I got into the sign businnes not only to make a living, but it is a way I can utilize my artistic talents and mechanical abilities. I never expected to get rich, just pay the bills and save a bit. Being that I am a one person shop, I realize I can only make so much per week. Fine by me. Yep my sign business may not be a Forture 500 company, but it's served me well all of these years.
Posted by John Arnott (Member # 215) on :
I agree with every word you said.........me too Now it's only the jobs I WANT to do!
Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :
I was drafted. I was only suppose to help out for a couple weeks while on vacation. It turned into 26 years.
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
For the money and only for the money !!..........at that time ( 1968 ).
I can't complain, though........Have had a great ride, since then.
RD
[ August 26, 2013, 04:27 PM: Message edited by: Ricardo Davila ]
Posted by Roy Frisby (Member # 736) on :
Three kids at home yelling. "I'm hungry!" Now, 43 years later, I would not have done anything differently. It's the life I chose and I have no regrets.
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
Was working in the early 70's on a steel crew about 90' up and my partner in crime told me I could make alot more money if I could paint pictures and climb too! Seems the local billboard company needed a new painter because their last one had fell and quit,...besides it seemed a lot safer to only have to work on 4 or 5 story high structures rather than 10+ for more pay,...what the hell,..I was young dumb and had just got out of art school and needed to keep up the payments on my Harley,....
edited to add,...spent 30+ years painting walls, billboards, major motorsports and athletic arena's across the south and often wonder why I never got hurt bad working on a scaffolds so high up or in dangers way,....must of been the adrenalin,...just the same it kept me excited and feeling alive,....
[ August 26, 2013, 06:14 PM: Message edited by: Tim Barrow ]
Posted by DianeBalch (Member # 1301) on :
Ernie, my husband , has so many interests. He started it to have a backup job, so that if he got laid off he would have some other type of work. I am not artistic, but I do like to be crafty and make things. I thought the business would last 1 year. 2013. Is year 20. Lettervile and letterhead meets have been a great thing!
Diane
Posted by Craig Sjoquist (Member # 4684) on :
Trying dozens of trades along the way wrote a list of likes & dislikes & what worked for me, so sitting in architecture school ( a life long dream & pursuit since 5th grade ) said what am I dong here I don't want to be stuck inside. Raced to to sign up for sign school, before the year was out, made up my mind & this was something could enjoy till I pass on.
Posted by Preston McCall (Member # 351) on :
I was the manager of a Chevy, Olds, Cadillac, VW & Audi group. Couldn't find anyone to paint our windows like I had seen in LA. I came into work one day in jeans and lit up the place. 108% increase in traffic in 30 days. Simultaneously, the owner was jerking me around on a big bonus. I quit after doing our windows four times. He got so mad, he called my mother who just laughed at him. Went to California to really see and study the windows. Met some folks and came back to splash my way onto 24 years of window painting.
It pays for my other adventures like the gallery I am still trying to pull off in Santa Fe, NM. I was there last week and am about to pull off the whole transition. Got to move a few mountains, but will end up there soon.
I had three rules when I began: No stress, lots of fun and make money. It has been exactly that. Never bought a vinyl cutter and still work out of my truck. I has been a fun pursuit and I have learned a thing or two from the experience and from coming here to hear all of my friends at Letterville tell their stories. Now it is time to go get real serious about a gallery and my fine art.
Posted by Len Mort (Member # 7030) on :
Looked great, sit on a olde Coke crate, put letters on truck doors, get cash! Boy, I did'nt know any better! Over 55 years later, would have never strayed from the trade! Great ride!
Posted by Rusty Bradley (Member # 6938) on :
I got into the the business for moral, ethical, and altruistic reasons...I wanted to save the world from crap.
Posted by Rusty Bradley (Member # 6938) on :
I got into the the business for moral, ethical, and altruistic reasons...I wanted to save the world from crap.
Posted by Rusty Bradley (Member # 6938) on :
I got into the the business for moral, ethical, and altruistic reasons...I wanted to save the world from crap.
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
Rusty needs a release mouse!
Posted by Shirley Carron (Member # 2446) on :
Ya Rusty...we heard you twice the first time. I was working at a print shop in Oakville, ON and one of our clients (Tim Horton's) was having an open house at head office. They needed a few signs made up and "can't" wasn't part of my vocabulary. I headed down the street to see Mike at Morningsign and set me on the path of becoming a signmaker. I did a lot of banners back then for friends who played in a band and tried my hand at lettering an illuminated face for a comic book store. (Chuck Churchill should remember that one), but now we're going back 25 years??? Can't think of anything I'd rather being doing....
[ August 27, 2013, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: Shirley Carron ]
Posted by Rusty Bradley (Member # 6938) on :
triple post!...WHAT THE CRAP?
Posted by Jeff Ogden (Member # 3184) on :
Alicia...I got into it to get out of the house for awhile and experience the true meaning of working like a dog, coming home covered in paint, and ruining all my clothes. I don't see how it could ever have gone down differently....wouldn't want to have done anything else. I sure can say I have met alot of people and that to me is precious. Aside from the hassles of the work itself at times, it's the enjoyment of interacting with others that really cranks my tractor.
Posted by Dave Grundy (Member # 103) on :
This question has been asked and answered many times in the past...BUT..
After 25 years of doing body work/painting vehicles, which also involved highway trucks, the local "sign guy" retired. One particular trucker encouraged me to think about adding truck lettering to my services.
I did...and soon learned that I could make MUCH more profit doing the lettering than doing the bodywork/painting.
I knew nothing about design nor realistic pricing.
Then I discovered Letterville and learned a lot...THEN we took a road trip down to Florida and met many folks.....
One was Bob Stephens...our short time with him opened my eyes!!!! He showed examples of good design, and more importantly, to me....good pricing.
Anyone who has not read Bob's article on pricing needs to.
Still enjoying the retirement!!!!!!! Posted by Ian Stewart-Koster (Member # 3500) on :
It was a dream...
and
I think it still is! Posted by Bill Modzel (Member # 22) on :
I had one foot in biology and the other in art in college. Along with oil painting and life drawing I took a printmaking class one semester and got hooked on screen printing. Very primitive, no photographic stencils, all hand filled. I loved it, the solid chunks of color the techniques for textures.
Looking for a job about the same time I saw one for a screen printing shop. I was totally amazed that it was more than an art form. Yea, I was that green. I worked there for 6 years doing mostly decal work. At one tie we printed 2,25 MILLION bumper stickers for the Air Force Aim High campaign.
In 1980 my employer went family and govt contract only and laid me off with the promise of sending the local jobs my way. An experienced friend and myself threw in a grand each and started up Mod-Zel Screen Printing with an agreement that we wouldn't do any apparel. A decision that we never regretted. It set us apart from all small shirt shops in town and we landed allot of sub contract work for the sign shops and ad agencies.
Here I am, 32 years later and I just signed a contract to sell my shop to a LARGE digital print company and be their local in-house sign shop. At 62 is seems like a wonderful path to retirement just dropped in my lap.
Posted by Bill Lynch (Member # 3815) on :
I met the local signpainter/carver when I took some pottery lessons from him. His main trade was signs and he said "Forget the pots, learn how to paint signs and you'll always be able to make a living". I went to sign school at Butera School of Art soon after....but boy things have changed since then.
[ August 30, 2013, 07:43 PM: Message edited by: Bill Lynch ]
Posted by Kent Smith (Member # 251) on :
It's in the genes, 5th generation. I spun off to other careers twice but never really stopped making signs because it was the most reliable way to keep the family fed. After 58 years, I enjoy it more each day.
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
Adventure. When I saw one day was doing a truck, the next up on a wall, the next in a crowded mall, then a few days building stuff in the shop, then bank windows. The learning of how to switch hats and do it all was thrilling for me. I loved the camaraderie with the crew I was working with, the teasing and tricks played. Learning who my teachers were and discovering just which areas each had to teach me in and how to disregard the rest. All of life seems to be an adventure to me! Other than that, I was handed a tool on Haight Street in the mid sixties and told "this is a signpainters brush, learn how to use it"
Posted by Dale Feicke (Member # 767) on :
I got interested in hot rods, custom painting, and pinstriping, back in jr. high. Did a few of my buddies' cars, then. Lettered a few race cars. Went on to do mechanical/body work and restoration of antique/classic cars.
My brother went to art school, and decided to go into the sign business on graduation. I went in with him, and we made a good team....he did the artwork/layouts and illustrations;and I did the manual stuff ( building cabinets, welding,wiring, carpentry,etc.) I handled the boom/installation also.
25 years in business....we went our separate ways. I moved to Florida, and to Mississippi; and have stayed with the biz. He didn't, and is sorry about his decision today.
I've had a lot of jobs; but never one that offers me a neverending variety of different types of work and a really great reason to get my old bones out of bed everyday. If I had it to do all over again, I'd go right into the sign business, instead of wasting all those years I spent doing other things. Now, I'm talking about the business the way it was THEN. I don't know if I'd get into it, as it is today. I really love the "craft-y/build-it-with-your-hands" aspect of it.
[ August 31, 2013, 12:03 PM: Message edited by: Dale Feicke ]
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
Dale,
Quoting you:
"I don't know if I'd get into it, as it is today. I really love the "craft-y/build-it-with-your-hands" aspect of it."
This was the main reason for which I retired.....Otherwise, I would, still, be out there, today........Unfortunately, the new technology, the one which we are supposed to "embrace" ( yeah, right ), according to those who can't letter a sign with a brush, if their lives depended on it, has turned this amazing craft into a glorified printing business.
That is my opinion.
RD
Posted by John Lennig (Member # 2455) on :
Thru High School, thought I wanted to be a commercial artist, ended up in Sign Painting Class at SDCC at 18...This Sept. will be 50 years Behind the Brush, with some years riding the Computer...in 2000, back to Brush only...recently...The Brush has kept me sane and grinning, like The Pierre sez...Life is Good!
Posted by Dale Feicke (Member # 767) on :
And I value your opinion, Ricardo. Many of us spent years learning and perfecting a craft that is very rewarding in many ways.
Nowadays, anyone with a credit card or a checkbook can instantly be in the sign business.....and it shows.....with a neverending stream of poor designs, horrible color combinations, and faded, bleeding digital prints.
I try to leave that crap to others, in the area; and concentrate on a small group of quality-oriented long-time customers, who value my work. And I value their loyalty.
Posted by Alicia B. Jennings (Member # 1272) on :
And you are so right Mr. Davilla. I think that the general public is now getting very accustomed to perceiving a sign as something that is printed by a machine rather than being man made. On the other hand, I also think that in time it will change again. With the new technology of 3-D printing, I think that our advertising/signs will have to reflect the same type of technology. Dan Sawatzky has first class seats in that market right now. And of course the only thing that could ever stop "Our" progress would be pesky sign ordinances.
Posted by Glenn Taylor (Member # 162) on :
I agree, anyone with credit card can get into the sign business. The question is whether or not they can stay in it very long. There is more to signs than just the skill and equipment whether it is a French Master or Photoshop.
IMHO, if you are in it as your livelihood then having the best skills and the best tools don't mean much if you don't know how to manage the business end of things.
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
I do miss those days.... when you could drop any skilled sign painter on Main Street, in any town USA.....Without any money in his pockets and just a portfolio of his work ( or, maybe, some old and torn photos of his work ), a sign kit and a can of paint in his hands......You could count on it, by the end of the week, that sign painter was going to have money in his pocket, food in his stomach and a place to live....and every sign shop in town was going to know who he was.........Just like my old friend Keith used to say: "We were like gunslingers......trying to make a name for ourselves, in any town or sign shop we worked."
Nobody cared about "PROFIT" or the "BOTTOM LINE", then....We cared about being a good and fast sign painter.....Nothing else, because that was what was going to put money in our pockets, real quick....whether we worked for ourselves or in somebody's sign shop.
We just loved to paint signs, make new friends and make enough to eat, support our families and have fun while we were at it.
It seemed to work for me........for over 45 years.
RD
[ September 01, 2013, 11:08 PM: Message edited by: Ricardo Davila ]
Posted by Joey Madden (Member # 1192) on :
Where else could I have made 3 bucks a minute and work less than 10 hours a week?
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
Ricardo, thank you for describing my life experiences and values so well. I just haven't wanted to find a way out yet and find using the computer a regular exercise and seeing the quality degenerating. The satisfaction of making something with a brush, and a quick charcoal layout is never matched by something digital.
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
Rick,
Thanks........Here are a couple of forgotten things we did, then, that I, very seriously, doubt are being taught to the newbies, today.....
Rick, how about when we used to pull straight lines, on a sign panel, by just using a yard stick and a piece of charcoal?......or, maybe, when we did the layout of the copy on a sign, using only "chicken scratch" and, subsequently, letter that same sign with one or more alphabets.......using, only, those alphabets that we had stored in our personal file...OUR MEMORY !!
In those days, we were taught that a good sign painter had to learn, and memorize, at least, four or five alphabets.....to be able to survive in any sign shop that hired you......You had to have, in your arsenal of alphabets, at least, a good looking casual script, a casual speed alphabet, a good looking "block"( Egyptian ) alphabet, a nice "thick and thin" alphabet, a serif type alphabet and, of course, you had to know how to "do" a decent Old English..........I hate to say it, but, some of us ( under protest, of course ) had learned how to do a decent Helvetica.....just in case.
We, really, felt that we were able to walk into any sign shop and make a decent living with our, memorized, small arsenal of alphabets.....I did.
Sadly, I do not think that, today, the newbies are interested in memorizing alphabets.....Who wants to memorize when you can click and drag?
I must clarify, for the newbies that when I say "alphabets", I, really, mean "font"....I just did it on purpose.....Sorry about that.
RD
Posted by Ellen Moser (Member # 6687) on :
I was born an artist and never really realized it, was always just drawing and painting stuff for fun (altho I worked for an ad agency in the 70's for a couple of years). As my children grew, I did volunteer stuff like painting play scenery. At age 50 I had a divorce then got involved romantically with... a sign painter. Now he's out of my life but I am carrying on with a 1-woman shop, painting signs, airbrushing t-shirts, and decorating anything that walks in the door. I love my work and I love seeing my customers smile when they come to get what I created for them. I plan to do this till I die.
Posted by Bill Diaz (Member # 2549) on :
I went through a lengthy process of going to college to become a fine artist and teach painting and drawing in college. Along the way I experienced a failed marriage and the birth of my first son, so rather than wait forever to land a teaching job, I set out to work in whatever job I could get. Eventually I started a commercial painting and decorating business.
By happenstance the one and only local sign painter in our small town decided to finish his career painting signs in Arizona where he planned to retire and left the town and many customers with nobody to paint their signs. People came to me because they knew I had studied art; therefore, I must know how to paint signs ... WRONG!!!!
I didn't know squat, but I figured it might get me back into artistic related work which just had to be better than gobbling down dry-fog industrial paint
To help me along with it all was a the guy that sign painter sold his house and shop to in exchange for cash and the motor home the painter used to move to Arizona. When I asked about renting the shop he told me that if I lettered his school buses he'd make it worth my while.
All this time Jane's brother had been lettering his and his friend's race cars and knew about 1 Shot and lettering quills ... so I figured how hard could it be. Man was I wrong. I didn't think I'd ever get it, but if you've got school bus after school bus and all the other stuff just waitin' for you -- you figure it out. Eventually I was able to draw on my education to help me with composition, design and color and offer my customers a professional quality product.
35 years later I'm still at it and and have got my wife and younger sons with me and who knows maybe we'll start a dynasty so that 5 generations (like with Kent) an individual I don't know will be working in all that we started -- BY just being in the right place at the right time and having some luck.
Posted by Kent Smith (Member # 251) on :
After Ricardo's post, I must say I use those techniques regularly, pulled some lines with scratch layout on Fri. Also ran lines around a cut out oval with only my little finger as a guide. Having said that, my computer aided layouts also look like an old sign painter did them, sticking to my favorite alphabets too. That also means I don't waste valuable time looking for some special font. I have no interest in retirement since this work is always still rewarding to the soul.
Posted by John Lennig (Member # 2455) on :
Amen, Ricardo & Kent, "is there any other way...?"
They teach Those Ways at LATTC !! it's not to late to learn the Olde Ways...;o)
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
John,
No Sir, there is no other way !
RD
Posted by jack wills (Member # 521) on :
Faked it till I made it...
Posted by Brian Oliver (Member # 2019) on :
You and me both, Jack.
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
following Ricardo's post, before computers, I never heard the word "font." There was another word used in sign shops that came from the printing trade..."case." I worked in shops where it was important to know each others cases. Someone could stop in the middle of a line and go to lunch and I could come finish the job and you shouldn't be able to see where the transition occurred.
Posted by Ricardo Davila (Member # 3854) on :
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