The Letterville BullBoard: The Escalating Cost of Letterhead Meets

This is topic The Escalating Cost of Letterhead Meets in forum Tips & Tricks at The Letterville BullBoard.

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Posted by Terry Teague (Member # 796) on :

Why is it that the cost of attending the big meets goes up and up and up each year?
When I attended Bloomington last year the cost of admission was 110.00. This year going to Mazeppa is around 175.00.
When I hosted the Missouri Moon meet '96 we charged 25.00,I lost money!,but only because my estimate of attendance was off by about 15 people. Everybody got a teeshirt and feed all three days of the meet, plus live music!
I thought the object of hosting a meet was to have a great time and break even on the meet.(Am I just cheap?)

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Terry Teague
James River Signs
Reeds Spring, MO
tlteague@tri-lakes.net

Posted by Mark Smith (Member # 298) on :

I'm not one to judge; I've only been to one meet and I paid $20.00. $110 or $175 seems too high at first blush, though. I wouldn't hesitate to pay $50 but $100 might keep me home if I did it often. This may well keep some regulars out in the long run.

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Mark Smith
Ampersand Signs & Design
EstiMate Sign Estimating Software
www.ampweb.com/estimate
1-888-304-3300
Hailing from beautiful Asheville, N.C.

Posted by jumpin on :

I know it takes a lot of time and energy to put on a meet,but I have to agree with
Terry here,no one wants any of the sponsors to lose money,at the same time some restraint might be in order.

One area that comes to mind would be to offer a different rate for couples or (married or unmarried) sure there will be some that take advantage of that situation too,but so what at least they will be there.

Maybe a set rate per shop (per two people)with a pro-rated fee for additional people from that same shop.

I think maybe a forum for this topic is in order on chat some evening.I don't want anyone to lose money putting on meets but if you want to maintain the input of talent,personality,and good ole comraderie I think we all need to take another look here.

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Monte Jumper/SIGNLanguage Norman Oklahoma

Posted by Janette Balogh (Member # 192) on :

I've had this thought in the back of my mind too Terry. I'm sure I'm not alone in the financial concerns either.

Cost is sadly becoming a deciding factor in these things for me. When you add plane fare and lodging to the mix it soon gets to be a hard decision to make.

I realize that there is much to learn at these meets, from people with a wealth of skills. This seems to be the one major element for me that justifies the cost.

However, I can see myself attending less of them in the future for the sheer fact of their cost. I would be more than willing to forego some of the fancy stuff, fan-fare, and bells and whistles that may be driving up the cost, just to be able to meet with some creative friends, see all the wonderful talent in their projects, and share in the experience of learning.

I've caught the "Letterhead Bug" for sure, and I am hoping that the costs for the Meets will hit a balance that I can manage more comfortably.

Mazeppa is one I really don't want to miss, but it will still depend on my finances as it draws closer. I know Mike Meyer and gang will be giving us the biggest bang for our buck, but right now it's still alot of money to let loose of. I estimate for Craig and I to make it, we'll be out about $1200. bux when it's all said and done. Ouch!

Just wondering, as Monte mentioned, ... is there a break in cost for a "significant other"? (as in spouse, boyfriend, employee etc?)

Looking forward to Mazeppa, and hoping I will make it!
Sure would like to be able to do a write up for that one!
Nettie

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Janette Balogh
Sign Studio
in Sunny Florida
jbalogh@earthlink.net
Current Pet Profile - Please send us yours!
www.markfair.com/nettie

[This message has been edited by Janette Balogh (edited May 15, 1999).]

Posted by The kid (Member # 779) on :

Am i cheap.....hmmmm.. If you have to ask ...I'd say VERY!..

This meet is gonna be a BIGGIE! I personaly can't put a value on the info I'm going to get... And the laughs I'll get when I look at the sign mags and chuckle about the good, Excuse me AWESOME ! time I had with these people.. Heroes or Idles some are....lol

A couple of weeks ago I went to a meet just to see one of my favorite stripers..
Alan Johnson.. He's from N.J. I'm from Michigan.. I see him in all the books I had to meet him... it was cheap to go to Kentucky to see him and all the other talented folks...I don't put a price on that...
I hear some of you crying about Hotels, Motels, Well I'm sure you are aware of the school gym for barracks.. FREE ... hello is this on! FREE! FREE! FREE ! .. nothing like roughing it.. Showers , Roof over head.. and a few drunks to tell to shut up.. I'm trying to sleep...lol..

Well I'm all better now... I hope to have a few drinks... Scratch that .. TO MUCH TO DRINK with all you talented folks.... If you don't drink ..well you can look at the magazine and say.. " there's that drunk Michigan Left handed Sign Freak" ..he sure was funny to watch stumble around. LOL ( thankyou.)

OH yeh by the way i cant wait to tip a few at Ore's idle hour.. And yank a few pull-tabs.Cruise in the Meyers signs Stude' pickup. And just Show everyone how awesome this talent we have is...YEEEHAAA!!!

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Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :

Hi Terry. The cost of attending meets is definitely escalating, and maybe it's time to consider smaller more regional events, with one big International Meet annually.
The cost to the host must be tremendous because of the logistics of feeding so many, arranging accomodations, shuttles, sponsors'space, soliciting prizes etc. Added to this is also the cost of lost production in their own shop due to time devoted to organizing and hosting the meet itself. An International Meet should probably be hosted by a regional group so that these costs can better be spread around among several hosts.
We owe a debt of gratitude to Mike Meyer for taking upon himself this monumental task, and all other shops and individuals who have hosted events in the past. The generosity of these folks is truely in the Letterhead Spirit, but the monetary cost must be a consideration also. If the price of attendance becomes prohibitive, then attendance will surely drop, and lesser participation will result.
The smaller, less costly regional type meets might be a solution worth considering.

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Ken Henry
Henry & Henry Signs
London, Ontario Canada
(519) 439-1881
e-mail kjmlhenry@home.com

Posted by denise carson (Member # 508) on :

well, on behalf of the Muster Letterhead committee i am going to share some thoughts regarding escalating costs,..

Yes.... costs have crept up every year,.. with each meet there comes a seperate theme and seperate set of circumstances that will always dictate price. I don't believe any one that hosts an international event is trying to make some enormous profit,.. only trying to put on a meet that is memorable and different. I think you will see prices level out in the future or even drop a bit,.. our meet is a bit more and let me reiterate why:

This years meet in Mazeppa will indeed be 60 dollars higher than last year,... take into concideration this event is FOUR working days instead of the traditional three or "two and a half" because folks generally leave mid day sunday. Take into concideration that because this is the last event of the decade, we do indeed want it to be special.. we were honored to become the 99 meet hosts and i think with that there should be some extras! Take into concideration this year along with the seminars and quality of projects we have come to expect we are including TEN meals,.. a parade for friday nite in true minnesota style, and two street dances,.. we realize you don't nessisarily "require" the frills but,.. this meet is one we want you all to remember for years ot come... divide
170 by four days and you are paying 42.50 per day,..... not bad... it costs more than that for two people to go out on the town one evening, (dinner, drinks, movie)
so..... i say we all just paint one more set of truck doors and BAM.... there ya go.... there will be no better way to spend 170.00 in August 1999. We hope with the meals and some of the freebies (homeshare and the gymnasium setup) we will be able to help you defer some of the cost.... but thereis one thing we know for sure,,, you WILL get your monies worth and you will NOT be dissappointed...

I have an appointment to get to... i have a few other points i'dlike to make but i will have do it later!!!!
have a great weekend!!
denise carson

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"ever wonder what it'd be like to join the CIRCUS? just ask ME... i work in one."

Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :

I, too, really want to go to the Mazeppa meet but I am seriously wondering about the $1000+ that it will cost me and Shirley to go to a 3 day weekend event. That's $1000+ Cdn. and we would be driving there. If we had to fly and rent a car on arrival that would probably be more like $1600-$1700. I know it will be a great meet and that in the total expense the actual cost of admission is not that great. But it is still a lot of money for a long weekend. Hmmmmm maybe I'll win the lottery??

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Dave Grundy shop#340
AKA "applicator" on mIRC
"stickin' sticky stuff to valuable vessels and vehicles!"
in Granton, Ontario, Canada
dave.grundy@odyssey.on.ca
www.odyssey.on.ca/~dave.grundy
"A PROUD $ supporter of the website"

Posted by denise carson (Member # 508) on :

hi all.... i'm back..... went on an excursion to Red WIng, Minnesota where Mike and I had the pleasure of having lunch with Noel Weber who was in the area,....you can no doubt appreciate my excitement to get out of here and make "the appointment!"

on the way to the meal we discussed the concerns about the cost of the august meet, meets in the past, and future meets.
We discussed how in the planning stages of this event when all the numbers were on the table, how it was the unanimous vote of ten people that the registration fee would need to be this amount.......... (Nettie, spouses only pay $50.00) Registration fees are not a number that are just pulled out of the air,.. they are figured, refigured and concidered very seriously and carefully. We know that there are some who will find it too pricey, but we also know most will be ok with it.... and we are confident that we will "do right by it".

Also i will reiterate that we have worked just as hard to be able to offer assistance in lodging such as the school indoor camping and the homeshare program we are working on......
Mike and Noel and I all agreed that each meet will be diffrent no matter how ya slice it.....the cost will always vary, and there will always be some that can't afford it that year........ we appreciate your concerns, and we have even at one stage or another shared the same ones, but that being said.. we trudge forward and hope for the best.

Perhaps International events aren't for everyone, frankly i think smaller meets are more satisfiing on the personal level but the commeradery and wealth of knowledge shared at the big meets is something you can't put a price on...and something you just can't find anywhere else.... i hope that you'll find a way to make it to our event... and even if you don't ......i guess theres always next year! Thanks to everyone for all the input,..no one is wrong here......... everyone is entitled to an opinion,.....
thanks for letting me babble on.
One of the muster folks.

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"ever wonder what it'd be like to join the CIRCUS? just ask ME... i work in one."

Posted by Mike Lavallee (Member # 320) on :

Hi gang,

After just hosting the 7th annual Pinhead summit and panel jam i'm very aware of the cost of putting one of these events on.

The cost of this years jam was $125.00 per person.

Here is a cost breakdown on that $125.00

1. food for 2 1/2 days ..........$80.00
this included the hall rental

2. Event T shirt.................$15.

3. Event Pin ...................$ 3.

4. Aluminum panels 5 per person..$ 7.50

5. bomb iron on for shirts......$ 1.50
------
$ 107.00

now thats what you got for your money in hand not including door prizes that were donated.

Now here are some of the other cost that I can remember that had to come out of that $125.

$600.00 in phone bills to arrange donations , get people to come to the show, call the magazines to advertize the event.all calls have to me made during regular business hours ( average 4-5 hrs a day for months) NO KIDDING!

$200. to have flyers printed and postage for 300 + flyers

another $300 for aluminum panels ( this was an extra cost that i payed for so we wouldnt run out of panels, at pinhead events panels tend get used up quickly)

Unkown amount for gas to run the 50 miles back and forth to rochester to make all the arrangements with the hall

$450.00 for the band

and i know there are many more hidden costs that i cant remember but had to happen to pull this thing off the way it went.

Plus all the time spent away from My own work to work on this thing, anyway, It was all worth it even though it did cost me out of my pocket. thats the cost of putting on a party I guess.

If you look at these events as seminars instead of just meeting and greeting people in the industry and think about what it would cost to have the Pro's that demonstrate their craft for you , even if you only get one tip out of the event that will make your job easier or more creative, I think its an extremely cheap education.
plus its a business write off on your taxes.

well, I think that you can get just as much out of a small event sometime as a large one also. but when you get more that 20 or 30 people together its nice to offer a little more to entertain and make the event more memerable.

One more note, when you go to these events , remember to thank the people who donate supplies and door prizes it is an incredibly expensive proposition for them when 40 or 50 events ask for things for their individual events. and if it wasnt for their incredible generosity the costs to put these events on would REALLY BE OUT OF SIGHT!!

take care, Mike

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life moves pretty darn fast, if you dont take time to look at it you could miss it!

Posted by jumpin on :

You know there seems to be a general theme here.Cut the hoopla and get back to basics.(the one on one regional meets)

Am I the only one that is reading this between the lines.

I'm glad to find out there is a special rate for spouses,was that published? Did I miss it?If so it's really a shame because the cost of 2 people at $170.was the deciding factor in our going to the Cork Meet.(it seemed to us that the fee accounted for 1/2 the total cost for one ticket to Ireland,so we went that route)

Well maybe we'll make the next one,good luck and have a good time in Minnesota.

Best wishes to Mike meyers and his crew,I know they will do a fine job and this will be a one of a kind event.

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Monte Jumper/SIGNLanguage Norman Oklahoma

Posted by Kent Smith (Member # 251) on :

This debate happens every year. I remember passing the hat at early meets and much less structure to pay for and prepare. Yes the cost go up, have you checked the price of Motel 6 recently? When they first went into business the price of a single room was $6, hence the name. When I was in college a couple whiles ago (as my daughter used to say) I was paying 13 cents a gallon for gasoline.

When we hosted the two big meets and helped with many others, discussion of the fee to charge took up the most time and most sole searching. To do a large meet correctly, there are inherent costs with the idea of breaking even at the forefront and not having to make up a loss after the meet is over.

In 1985 in Denver, We charged $75 per person, $100 per couple and $10 for children 6-18 years. We added $25 for entries after May 10 and were ridiculed for suggesting a fee as high as $100 for a three dya/24 hour event. Our attendance in 1985 was 783.

In 1995 in Denver, we tried to keep the fee close to the $100 but quickly found that impossible. Full registration was $145 ($195 after June 15), spouses $75, Children 8-16 $75 and Children 2-7 $50. Additionally we had the two day Letterhead University for $95 per person. There were also additional events adn activities for a fee as well as $5 for parking and a reduced rate at the Red Lion Hotel of $73 per night. We budgeted based upon 500 attendees which we felt was conservative based upon the number of people saying they would not miss another Denver meet. Our attendence was just under 500 while we thought we might have 750 based upon the 1985 numbers which by the way is still the record for number of attendees. We had to go back to vendors and negotiate the best we could and it was a real squeaker. We lucked out that neither the hotel nor the hall charged us back for paint spills, hazardous removal or extra day charges for load-out.

Hosting any size meet is risky since you take on liability, general expenses and unknown attendance. Most of the meet expenses are contracted way before most attendees decide to go which must be paid even if no one shows up.

If you can't afford to attend a large meet or "Internaitonal" meet, then don't go. Stick to the smaller ones where the budget can be more controlled. AND start charging $300 and up to letter that van so you will be profitable and we all can have that reunion in Mazeppa 1999 or Boise 2000.

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Posted by Dave Correll (Member # 100) on :

A few weeks ago we bidded on a cube van for a printing company. Yesterday, I saw that van on the road while Mike Meyer and myself were returning from doing a window spash from a not to distant town. The said van was lettered by another company...my guess according to the design...was from either the two franchised sign companys in my area. Pity, the design lacked many of the basic sign design principles, and therefore, had no eye appeal. I'm no Mike Stevens, but for the extra money...I think they would have had a more effective and attractive cube van if they went with us.

People...I'm on the staff, I'm even a project leader. I'm am and will gladly pay the $170 fee to attend this meet. I know I don't have the travel costs, but isn't that irrevelant? Travel costs are travel costs to get to an international meet. Get your butts up here and have a once in a lifetime experience! We are not putting on a pair of magnetics or a no parking sign type meet, it's a hand carved, gold leafed, smalted, double faced, pictorialized meet! We are doing our best to put on a top of the line type meet. An international meet. The meets of all meets. Come on! Give us a break!

Thanks for listening!
Dave Correll
Faribault, MN

WARNING! This post was influenced by Merle's Fine Homemade Wine.

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Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

I think we let all meets be sponsored by the Shortreeds" that way it will be voluntary IF you want
to pay or not, and the amount" you want to pay", and It will be like walking into a bar with (what
was that band that is playing Steve?) and we all will sing la al la la la..and share our talent and
beer"" OR we can choose Not to go, or GO" some day we hope to get the event big enough to
have one of the major networks cover it and we all can stay home and watch it on TV with the
added advantage of instance replay..now that is the meet of ALL meets. TBuk

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Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :

I don't think money has a thing to do with the opportunity of being around,working with,discussing amongst our peers.Both the creative & business end of something that puts bread on the table!
How many times have we heard" I wish I could do that"And we take our craft so non-chalantly.
I belive these meets are a matter of priority in our own lives.Personal & Professional.I don't understand using the EXCUSE of money for not attending a function that not only will help you in your business,but allows you to make friends at the same time!
Of course I never understood the customer when they used the same EXCUSE in wanting a professional looking sign either. The answer is the SAME.If the customer doesn't care about his business to pay what it cost.Then it seems like his priorities are in his wallet about the present,not being smart enough to look to the future for all the benefits that inturn helps his wallet!!!
IF the registration was $365.oo thats only a dollar a day!HELL I could panhandle that much.This is like NOT being able to help support this web site at only $50.oo per year.It all boils down to what is my priority in live?Although everyone is invited.I have noticed only the cream of the crop usally show up.They not only can afford it,but can take time off from thier businesses for a well deserved vaction.I can only think to myself that these people MUST be doing something RIGHT.I want to be around such people and learn what they know.I have always known that if you want to be successful,hang around successful people!
It is then that money is no promblem.
I will see ya'll in Mazeppa.Eager to learn,and eager to help!
After all SOMEONE has to bring the ladders & anything else that will be needed!I just hope I don't get any paint on my overalls!!!!

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PKing is
Pat King of
King Sign Design in
McCalla,Alabama
The Professor of
SIGNOLOGY

Posted by Rod BrofrogAnton (Member # 391) on :

I have to admit I had an inside track for the International Meet in Fargo a couple of years back. Being my brother was putting it on I didn't have to pay the entry fees.

All I had to do was buy airplane tickets for my wife and I from Sacramento, CA. to Fargo, arrive a week early and work 16 hours a day (both my wife and I) for the entire week not to mention staying for two days after to help clean up.

Would I do it again?? You bet!! It was one of the best meets I've been to. The inspiration, the comaraderie, the new found friends, the lessons learned and on and on.
FANTASTIC!!!

Unfortunately I won't be at this years cause the Sign Business Show in Long Beach was set for the same dates and I will be helping Superfrog who was commited to the show long before the Mazzepa meet was set.

We'll still be havin' fun in Long Beach and knowing you'll be having a blast in Mazzepa.

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Rod Anton (Brofrog)
Things Graphic
Sacramento, Ca.

"Humor is the Vaseline of Life"

Posted by mike meyer (Member # 542) on :

The year is 2015, a bunch of Letterheads are sitting around in a "Virtual Meet" probably 3D and all the weird-space age frills of the current times, one turns to another and says, remember that Meet in Mazeppa back in the 19's? Wow was that Americana er what? The horse drawn shuttle, "Patches" the Clown, the closeness of the neighbors and townfolk of Mazeppa! Would anyone gripe about the price? If they had the time of their life, who cares?! Thanks to Mike LaVallee for his Break down of hie meet in New York. Mike gets it. He unselfishly took time out of his work and ran a great Letterhead meet, Hats off to Mike! As Dave Correll and Denise Carson stated, we are doing what we think is the least possible cost, so you folks don't have to worry, come and really get into it and make it memorable!
I love the small meets too, and I am trying to make this feel like one by utilizing my entire town! I've never looked back as far as what this could to a community and a letterhead movement, ask Jay Allen how it affects a town and also ask Jay about the money! Terry, we have a meet every year in February in Minneapolis and the fee is 0! We are more than aware of costs of Leterhead meets and I invite each and everyone of you to come and share and enjoy! Thanks for all the posts and for terry on bringing it up. I think we have explained what and why. til then I have lots of behind the scenes work ahead of me and if you choose to come this August, i won't let you down! thanks mike

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Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :

The meets we've done at our shop usually had attendance at around 75. We always BBQ'd fresh salmon and did as much as anyone could eat. No fast or cheap food. We had suppliers donate materials and door prizes if they wanted. We had no booths for commercial displays. We sold nothing. We eliminated the frills, no pins or aprons. I don't remember the numbers, but I think it was $25 a day.

Doing the invitations and contacting suppliers and follow up calls and renting the portable toilets and tables and doing it at our facility cost us about a months income from production loss each time. We broke even on the meet though!

I prefer the meets at someones shop rather than in a rented hall.I like having someont there doing the T-shirts to order and being able to return the unused ones. I also liked being able to have each attendee pull the squeege for their own shirt.

Maybe we need to do it in parks and parking lots!

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The Sign Shop
Mendocino, CA.

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

Very Very good Rick, TBuk.

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Posted by Cam Bortz (Member # 55) on :

Whether or not you choose to spend the money to attend a meet is a value judgement, just like a customer who chooses to spend $500 to have you letter his truck, instead of a $50 set of mags. The cost is a small material concern compared to the benefits of learning, comraderie, and just plain fun that a meet like this will inspire.

At the risk of some folks taking offence, it occurs to me that the people for whom $170 is too much are the people who need to be there the most. Meyer & Co. are doing more for this meet in terms of community involvement and public notice than anyone has done since Belvidere. Too much!?? Get a grip!

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"A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle

Every day is a good day. Some days are better than others.

Cam
Finest Kind Signs
256 S. Broad St.
Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379
"Award winning Signs since 1988"

Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :

Hi folks. Regarding cost...Larry Whan who hosted the Meet in Banff once told me "The cost of education is far less than the expense of Ignorance". Think about that. It has a great deal of truth and wisdom, and applies to every aspect of sign production and installation. The ideas and experiences shared at these meets is invaluable. One good tip or trick learned can save you hundreds or even thousands of dollars over the course of your careers. A proven procedure learned can also save you from "having to re-invent the wheel". These meets contribute directly toward your development as a sign professional. How much value can you place on that???
Attend the meet, find the bucks necessary to attend. Pitch in and help out with whatever you can contribute labour wise. The inspiration alone is worth the cost of admission with everything else as a bonus. One kernel of knowledge that you'll pick up there will cover your costs...and then some.

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Ken Henry
Henry & Henry Signs
London, Ontario Canada
(519) 439-1881
e-mail kjmlhenry@home.com

Posted by denise carson (Member # 508) on :

thanks Ken... well said.

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"ever wonder what it'd be like to join the CIRCUS? just ask ME... i work in one."

Posted by Mike Duncan (Member # 316) on :

I have to agree with Cam (give em hell Cam!), maybe the people who need to be there the most are the ones howling the loudest. Get to the meet-learn some new techniques-charge more for your signs-go to more meets, etc. Banff was my first meet and I would have paid twice as much as I did to get the info and "Cam"eraderie that were available there.(apoligies to Cam for a bad pun). I really get tired of people gripping about the costs of everything-the same people gripe about the $50 for this site, and gripe that their customers are cheap and won't pay what a sign is worth-learn some new skills at a meet so you can make better signs and charge more. I better get out of here before I go on a full-fledged RANT!!!
Good luck to Mike and crew and I'll see ya in Mazeepa!!

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Mike Duncan
2315 H Street
Bellingham, WA 98225
eves 360-738-9846
days 360-671-7165
mduncan@telcomplus.net
$$ Supporter, 1998 &1999

[This message has been edited by Mike Duncan (edited May 16, 1999).]

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

Remember folks you don't HAVE to go to one of these meets" or for that matter give anything to
this site except the time it takes you to type in your question. If you desire information or are in
need of help then call a sign painter in your area. After all IF they are a TRUE Letterhead they
will be glad to help you out" I know I would. How about you all ?. The post question was ask
with out malice and in good faith, on a subject that concerns anyone who has a life. I think for the
most part some very good information has become of it, I hope we are not going to trash another
letterhead for a Question. After all" would you be so harsh at a live meet ?. We need not only to
share are abilities in the sign business but ALSO our kind and gentle way that allow us to be
artist.and express that mannerisumon this site. TBuk.

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Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :

I gotta agree with Cam! $170 for 4 days of learnin (let alone meetin more Letterheads) is a cheep education! If nothin else - cosirer it a vacation! NOT ONLY THAT - IT IS A TAX DEDUCTION!!!!
Just my 2 cents worth!

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Si Allen #562
La Mirada, CA. USA
(714) 521-4810
ICQ # 330407
"SignPainters do It with Longer Strokes!"

Brushasaurus on Chat

Posted by Dan Sawatzky (Member # 88) on :

Interesting topic...

You might note that the folks who think things are a bit expensive haven't hosted a meet. I suppose that the bells and whistles are the expensive part but they do make the meet memorable. I shudder to think of the costs in hosting an international meet. But I also know for a fact that the cost of the meet doesn't start to cover all the costs in hosting a meet.

I really enjoyed the meet just hosted by the Whans in Banff. Outstanding meet. Larry says he didn't lose money. HA!!!!!!!

I know they spent a year and a half putting it on. How much did that cost his shop? How about all the things they just sort of forgot to include in the total...

The folks who put on the seminars were forgiven the entrance fees, That is the project leaders. But they paid their own way down and hotel.
and to transport the stuff they used for their demonstrations.

We took a crew of 12 and three trucks and trailers. Add to that the hotel rooms and meals. I even paid the wages of the crew we took while we were there. We rented the video equipment we used to make our presentation.

I don't know exactly what it cost us (and I don't want to) but I know it was in the thousands.

It was worth every penny and more.

Pick the meets you can afford. Decide if you want to attend a local (inexpensive meet)
or a National with all the bells and whistles.

better yet Host one yourself. The size you like. Then you can attend for free and you don't have to travel either.

Above all keep havin fun!

-dan

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Dan Sawatzky
Sawatzky's Imagination Corporation
Chemainus, British Columbia
imagine2@netcom.ca

"Don't ya love what ya do for a livin!"

Posted by Mike Lavallee (Member # 320) on :

Ok, here's another way of thinking about how CHEAP these meets really are:

3 meals a day eating out in a restaurant average meal somewhere between $5-$10 dollars unless you live at Taco Bell and eat only 59cent meals. total for 4 days in the neighborhood of............... $120.00 per person

Now if you ever went to one of the air storms (the airbrush equivelent of a letterheads meet) each seminar that you get basically for free at a meet like Mazeppa......$ 250- $500 per person!PLUS>>>the original cost of admission to the meet!!!! you choose to join in on whatever seminar you want to attend. just check out any air brush action magazine for prices.

All these professionals are giving you a personal education that they could charge BIG money for on their own to teach you the same thing you're getting for FREE, come on now people think about what your complaining about here..... AW man its gonna cost me $170.00 to go to the biggest meet in the country and learn things from all the people I've read about in the magazines, have a party, eat for 4 whole days, get doorprizes,
share ideas with new friends...... it would cost you that to stay at a moderate hotel for just a couple of days to watch HBO on the tube! hell its worth the price of admission to meet Bob Parsons! hell you may be imortallized (spelling???) in one of his future cartoons! now that I think about it. this topic may be just a good idea for one. also to meet all the guys from over seas would be too cool also. you won't run into them at the local BBQ bash. anyway, thats all I have to say obout it. Just trowin' out some thoughts to ya. Mike

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life moves pretty darn fast, if you dont take time to look at it you could miss it!

[This message has been edited by Mike Lavallee (edited May 16, 1999).]

Posted by Steve King (Member # 771) on :

I have absolutely no problem with the price of the Muster. My concern, as is others, is the cost to get to the event. I would love to go, and am still considering it, but it's going to cost a fair coin to travel from Calgary to Mazeppa.

Steve

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Taylor Signs Ltd.
Calgary, Alberta
Est. 1900 ~ 99 Years and counting

Posted by jumpin on :

Every thing said here is true...here's another truth. The meet in Cork is 40.quid
and the wife or partner is free and it includes a one day tour of west Cork.

I,m not complaining ,just comparing...(oranges to apples probably)

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Monte Jumper/SIGNLanguage Norman Oklahoma

Posted by Terry Teague (Member # 796) on :

I just wonder how much of our entry fee goes into buying products for the beer garden?
How does one calculate how much a letterhead can drink?

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Terry Teague
James River Signs
Reeds Spring, MO
tlteague@tri-lakes.net

Posted by denise carson (Member # 508) on :

geez Terry......where did that come from?. have we offended you? sorry you feel you have to say things like that..........
denise

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"ever wonder what it'd be like to join the CIRCUS? just ask ME... i work in one."

Posted by Mark Fair Signs (Member # 289) on :

I think in no way this is a selfish endeavor
on the part of all those great letterheads in minnesota.
imagine having 700 or more participants in an event like this.

there are great cost involved.
the fee doesn't bother me at all.

my problem will be scheduling the work i will have at that time of year, and swing the travel cost to go.(if i go i am gonna fly, no driving for me, i would be a zombie)

i have been toying with the idea and have not totally given up.

after conversing with mike myer(not to be confused with Austin Powers) via e-mail and seeing all the great posts about who will be there,
you'd be a damned fool to not want to be there!

anyway, if my old studebaker will make it I'll be there.

(did someone make a stinky?)

yes terry, in answer to your first question,
you are cheap

just kidding, i could'nt help myself, once again the guy from montgomery has made a stinky.

come on guys, donate plane fare and i will come! HeeHee

mark

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Mark Fair
Mark Fair Signs
www.markfair.com
2162 Mt. Meigs Road
Montgomery, Alabama 36107
334-262-4449
"I Love My Job"
"A Proud Contributor to The Letterheads Site!"

[This message has been edited by Mark Fair Signs (edited May 17, 1999).]

Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :

I, in no way, think that anyone is making a profit on the "biggie" meets. The $170 entry fee is probably right in line with the food and events that are being offered and , heck, if it was only the $170 I'd be there in a minute. ( AND if I thought there was free beer, I'd be there in a second!!!

But I wouldn't expect that there would be.

!!)

I am just kinda like Mark...the travelling/accomodation expenses are the killer. Shirl and I are not at the age in our lives where we enjoy "camping out", even in a school gymnasium and from the sounds of things the closest motels are gonna be quite a distance away.

And, of course, we have to have the funds in place for next winter's month long adventure before considering any other form of "play" money spending.

BUT...I am still workin my butt off to earn the money to go and if all goes well I am gonna need another tax write-off again this year. Besides...how can I go without an annual visit with such luminaries as Samm, Peking, Spyke, Steve & Barb and yes..even the infamous Lazy Edna!

Posted by Mark Fair Signs (Member # 289) on :

MAZEPPA OR BUST!

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Mark Fair
Mark Fair Signs
www.markfair.com
2162 Mt. Meigs Road
Montgomery, Alabama 36107
334-262-4449
"I Love My Job"
"A Proud Contributor to The Letterheads Site!"

Posted by Mark Matyjakowski (Member # 294) on :

Man I wish I could go... (maybe if I hit the lottery) It's not the cost of admision it's the cost to get there and being away from the kids for a week. 175 is cheap! I realy wanted to go to the show in Ohio in June (personal schedule conflicts)... for that the aprox. price is 90 bucks per. seminar = 90 bucks per every couple hours (ka-ching) then ya realize how cheap 175 per 96 hours is.
Imagine that the first meet I ever attended (hell, first one I ever heard of)was less than a mile from my house (Mike's pinhead #7)
I didn't even think twice about the 125 and had not a clue as to what went on at these things. Best money I ever spent... real eye opener for me.
Who knows maybe by Aug. I'll have my garage/sideline shop cranking enough to make the milage... for only 175 how can you go wrong... Thats almost what there charging for woodstock 99 tickets... bet the meet will be better... if ya get mud to slide in

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Compulsive & Neurotic by day http://www.pierrepont.com
Anti-Social & Paranoid after 4:30 slamgrafyx.cjb.net
but Basically Happy in Rochester, NY

Posted by TBUK (Member # 443) on :

Denise", Terry brings to the table a very good point, of which will most likely have to be address in future meets with a blanket cover charge. After all if a person drinks only water, why should he have to pay for a drunken party".. Now don't go throwing stones and verbul Jeee'zzzz at me. If I go, you will need to charge a lot more then 175.00 Hell thats one weekend in the desert, without food". TBuk

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Posted by Terry Teague (Member # 796) on :

Denise;
My intention is not to offend you or anybody. I apologize if I have done so. Sometimes a sense of humor doesn't travel well by keyboard. This is a pertinent question although-are we as a group paying for the beer garden? I thought we were starting to lose the stigma of all sign people drinking.
I have a lot of respect and admiration for you guys,it takes an incredible amount of work to organize a meet this size and I know you want to do your best to make it memorable.
My thoughts were not meant to dis anybody, I just want to raise questions that have merit for discussion.

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Terry Teague
James River Signs
Reeds Spring, MO
tlteague@tri-lakes.net

Posted by Cam Bortz (Member # 55) on :

Since as you say, this is a valid point of discussion, let's discuss it. "Are we, as a group, paying for the beer garden?"

I don't recall seeing anything on the information site that said "free beer". My impression is that Mike is turning the upstairs room of his shop into a "pub room" where those who choose to do so can relax and have a few. Given the expenses involved in other aspects of the meet, even if we were, as a group, paying for this, I couldn't see it as a big part of the expense.

I don't do striping - are we, as a group, paying to set up an area for stripers to work? How do we compartmentalize this sort of thing? Or should we have a "free" admission and be charged for each seminar or venue of the meet? I bet that would work out to more than $170 per head.

In your initial post you said you had run your meet for $25 a person, and said "I lost money...only because I was off about 15 people in estimating attendence". Now imagine having the potential to be off by SEVERAL HUNDRED...

Comparing meets is like comparing sign designs, you get into an apples-to-oranges thing. Bloomington was $110 for three days, or $36.60 per day. Mazeppa is four days for $170, or $42.50 per. Given the additional events planned, the extra $5.90 doesn't sound outrageous.

As far as travel expenses are concerned, how is this Mike's fault? Again, this is a value judgement. Either it is worth your while to go, or it is not. I'm also told that there is transportation provided for the host hotel to the site - oh, are we paying for that as a group, too? And as far as I know, there are folks in Mazeppa acting as "host families" as was the case in Belvidere; given that Mazeppa doen't have motels, it sounds like a lot more thought - and money - is going into accomodation arrangements than into a beer garden.

So how much money does Meyer have to lose on this thing to make everybody happy, anyway?

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"A wise man concerns himself with the truth, not with what people believe." - Aristotle

Every day is a good day. Some days are better than others.

Cam
Finest Kind Signs
256 S. Broad St.
Pawcatuck, Ct. 06379
"Award winning Signs since 1988"

Posted by Mark Fair Signs (Member # 289) on :

well spoken cam!

mark

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Mark Fair
Mark Fair Signs
www.markfair.com
2162 Mt. Meigs Road
Montgomery, Alabama 36107
334-262-4449
"I Love My Job"
"A Proud Contributor to The Letterheads Site!"

Posted by Terry Teague (Member # 796) on :

Well said everybody!
This has been a great topic for dicussion,but now for the really important question.
Just how big are the misquitos in Minnisota?

Is it really true that you can use them to open your paint cans?

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Terry Teague
James River Signs
Reeds Spring, MO
tlteague@tri-lakes.net

Posted by Mike Lavallee (Member # 320) on :

OK I think that should about wrap this topic up! haha good thread everybody!!

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life moves pretty darn fast, if you dont take time to look at it you could miss it!

Posted by mike meyer (Member # 542) on :

Come, Share, Laugh, Paint. Sincerly, Mike Meyer

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Posted by LazyEdna (Member # 266) on :

DANG! What a really great post! I just couldn't let it go by w/o putting in my 2¢...
But... everyone has already said everything and very well, too... gawd I love this place, and I love letterhead meets and I don't mind havin' a brew or two with my letterhead pals.
I don't wanna give the impression that my life is dull, but.... Letterhead meets are the hi-lite of my year. There are quite a few SUPREME letterheads that don't do this computer thing but do show up to the meets and I LOVE seein' 'em... they may be supreme, but they are still down-to-earth sign lovers.
I wouldn't miss Mazeppa.. and I wouldn't have missed Mike's meet for ANYTHING .. except Van Gogh <--the hi-light of my LIFE.
When I think back to the *glory daze* of my youth, I think a Letterhead meet is the closest thing to Woodstock we're gonna get!

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LazyEdna
in RL known as Sara Straw
from southern Utah
Red Rock Heaven

Posted by Don Hulsey (Member # 128) on :

Well, I juswt found this post, and had to add my 2 cents also (that's 4 now, maybe we could finance the meet this way heh heh)

Cam was right early on. Those of us that can't afford it are the ones that can't afford to miss it. That is why I have already started my Mazeppa Savings(trying to MUSTER up enough money to go).

By the way, I don't drink, but would be happy to buy a beer for anyone that teaches me anything that will help me make more money in the future. So if we are paying for the beer garden, look at all the money I will save by not having to buy them individually. heh heh

I am really hoping to be there, and I hope I get to meet everyone of you while I'm there. Hell, I might even buy you a beer heh heh

Don

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Don Hulsey
Strokes by DON signs
Utica, KY
sbdsigns@aol.com

Posted by Roy Frisby (Member # 736) on :

Heck, I gave a free one last year and only one person came! Maybe I smell bad or something? What the ??????

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