.

Any epediant replies will be greatly, (no, really I mean it!) appreciated!

While I wait...I'll be swattin skeeters and slingin shot in dixie.

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Linda Silver Eagle #5653
Silver Eagle Graphix Studio in GA, USA
Big on Murals and Tight on Camera Ready

Proud Supporter of this Site!

"Old Sign Writers never die, they've always got 1-Shot left!"

[This message has been edited by Linda Silver Eagle (edited July 06, 2000).]

Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

It'll bleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed. Tried it, done it, ruined it.

Linda, if you wanna do it fast, trust me, try the vinyl mask and Nazdar's Permaflex Ink.

I'll race ya! I did an awning this morning that read "The Magnolia Restaurant." The letters were 8" tall, beige on black. I had the entire job done in just under 30 minutes from start to finish. I wholesaled the job to the awning company for $195.00.

After applying the mask, I applied a thin coat of white ink and then applied the mixed beige right on top while the white was wet. Removed the mask and I was done.

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Compost Happens!

:) Design is Everything! :)
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :

Glenn, What are you using for a mask? How are you applying it? What app tape are you using? How are you getting it off and not lifting the mask? You recently mentioneda vinyl that sticks to Sunbrella, I can't find it. Is it rated by the manufacturer for that purpose?

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The SignShop
Mendocino, California
"Where the Redwoods meet the Surf"

Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

When using a mask for painting, I use any cheap vinyl I can find. I'm using Oracal 651 right now. After cutting the mask, I apply a "low-tack" transfer tape. I get it from Trim USA. It is made by R-Tape. After applying the transfer tape, I flip the maske down and remove the carrier paper. Then I spray an even coat of 3M Super 77 spray adhesive. Then I apply the mask to the awning and carefully remove the transfertape. Then I rub the mask down with the palm of my hand and with a sqeegee. Then I apply the PermaFlex ink working from outside the mask to the center of the letter. The ink will level out on its own pretty much. The ink is thick and won't wick into the awning material. It stays where you put it. One of the benefits of using the Permaflex is that you can apply additional coats without waiting for each coat to dry. You can also apply different colors. This is handy if you are doing a beveled letter. Also, you can tint the ink with One Shot. After applying the ink, just remove the mask and set the awning aside to dry. It takes about 24 hours for it to dry.

The "Vinyl" that I spoke of is called "Dac-Eze". The awning company that I do their lettering for like to use it if they are in a hurry. As for durability, it last about 3 year out doors. Advertising Ideas and Kapco is where he is getting it from, I believe.

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Compost Happens!

:) Design is Everything! :)
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

Posted by Linda Silver Eagle (Member # 274) on :

well, well, well. I happened to have in my possesion friday night (after everybody's offices are closed) low tac vinyl, all purpose spray adhesive (not by 3m) and high tac tranfer tape...imagine...it was so much fun...not!

Thanks to Sonny Franks, I did have a partial can of white permaflex! I'm pulling this awning off the table after i get through scraping the bleedy places off with an exacto...but the next awning has some really tiny artwork on it. I'm so excited! (note the sarcasm!)

Any heads close by have any of the low tac transfer tape? And Glenn...did you say I could get the 3m spray at wally world?

I'm not pulling out my hair yet...but I think it might be cooler out there if I did! I noticed that the topic bar in chat was referring to outdoor jobs. All my jobs are outdoors, hahaha! most of them won't fit through the door hahaha!

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Linda Silver Eagle #5653
Silver Eagle Graphix Studio in GA, USA
Big on Murals and Tight on Camera Ready

Proud Supporter of this Site!

"Old Sign Writers never die, they've always got 1-Shot left!"

Posted by Linda Silver Eagle (Member # 274) on :

PS - how does one get spray adhesive off an awning?

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Linda Silver Eagle #5653
Silver Eagle Graphix Studio in GA, USA
Big on Murals and Tight on Camera Ready

Proud Supporter of this Site!

"Old Sign Writers never die, they've always got 1-Shot left!"

Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

Please don't tell me you sprayed the awning with adhesive. Only the back of the mask gets sprayed.

With some of the e-mails I've received from several letterheads this past week, I think I may have to write an in-depth step-by-step.

If you are trying to remove adhesive residue, take some clear packing tape and lay it sticky side down to the residue. It'll pull it right up.

BTW, if anyone uses anything other than what I've recommended and screws up the job, you are on your own. I'll be down to beat some sense into you later.

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Compost Happens!

Design is Everything!
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

[This message has been edited by Glenn Taylor (edited July 08, 2000).]

Posted by Linda Silver Eagle (Member # 274) on :

yes Glenn,

I did get some spray on the awning...but only cause I had to center hinge the mask (10ft) and was spraying with no skills (lack of sleep) It was an accident. WoW! I should have thought of that trick...the tape lift gig! Seems like all common sense seems to leave me when I'm experimenting with a new subsrate, new products and a schedule that could blow up in my face if I don't get back on track by monday!

I think you're right...you should do a step by step to put up on the bb! Everybody that has such an innovative plan of execution in this business should! It would save countless jobs and reputations if we had more clues to profitability! (not to mention all the materials we go through, thinking aw man, that won't happen to me!)

Letterheads is a great concept! We should all take it more seriously in teaching aspects. I'm surprise we don't have a state of the art HOW TO gig goin on! It would be neat if when we clicked on example: Sunbrella Awnings, we would instantly have access to posts, etc., referring to them. I reckon that would take a prog that could file them away or "search" for the keywords and file useful material only. Until then, you're it Glenn, you and others who could make step by steps to teach us how to do the most flawless job possible...

And may I say, thank you! again!

You are a life saver!

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Linda Silver Eagle #5653
Silver Eagle Graphix Studio in GA, USA
Big on Murals and Tight on Camera Ready

Proud Supporter of this Site!

"Old Sign Writers never die, they've always got 1-Shot left!"

Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :

I tried Glenn's method. Worked just fine for one letter as a test. I used a vinyl screen ink. Probably will work well with enamel too. I'll try it.

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The SignShop
Mendocino, California
"Where the Redwoods meet the Surf"

Posted by Linda Silver Eagle (Member # 274) on :

worked great here too!

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Linda Silver Eagle #5653
Silver Eagle Graphix Studio in GA, USA
Big on Murals and Tight on Camera Ready

Proud Supporter of this Site!

"Old Sign Writers never die, they've always got 1-Shot left!"

Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

Linda,

Were you able to get the errant adhesive off?

------------------
Compost Happens!

:) Design is Everything! :)
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :

Glenn, what is Perma-Flex? Is it a vinyl? Do you use a roller? How long can you work a roller before it gets eaten by the laquers? or is Perma-Flex a water/alcohol based product? Can you live OK with the smell of this stuff? I promise not to pour it on my salad!

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The SignShop
Mendocino, California
"Where the Redwoods meet the Surf"

Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

Permaflex is a thick solvent-based ink normally used for screenprinting. While there is some odor, it is not nearly as bad or as dangerous as vinyl ink.

I used to use vinyl ink when hand lettering awnings but the odor was a killer. The awning fabric, especially Sunbrella, would require 5-8 coats to get good coverage.

Because Permaflex is thick, there is less chance of accidentally dripping onto fabric. And, if you do, just let it sit there and let it dry. Since it won't soak in, you can just scratch it off.

I've never tried using a roller. It seems to me that you would risk pushing some of the ink under the mask.

Some other tricks.....

If you are creating a beveled letter, you can use clear packing tape as a straight edge right on top of wet ink.

If you need to clean up a spot, use 3M General Purpose Adhesive remover. It won't stain the fabric. I've not tried Rapid Remover or Rapid Prep yet, but I will be soon.

To speed up drying, use a combo heater/fan.

To do a Lemon Yellow letter on top of burgundy Sunbrella, lay down a thin coat of Super Opaque White and then apply the Yellow. You don't need to wait for the White to dry.

When cutting a mask, put about a 1" weed border around the copy.

------------------
Compost Happens!

:) Design is Everything! :)
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

Posted by Vance Galliher (Member # 581) on :

hi folks......i'm one of the ones that glenn mentioned he has help with using this "ink" method on sunbrella ..i paint a lot of canvas for a local awning comnpany, and i will never use paint again !!!! this permmflex ink is wonderful stuff ....pleasant smell and it does not drip...when i paint with one shot i am constantly aware and on edge and nervous about dripping paint on canvas ) (rick, i get it from mid west supply in portland,or. 1 800 228 0596 ) i use promo vinyl , the low cost stuff , and various size fitches...on this first project of six 6'x 16' awnings i am using high tack transfer tape and it is a little too aggressive (the next time i'll go with low tack) . it does pull the vinyl up and i have to go slow, rubbing down the vinyl behind as i remove the tape........ ( ahh, all the lessons i've learned on expensive jobs using methods for the first time!!!!) but it's working out great !!!! you do have to be careful with the adhesive..too much in one spot will stay on the canvas ...and i am doing some test as we speak.....the 3m cleaner seem to remove it .... for straight lines , as in a long background panel, packing tape works well (as glenn mentioned) however, after the first coat it does seem to left on the painted edge.....

so.........i'm learning alot by doing it and am appreciative of glenn's help !!!! believe me , you'll never use paint again ..

be where you are........vance

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[This message has been edited by vance galliher (edited July 09, 2000).]

Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

Vance,

Just out of curiosity, once you get the hang of it (low-tack transfer tape, light even spray of the 3M Super 77 spray adhesive and such) do you think this will speed up the production process for you and increase profitability?

------------------
Compost Happens!

:) Design is Everything! :)
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

Posted by Vance Galliher (Member # 581) on :

..........absolutly!!!!! how much do i owe you????? hahahaha vance

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Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :

On the house!

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Compost Happens!

:) Design is Everything! :)
Glenn Taylor
in beautiful North Carolina

http://members.tripod.com/taylor_graphics
walldog@geeksnet.com

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