The Letterville BullBoard: Wood Finish Question

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Posted by Janette Balogh (Member # 192) on :

Hi folks,

Well, I have an idea in my head, and it's something I haven't done before, so I thought I'd toss it out here.

I'm wanting to see the wood grain in an exterior sandblasted redwood sign, and don't know what type of sealer or primer to use to make that happen. I'm also concerned about how the sign will weather and hold up through time and the elements. Down here that's lotsa sun, humitity and rain.

Do I use a clear primer of sorts, or just stain the wood and then put a clear on it?
All the copy on this sign will be gilded, so I'd rather not clear coat the sign.

I'd really appreciate some insight on how to proceed with getting the results I'm after here. If I'm not explaining myself clearly, please let me know.

Thanks much!
Nettie

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"When Love and Skill Work Together ... Expect a Masterpiece"

Janette Balogh
Sign Studio
in Sunny Florida
jbalogh@earthlink.net
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Posted by Don Hulsey (Member # 128) on :

Nettie,

First off, I saw a little of your work in my new SignCraft. Looks GREAT!!! However, you or them one are mispelling your name.heh heh

Sherwin-Williams offers a product called sanding sealer that is basically a primer for clear coats. This product will seal the wood so it doesn't take so much clear coat. I'm sure all of the others have something similar, but this is the only one I am familiar with. If you are staining, you will want to apply stain first, then sanding sealer, then clear finish.

Good Luck,
Don

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Don Hulsey
Strokes by DON signs
Utica, KY
sbdsigns@aol.com

Posted by Create-A-Sign (Member # 710) on :

I'm sorry I don't know the best answer to your question, but we just did our first big sandlasted white cedar project and we stained it and then exterior cleared it and to be honest with you, my help picked out the product and I can't remember the name. I will look and see if you want me to (I'm at home now, so no luck right this minute), but I'm just getting involved in this end of signs (and by the way, I love it!) and I probably don't have the best answers for you.

However!!!! I have a question for you in return...or for anyone who reads this post....my customer would like to put stainless steel strips down the whole back of the sign (the sign is 4'x6'), the strips would run the 4'...across all the boards that are glued together. When I say strips....this is just a thought for a mounting method to the brick wall because of course on the end of the strip would be a spot to drill through into the wall. (am I making sense??) What I want to know is....
A) anyone got a better idea for mounting
or more importantly
B) will screwing these "strips" down the back do anything to the wood as it trys to expand and contract?? Will it cause the sign to warp...or aid in it NOT warping??

Hope you can help... Hope to get good at this stuff eventually!!

Lori

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Lori Corriveau
68-B Loring Avenue
Salem, MA 01970

Posted by Dave Correll (Member # 100) on :

Hey Nettie,
If your concerned about how the sign will weather, I would recommend using an acylic latex finish rather than clearing or staining. If your committed to a clear, I would recommend Sikens clear. Although I don't use the product myself (I don't clear any of my sandblasted redwood signs), I do know of people who use Sikens to clear their routed cedar signs, and they get about 5 years out of their signs before they have to refinish. Sandblasted redwood, however, when cleared, has a dark reddish color to it with no distiguishable grain visible, so why not use a dark reddish acrylic latex, and have the same look, but have 2 to 3 times the life span of the sign?

Just my opinion.

Dave Correll
Brushwork signs
Faribault, MN

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Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :

Nettie, am I missing something? Why is everyone making it so complicated? A good clear oil sealer will last a long time all by itself! You can get it with tints or clear, and add lettering color to tint it if you desire. We use a product called DuckBack on the left coast. The only hassle is gilding with care and a shopvac!

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"The codfish lays ten thousand eggs,
the homely hen lays one
the codfish never cackles to tell you
what she's done
And so we shun the codfish while
the lowly hen we prize
Which only goes to show you
that it pays to advertise!"
*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ Ogden Nash

The Sign Shop
Mendocino, CA.

Posted by Steve Purcell (Member # 1140) on :

Janette,
I favor a product by U.S. Paints called Awl-Grip. It's a super durable, crystal clear, linear polyurethane enamel.
It's kind of hot, so you need to use supplied air, but the results are fantastic.

Lori,
The best defense against warping is a good lamination, one without the need for excessive clamping pressure.
If you must mount via straps, then make the holes oblong & don't overtighten the screws.

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SCP
spurcell99@mediaone.net
Cape Cod, MA

Posted by Richard Bustamante (Member # 370) on :

The problem with most sealers is that they don't let the wood breathe. This, in the long run, makes the wood crack. I've found a product that works well with sandblasted sign with a natural finish. Sikens. Its by far the best one I've ever used, and I've used plenty. It get my vote.
"Have a productive day, and be careful out there."

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Richard Bustamante
12646 E. American Ave.
Del Rey, Ca. 93616
e-mail: signwiz@valleyone.net
www.studio-b.net

Posted by David Fisher (Member # 107) on :

Gday Netti.
I'm experimenting with a finish you may or may nor be familiar with called tung oil.
So far its outlasted the other clears i've used but I dont use automotive and that'd be my first call.
Enjoy,
David

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D.A. & P.M. Fisher Signwriting
Brisbane Australia
da_pmf@yahoo.com

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

.

[This message has been edited by TBUK (edited December 07, 1999).]

Posted by jimmy chatham (Member # 525) on :

have you thought about thompsons water sealer?

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Jimmy Chatham
Chatham Signs
164 Poplar Rd.
Commerce, Ga 30529
706-335-2348
Fax 706-335-3378
icq#11718273

Posted by Sarah Clark (Member # 413) on :

Tung oil is very old product and very good. One of the best protectants and durable outside. It is also pretty expensive. It was used on boats years ago and is used in furniture making

Concerning strips down the back of sign..verticle grain wood doesnt expand much like flat grain but there will be some. I would make all the screw holes in the steel, except for a middle one, elongated to accomodate some expansion.

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S. Clark
Clark Signs (retired)
Compton, Arkansas
sasc@alltel.net
http://members.xoom.com/sclark/

[This message has been edited by Sarah (edited November 18, 1999).]

Posted by John Byrd (Member # 825) on :

Hiya Nettie!

Did a gozillion sandblasted redwood signs and the thing that you DON'T need in a clear finish outdoors is anything that builds a film. i.e. clear varnishes or polyurethanes.
I haven't seen a clear coat on wood that doesn't go bad within a year.
We had alot of success with C.W.F. from the DURON paint store. Have also used boiled linseed oil. There's also a product I've read about for log homes but have no experience with it.
One of the problems with redwood here in the south is our wet weather. The chemicals in redwood react with moisture and the wood will begin to darken. So the best thing to do is to use one of the penetrating oil finishes and keep brushing it on until the wood can absorb no more. And then every couple months go do it again.
Hope this helps, and if you have any other questions please feel free to call!

770-735-6874

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John Byrd
Ball Ground
Georgia
letrhed1@tds.net
so happy I gotta sit on both my hands to keep from wavin' at everybody!

Posted by Ron Percell (Member # 399) on :

SignLife has been Great.

I like two coats of the clear primer, no
problems after many years, preped the redwood just fine for tape and paint.

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Ron Percell
Percell Signs
Petaluma, California

Home of the MicroMeet!

E-mail
percell@percellsigns.com
Web-Site
www.percellsigns.com/

Posted by Cam Bortz (Member # 55) on :

Nettie
The great thing about varnishing a wood sign is you are guaranteed refinishing it every couple years. I use multiple coats of a heavy-duty marine varnish; in my area it is good for two-to-four years, depending on sun exposure. Could be less in Florida with your tropical sunlight. As long as your customer understands, and is willing to pay for, repeatedly maintaining their signs, its not a problem; just realize it is not going to be a sign you can hang up and forget for six or eight years.

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"A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. - Raoul Duke (Hunter S. Thompson)

Cam
Finest Kind Signs
256 S. Broad St.
Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379
"Award winning Signs since 1988"

Posted by Dave Sherby (Member # 698) on :

Nettie, for a clear coat on wood, Sikkens gets my vote too. I've used Sikkens Cetal step 1 and step 2 on several cedar and redwood signs. I learned about it from some contractors that have claimed 14 years durability on cedar siding, so I tried it. The first sign I did with it was a carved mahogony sign for a ferry boat. It made the mahogony look great. BUT, if its the sandblasted area you want natural, I wouldn't go with the Sikkens. I did a sample for a golf course that wanted the blasted area a natural look. The Sikkens darkened the blasted redwood and was a little too thick to get down into the deep parts of the verticle grain. When I want a natural redwood look, I use SignLife Sunset Brown. I've had very good luck with SignLife stains, (10 years +) but their clear coat didn't last more than 3 years.

Lori,

The stainless steel strips will work as long as the holes for the screws are slots. Put washers on and don't crank down the screws, just snug them up lightly. The washer should almost spin freely. This allows the screw head to slide along the slot. Even as stable as redwood is, humididty changes can expand and contract it 1% to 3%. Only one percent of a 48" sign is almost a half inch. The wood WILL move. The steel won't stop it. So you'll either bend the steel (warp) or the crews will be ripped out of the sign.

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Dave Sherby
"Sandman"
SherWood Sign & Graphic Design
Crystal Falls, MI 49920
906-875-6201
ICQ: 21604027
sherwood@up.net

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