The Letterville BullBoard: Tips & Tricks ---Just keep 'em coming!

This is topic Tips & Tricks ---Just keep 'em coming! in forum Tips & Tricks at The Letterville BullBoard.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
http://www.letterville.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/10/9.html

Posted by Dave Draper (Member # 102) on :

Hi Heads,
If there is enough interest in this thread, then let's keep one post open every week for Tips & Tricks.

Whenever the thred reaches about 20 responses and starts to load slow, then sombody can start a new thread.

Our Fearless leader, Steve Shortreed, mentioned creating a permanent spot for these Tips & Tricks on the main Letterhead web site. This continual thread topic will give him plenty of good stuff to work with.

With the variety of tips on every sign related subject, he might actually have to break things up into catagories. ( glad its not me doing this )

If you would like the Tips & Tricks thread to continue, then all you have to do is post under this post. When it reaches 20 responses, we'll start another. On the other hand if it just dies, then so be it, and we can have another special week of Tips & Tricks in July.

------------------
Go Get 'Em..... :)
AKA Raptorman on #Letterheads mIRC Chat
Draper The Signmaker
Bloomington Illinois USA

Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :

I saw this on a video somewhere I believe...A rivit brush is useful for not only burnishing vinyl down around a rivit but is also quite handy for forcing vinyl onto irregular surfaces such as coroplast or a corrugated van side.

------------------
Dave Grundy #340
AKA applicator on mIRC
"stickin' sticky stuff to valuable vessels and vehicles!"
in Granton, Ontario, Canada
dave.grundy@odyssey.on.ca

Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :

Hi folks. Well, it was on another post, but since someone suggested that it should be included here as well here goes. If you encounter difficulty lettering or adhering vinyl to a hard hat, or any other moulded plastic article, try flame treating the article first. Simply flame the area lightly with a blowtorch to remove the mould releasing agent that clings to the finished item. Please note that the operative word is "Lightly" After doing so, you can usually successfully adhere the vinyl, or letter the item as required.

------------------
Ken Henry
Henry & Henry Signs
London, Ontario Canada
(519) 439-1881
e-mail kjmlhenry@home.com

Posted by George Perkins (Member # 156) on :

Here is one to go along with Monte's method of finding the center of a pattern. Like the folding method it's so simple it ought to be obvious, but I have worked around so many folks that end up doing a whole lot more math than needed. To find the center of a panel thats larger than a yardstick, place the yardstick flush with the left edge of the panel, mark the right edge (x) slide the yardstck so it is flush with the right side, look at the figure below the mark, divide in half ( easily done in your head ), the result is the center of the panel. This method will work on large panels or walls, just keep up with the number of yardstick marks on each side ( I number em ) you'll end up with either an overlap or underlap? that is easily worked out in your head. No adding, converting or dividing large numbers.
Guess what my least favorite subject was in school

[ October 02, 2001: Message edited by: Steve Shortreed ]

Posted by Dave Draper (Member # 102) on :

Hi Heads,

Since George Perkins is talking math, here is a previous post of mine on finding a center point ( not on vinyl) but on ANYTHING.

My father-in-law is a welder/pipe fitter and this is sort of a mandatory skill in that trade for finding center points on iron and pipe lengths.

The first part is to understand that 1/2 of any fraction means to DOUBLE the bottom number.

1/2 of 3/8 = 3/16 notice how the bottom number doubles? Top number stays put!
5/8 would become 5/16 if divided by 2
1/16 would become 1/ 32 if divided by 2
Same is true true with any fraction.

Learning that is the first part.

Now lets say you go to a job site and put vinyl lettering on a door.

The door is 36 and 5/8 wide
Center point of the door is 18 and 5/16
Since the 36 is an EVEN number this is pretty easy to figure in your head and the 5/8 to 5/16 conversion is simple now you know how fractions work.

But what if the door is 37 and 5/8?
This gets a little difficult...so here is the
the trick to figuring it out in your head real simple and quick:

Take the ODD number 37 and subtract 1
Add the 1 into the fraction the simple way as
5/8 becomes 5+8 or 13/8
Now double the bottom number so 13/8 becomes 13/16

The answer to the center point of 37 and 5/8 = 18 and 13/16

This is the way tradesmen have broken down numbers and fractions for years. Seldom taught in school, you just have to learn it on the job. In school you got to know WHY and HOW and STUFF....on a job site your crew foreman wants accurate results fast! The School way is too darn slow!

------------------
Go Get 'Em..... :)
AKA Raptorman on #Letterheads mIRC Chat
Draper The Signmaker
Bloomington Illinois USA

Posted by Neil Riley (Member # 383) on :

I have about 15 different widths of app paper
stacked across a shelf just above my weeding table.
The tip here is to write the sizes of each one onto 4 bits of white vinyl, then stick 2
labels inside each end of the cores.
Then it's easy to just measure the height of the graphic, and grab the right size roll for the job!

------------------
Neil Riley
Riley Signs
Adelaide,
South Ozzz

Posted by Suelynn Sedor (Member # 442) on :

This tip saves me alot of time when applying vinyl.

After you mask your vinyl, draw a straight line right across your premask. If the item you are applying is a few lines of copy, I usually draw the line directly under the bottom line of copy. Then when you are applying the vinyl, you only have to line up the line you have drawn, and not keep re-measuring.

For example, if you are applying two graphics at a 45 degree angle, lay your graphics beside each other at the correct angle and then draw a horizontal line across the bottom. Now draw your horizontal line on the vehicle or other substrate. Now you simply place the line you drew on the premask, directly on the line you drew on the vehicle, and everything will already be lined up.
If you are installing a round graphic, draw your lines straight through the middle of the
circle; see what I mean?

Not sure if I explained this right, but it sure saves me alot of time measuring and re-measuring at installation time.

Suelynn from Saskatchewan
Linnie on chat

------------------
"It is never too late to be what you might have been." -George Eliot

Suelynn Sedor
Sedor Signs
Carnduff, Sk Canada

Posted by jimmy chatham (Member # 525) on :

to line up letters on glass take a level and mark a line on the oppposite side of the glass with a stabilo pencil, find center and make a vertical line with level. make center line to edge of paper and horizontal line to edge of paper then just line up the lines
after installation you can remove the lines easy.
jimmy

------------------
Jimmy Chatham
Chatham Signs
164 Poplar Rd.
Commerce, Ga 30529
706-335-2348
Fax 706-335-3378
icq#11718273

Posted by jumpin on :

I liked Dave grundys fraction conversions and have used them, but this trick is to simple to pass up...

An old sign painter showed me this one about the first day I was on the job as an apprentice...

If a door is (for instance let's say 30 7/8" wide) how do you find the center with out doing the math?

Hold a yard stick to the door at an angle with each end touching the sides of the door jam.the center is at 18" no matter what the diminsion actually is.

You don't even have to know or care what the diminsion of a panel window or door is,if you just measure it diagonally to a common even number (doesn't matter what it is.)and simply divide it in half.

------------------
Monte Jumper/SIGNLanguage Norman Oklahoma

Posted by Graham Hodge (Member # 168) on :

Enough of maths, my head is spinning

Magnetic Straight Edge
Very useful, I buy lengths of aluminium (or aloominum as you say in the US)say, 1 or 2 inch wide by 3 or 4 feet, I keep several sizes, then adhere strips of magnetic rubber to the back (I have some magnetic rubber with adhesive backing on it). This is great for lining trucks, cars or any metal surface, the straight edge stays put!
The rubber also protects the vehicle from scratching with the metal edge.

Metal work surface.
I lay a sheet of thin metal (we use Colorbond) over our workbench and when cutting lengths of vinyl I use the magnetic straight edge over the metal work surface, holds everything nice, like having a second pair of hands.

Reflective Lettering
Is a nightmare to remove, try cutting the letters in cast vinyl first, apply then overlay with reflective. Sure, double the work, but if you are the mug who will have to remove it later, you'll be glad.

------------------
Gray Hodge camriver@southcom.com.au
Cam River Signs
Somerset, Tasmania,
Down Under

Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :

If you're silk screening large pieces, and using a large screen, you can counter-balance this perfectly using this method. Install 2 clothesline pulleys securely,to the ceiling, directly in-line with each other. One should be directly above the elevating edge of your screen.The other pully can be located so that it won't interfere with your screening, or other operations. Pull a rope through both pulleys, and attach one to the elevating edge of your screen. Drop the other end of the rope, and tie an empty pail to it. Fill this pail with water, until it exactly counter-balances your screen as you elevate it.More water can be added to compensate for the weight of the ink, or a cupful removed as the ink is depleted.Using this method, you can raise and lower your screen with only one finger. You'll be surprised how easy this makes the job go.

------------------
Ken Henry
Henry & Henry Signs
London, Ontario Canada
(519) 439-1881
e-mail kjmlhenry@home.com

Posted by Bernice Tornquist (Member # 16) on :

When applying vinyl to plexiglass, remove the paper cover the day before you use it and clean it with isopropal alcohol and water. Let it air out overnight as there is an outgassing from the plexi that will cause bubbles to form under the vinyl. This helps, somewhat.

------------------
Bernice Tornquist
Bernice's Signs & Graphics
Choiceland, SK Canada
tornquist@sk.sympatico.ca

Posted by Creative Images (Member # 81) on :

Here's a little trick that wuz passed on to me from the shop of Mark Fair Signs;

Take an ol' core from one of those $ive, rolls of vinyl, to use as an applacator on your vinyl. It works great and is one of the best applacators on the market. You'll never need to buy another applacator again, and it does'nt cost ya' any money, cause ya' wuz just gonna throw it away. I'm known as ol' Fred Sanford around these parts, cause I don't throw nutin' away.

Bamaboy

------------------
Robert Fair(Bamaboy)
Creative Images Studios
Fayette, Al. USA
"Stay Fresh, Be Creative."

Posted by Darryl Gomes (Member # 98) on :

If you have problems with your gold leaf sticking to the background, mix an egg white in a pint of water, strain and brush on the sign before painting in the size. If you get any excess leaf stuck to the background, it will wash right off with water and a little gentle rubbing. (rinse the sign off anyway to get the egg off) Gold size is amazing and will stick right through the egg white!!

------------------
Darryl Gomes...aka Lakeside
Kincardine Ontario Canada
www.primeline.net/lakeside

Posted by Brad Ferguson (Member # 33) on :

When installing plastic faces, sometimes it's hard to get the plastic to go in the retainer at the very end. You can reach around from behind on a double sided cabinet to help the first face in, of course. But for the second face, I used to have to do a lot of shaking and wiggling (of the plastic).
In desperation I tried sticking duct tape to the face in such a way that it could be used as a handle to pull on. It worked great. The next step was suction cups, the big kind. No more wiggles.

Brad in Arkansas

------------------
signbrad@cswnet.com

Posted by nitro (Member # 547) on :

My version on how to keep frosted vinyl (the etched glass look) graphics straight. Before you plot it you can should make sure that you have a weed border. My program sets up my weed border at .25 inch. Weed the graphic leaving the weed border there. Mask the graphic with whichever tape you use. Flip it over and take a pen and use the now raised weed border to draw a straight line (the weed border should act like a guide for this line). Next take a pair of Scissors and cut along the Line that you drew. Use the hinge method, and voila. Hope this helps somebody! I know it helps me.

chris

------------------
All-ways Signs
Chris Crisafulli
90 NW Carolina Ave.
W. Melbourne, FL 32904

[This message has been edited by nitro (edited April 30, 1999).]

Posted by Donna in BC (Member # 130) on :

Do you ever trim decals after premasking, only to have the ruler slip on you cutting into the decal by mistake?

This is so easy it hurts. On your straight edge, have a piece of masking tape attached to both ends. Position your ruler where you want it to sit, tagging down the tape. No more slipping.

Need to cut longer than your one ruler? Place another right beside it and tape it in place as well. One nice long cut.

(my rulers have cork backing and still slip when you don't want them to; nothing like a tape backup system )

------------------
Donna with Graphic Impact, BC Canada
proud $ supporter of this site
gisigns@sprint.ca

[This message has been edited by Donna in BC (edited May 01, 1999).]

Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :

Just an addition to Donna's idea. I saw the "Big Yellow" rulers in the States one time. They come in several lengths, from 1 foot up to 6 or 8 feet if I remember correctly. They are also a couple of inches overlength in each size. They have a raised edge to keep your fingers away from knife blades and have a non skit material on the under side to prevent slipping.

Anyway, I haven't seen these in Canada but I do have a raised edge 4 foot ruler that I use for cutting straight lines. I went to Home hardware and bought a pack of those little round self adhesive foam buttons that are stuck on the inside of cupboard doors to stop them from banging when closed. I just stuck a whole row of them on the under side of my ruler and it slips no more.

By the way if anyone knows of a Canadian supplier of "Big Yellow" rulers please let me know.

This part is an addition to the above. After doing an exhaustive search I found out that the company that manufactures the "Big Yellow ruler" is, in fact, headquartered in Canada only about 100 miles from me! Small world, and why do I always think all the neat products originate in the States???

------------------
Dave Grundy shop#340
"A PROUD $ supporter of the website"
AKA applicator on mIRC
"stickin' sticky stuff to valuable vessels and vehicles!"
in Granton, Ontario, Canada
dave.grundy@odyssey.on.ca

[This message has been edited by Dave Grundy (edited May 01, 1999).]

Posted by Dave Draper (Member # 102) on :

Speaking of rulers and straight edges,

Then nex time you cut up a sheet of MDO or other sheet substrate, save a section of a long straight piece with the adjacent edge.

This way you can make your own right angle square, 8 feet long if you wish ( or more )

Not only will it make a nice straight edge, it will come in handy to clamp to another piece of MDO to use as a saw fence (circular say or jig saw, or even a router) as the saw foot will ride along the edge of the "fence" to make a nice straight cut.

Also, scrap 1/8 inch celtec (pvc subtrate also called komatex, trovicel, versicel,)can be cut with a snap blade knife in small stips to make PAINT STIR STICKS.

We cut up a bunch of different sizes for gallons, quarts and pints.

Also use your scrap substraight materials to make samples you can give to your customers to show them what their sign can be made on.

When attending a Sign Show, grab all the "free" samples of substraights you can, then once back in the shop, glue all these pieces down to a big board. Customers coming into your shop will see every substraight their sign can be made from. Our Sample board is 18" x 24" and is not big enough. A 2 foot by 3 foot is probably the best size for a substrate sample board. Ours is made of coroplast, but the next one will be on celtec as it just looks nicer.

------------------
Go Get 'Em..... :)
AKA Raptorman on #Letterheads mIRC Chat
Draper The Signmaker
Bloomington Illinois USA

Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :

If you're going to be lettering outside in a windy location, and you've ever had your pattern torn by the wind, you'll like this trick. For such occasions, use tyvek to make your pattern, and your problems of torn patterns are over. This material will not rip, and for the few extra cents involved, you can save frustration, and a whole lot of time.

------------------
Ken Henry
Henry & Henry Signs
London, Ontario Canada
(519) 439-1881
e-mail kjmlhenry@home.com

Posted by Darryl Gomes (Member # 98) on :

Dave, you can get those straight-edges from Pete & Marg @ Canadian Signcrafters..(1-800-663-9753 they are Website Advertisers!!) They are made of aluminum with a steel cutting edge, they also have a non-skid strip on the bottom and curve up to protect your fingers from the inevitable slips that are always made when cutting

------------------
Darryl Gomes...aka Lakeside
Kincardine Ontario Canada
www.primeline.net/lakeside

[This message has been edited by Darryl Gomes (edited May 01, 1999).]

Posted by Mike O'Neill (Member # 470) on :

Speaking of rulers,

I bought a couple from an Art Supply store in Quebec City 2 years ago, they're designed for people who do mounting and matting, They're aluminum with a hardened steel roll on one edge (knife Guide), have 2 rubber strips absolutely non slip, and they have slots into which a knife holder (option) fits, the holder will hold blade at precisely 45,60 or 90° angles. They weren't cheap ~$85cdn for 24" ~$135cdn for 48" but have proved their worth.

Manufactured in France by a company called MAPED

------------------
Mike O'Neill - - Supporting Member - -
TransLabrador Signs
Labrador City, Labrador

'Durn vinyl won't stick to ice'

moneill@cancom.net

Posted by Brad Ferguson (Member # 33) on :

When sandblasting HDU, don't exceed the manufacturer's recommended air pressure. At higher pressures sometimes a chunk will blow out unexpectedly. It doesn't always happen, but it happens without warning.
My experience with this is limited to Precision Board.

Brad in Arkansas

------------------
signbrad@cswnet.com

UBB.classic™ 6.7.2