You know when I was about 16 or 17, my first year in the trade as it was I was in Kansas City visiting my aunt and uncle and while there I went downtown to a used bookstore and working on the storefront window was a black signpainter. Man was he good. Up to that point I had never seen anyone with that kind of brush control and speed. Impressed the hell out of my young mind. Decided then and there that I would be like him someday. My question to you is where are all the black signpainters at? This man was the first and only black person I've seen in the business. It's not that it makes any real difference to me, its just that I'm curious. Of all the Letterhead meets I've been to and all the shops I've visited in the last 25 years I've yet to run across another one. Do you know of any? Why is this? Is the sign business racist?
I've been pondering these questions for some time and hope some of you can give me further insight on this issue.
------------------ Terry Teague James River Signs Reeds Spring, MO tlteague@tri-lakes.net
Posted by Chuck Davis (Member # 1261) on :
Come to think of it...I've never personally seen a black "letterhead" myself. I believe this has more to do with the trade being passed down from generation to generation. My father was an artist, and now I am. Initially, blacks were not encouraged to pursue such endeavors. They were too busy just trying to stay alive. Perhaps, had the country not been so ignorant, we would have that many more fellow letterheads today. We may never know what we missed out on.
By the same token, where are all the white gospel singers? Is the gospel community racist? Your question teeters on the edge of absurdity my friend.
I know of a black sign painter down here in So fla. I've hired him for a job or two when I had gotten swamped. Matter of fact, he was on the news for his black history murals in St Pete. His name is Thomas English. There is a black airbrusher that would call me for help years ago. He is now doing very well and is located in the Oldsmar Flea market which isn't far from me. His name is Rod. Keep in mind, not all people have computers and not all people get the trade mags either. They just sling paint one day to the next and go on and on and on and do pretty well for themselves. Good post Terry!
------------------ Robert Salyers Southern Masters Unlimited Clearwater, FL airbrushnow@email.msn.com
Being from Memphis, I have run accross a number of black signpainters. Some had styles that were, well, geared to knockouts. Others like Terry Rideout and R.L. Smith were outstanding sign painters. Both worked in area shops as well as on their own. I think I can safely speak for the majority of the Memphis shops and say that , no it's not a racist thing. If the guy could swing a brush he could get hired at "most" shops. Good question Terry, they seem to really be in the minority for some reason, but in my forty years in auto racing I have only seen a handful of black stock car drivers yet I have seen many, many black drag racers. Go figure. By the way, one of my all time heroes is Steve Stanford.
------------------ George Perkins Millington,TN. goatwell@ixlmemphis.com
"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left"
[This message has been edited by George Perkins (edited December 20, 1999).]
Posted by old paint (Member # 549) on :
i told all you guys at marks that every meeting needs at least one ...black...and i was yours, just ax me!....hahahaha when i was a kid (5-6) there was this black guy who was a deaf/mute...and all he did was draw, he could do a pencil portrait in 10 mins....draw any car, animal ect ect you could think of....i was fasinated ...iam here in pensacola and ive seen a couple workin and i have a gentelman who helps me out when i get more work then i can handle...and he is good....i can hand him a pattern for the race track and in couple hours hes done...i was tryin to get a hold of him before i went to montgomery...but he was busy.... old paint joe
------------------ joe pribish-A SIGN MINT 6050 mobile hwy pensacola, fl 32526 850-944-5060
Posted by Brad Ferguson (Member # 33) on :
I know an old-timer in Little Rock named Hawkins. He's retired now, with poor eyesight. But he did some pretty decent glass gold work in his day. I used to ask a similar question about female sign painters, why there were so few when I was coming up. That has certainly changed.
Brad in Arkansas
------------------ Brad Ferguson 4782 West Highway 22 Paris AR 72855 501-963-2642 signbrad@cswnet.com
Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :
I've been to a few letterhead meets, and never once met a black signpainter. Then again, the food served at those meets that I attended definately didn't include anything resembling "soul food", and any music featured didn't include anything from "Motown" or Rhythm & Blues either. Kinda makes you wonder if any "invitations" have been made to those individuals, as to why we see so little participation, from that group.
------------------ Ken Henry Henry & Henry Signs London, Ontario Canada (519) 439-1881 e-mail kjmlhenry@home.com
Posted by Bernice Tornquist (Member # 16) on :
This is a great post, Terry.
Maybe we need to extend a welcome to black sign makers to some of the letterhead meets.
I, for one, would love to see them there and see their work.
I knew a fella when I was 19 yrs old and living and workin in midtown Atlanta. I was on foot everywhere I went...took advantage of buses when I could. He had a shop in the heart of town and hid hookers out behind his easel when their pimps got violent. He did a lot of slap out with glitter...had his own style, and went down in history as the food guy because he could paint it pretty well! His name was JJ of LA. We played pool at the laundry mat on Tenth and Juniper on saturdays.
The last time I saw him was a year ago...at the Pioneer Neon Supply Co. I was picking up sign supplies and he was crawling up into a small pick up with more bungee cords and duck tape on it than anything I'd ever seen.
It had been 20 yrs since I'd seen him last and I wish he'd been blessed more than it appeared he had. He was a kind and jolly fellow! It would be nice if he'd had a family like letterheads to hang with.
Count your blessings this Christmas and take nothing for granted, instead, give with Love and Joy!
------------------ *@:) Sign Painters always have 1-Shot left! (:@* Linda Silver Eagle #5653 Silver Eagle Graphix Studio in GA, USA Big on Murals and Tight on Camera Ready (770) 822-0117
Posted by Dave Draper (Member # 102) on :
Terry,
I have seen many extremely talented black artists who could eaisly be great sign makers in this area. But, given, that many sign shops are "Maw & Paw shops or one owner shops...99.9 % white contracting business from business largely owned by whites....I think it is extremely difficult to break through the color barrier for these individuals. White owned businesses tend to do business with white business...sad as it may be.
------------------ Go Get 'Em..... :) AKA Raptorman on #Letterheads mIRC Chat Draper The Signmaker Bloomington Illinois USA
Proud 2-yr. $upporter of this Web Site (May 1999-May 2001)
Posted by FranCisco Vargas (Member # 145) on :
You're right there is not many. I know a Black Sign Painter, one from right here in Fresno, dread locks and all, but a very cool dude, in fact I was having lunch the other day right across from his shop the other day, and saw him come out so I waved and he waved me over to visit, he's a dynamite artist, and also a good sign painter. I told him about this site to get in and stroll around, his name is "JJ" so if you ever see that name thats him. I also knew one from San Jose but can't remember his name now. but I would say one of the bravest black sign painters I ever worked with was when I was in Birmingham, AL it was while working with P-King on his big tower project. his name was Herman Reeves, we was up 100' on a boom lift, and we was at a corner spot that needed to be painted, but I would have to retract in then move the whole boom over just to get to this one little spot, So I told Herman (who was about 6'3" or so. I'm 5'7") so instead of going thru all this movement, I said, for him to hold on to my belt, cause I was going to climb up on top of the rails of the basket, so i could get to that one spot and be done with this section. He tells me why don't you just move out of the way and let me get to it? I told him there is "no way i could hold you" by your belt if you slip. you weight way more then me. he said, don't worry, "just don't move when I get on top of the rails!" I said "ok". I said to myself Damn this dude is crazier than me, at least I knew he could hold my weight, but i could'nt hold his. He climbed up like it was a piece of cake slapped that paint around and we was done with that piece. I was releived too. another was Don Wilson, met both these cats thru P-King. I had been working everyday on this project, but at the same time I knew I needed to get out, shake a leg or something! Pat does'nt really drink, and so Pat had told Don maybe he could show me around Birmingham, so Don comes over and picks me up, as were leaving to go hit a few clubs, over in the golden West Side of Birmingham. he tells me I don't know how you feel about being in this Club, everyone is all Black! I said man that ain't no big thing, I grew up on the streets in China Town in West Side Fresno, I know about Black Folk, lets go! He was'nt lying, everyone was Black! not a white soul in site. and another thing I saw in the deep south is... You don't see any Mexicans!! so talk about being a minority, wheeeew I was a major minority! but we had a lot of fun that night. I saw this one Fine light skinned Black Chick, so Don tells me hey man that chick sure is checking you out I said "I know, but she also has a big boyfriend too! I'll leave it at that........ good post Terry, gave me flash backs
------------------ FranCisco Vargas aka: Cisco aka:Traveling Millennium Sign Artist http://www.franciscovargas.com Fresno, CA 93703 559 252-0935
"to live life, is to love life, a sign of no life, is a sign of no love"...Cisco 12'98
Posted by Cam Bortz (Member # 55) on :
I recall an African-american painter who worked on Bill Huegs mural in Belvidere; was amazed watching him blending the shading colors on a column wet-on-wet with a brush in each hand. I didn't get to meet him but I think someone said he was a bulletin painter from Chicago. Otherwise, every meet I have attended has been pretty much a lilywhite deal. Good post, Terry. Wish I could answer your question.
------------------ "A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. - Raoul Duke (Hunter S. Thompson)
Cam Finest Kind Signs 256 S. Broad St. Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379 "Award winning Signs since 1988"
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
The first shop that I werked at was owned by a black guy! Excellent artist and fast letterer. He is the one who taught me to run with a really wet brush! Know a couple of black sign ppl in LA, one is a little gal who is one heck of a wall dog!
------------------ Si Allen #562 La Mirada, CA. USA (714) 521-4810 ICQ # 330407 "SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"
Brushasaurus on Chat
[This message has been edited by Si Allen (edited December 20, 1999).]
Posted by Santo (Member # 411) on :
I met a guy in the Home Depot last month. He took one look at the supplies I was buying, and he asked me if I painted signs. He was from Shreveport and that's 5 hours north. Did both electrical and sign work for fast food chains.
Hi Terry...I used to work for a black family in Denver.The owner was an x NFL player and his folks ran the office.None of them painted but they were in the business.
But now that you mention it, there are even fewer female black sign painters.Do you think maybe they just set their sites a little higher than we do.
------------------ Monte Jumper SIGNLanguage/Norman.Okla.
Posted by B Daniel (Member # 11) on :
Vernon Frazier is a black signpainter I have worked with here in Murfreesboro, Tennessee. I wish I could be half the brush artist he is.
------------------ Beth Daniel Murfreesboro, TN
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
Cisco is right about both Don Wilson(great small script)teaches caligraphy too!! Herman Reeves will be at my shop tomorrow and helping me for a couple of days on some billboard work. Also worked under a great artist/signpainter at Birmingham Coca Cola. I have invited BOTH Don and Herman to letterhead meets,but to no avail. Seems thier interest must be somewhere else. I met the guy in Belvidire Cam spoke of and he is on the Walldog Raw video from Jay Allen Got other sign friends who are white,have computers,that I have told of this website,and THEY seem to be uninterested!!! OH WELL some sign people are just not cut out to be letterheads.
------------------ PKing is Pat King of King Sign Design in McCalla,Alabama The Professor of SIGNOLOGY
Posted by bill riedel (Member # 607) on :
Hi Cam, The guy you referred to is from N.J., around the Atlantic City area. I had the pleasure of working side by side with him on the Bill Heug's wall. He is a great talent and a fine gentleman. Met his wife at the big breakfast the Chamber of Commerce gave for us. She is white and also a very nice person. Bill Riedel
------------------ Bill Riedel Riedel Sign Co., Inc. Little Ferry, NJ billsr@riedelsignco.com
I said "I know, but she also has a big boyfriend too! I'll leave it at that........ good post Terry, gave me flash backs