The last wall job I did, I painted 3' letters and used the same latex paint they used to paint the building. It's now over 2 years old, gets beaten by the sun quite abit, and is enduring very well. The colours on those letters were process blue and white.
So I'm getting ready to do some dark grey lettering on another building and am thinking of going the latex route with it again.
My reasoning for this is that I'd much rather clean up with water than to have to work with oils. Also, One Shot just seems to be fading faster than latex. (is anyone else experiencing this too?)
Do you agree with me on this? Or do you see some reason I should be using One Shot over latex on wall lettering?
Thanks much! ~ janette
Posted by Jerry Starpoli (Member # 1559) on :
I would use Ronan. One shot is garbage anymore. Used to be the greatest when I started over 50 years ago and was wonderful until they sold.
Posted by Preston McCall (Member # 351) on :
Latex works better, despite the harder effort needed to pull good edges and longer lines. I have used Sherwinn Williams' Metal Latex on several projects and it holds up well. They no longer hail Metal latex as their best, but I still have numerous gallons of it and still use it. Seems to hold up well in sealed cans with tape tightly wrapped aroyund the lids to really seal out any air. I also add a half cup of water on the top of the paint inside, before sealing them to keep them from skimming over. Have one can of green that I bought in 2000 and it is still fresh as springtime.
As far as color fastness, as I have said before, I did a sign (8x8) on both sides, north and south in red. It was March of 2007. I drive by it all the time and there appears to be zero fading on the sunny side, compared to the north side. Red, no less! One Shot Lettering would be peeled and completely faded by now. Six years and no fading? I believe the stuff is very good.
I did another large RAM sign on the south side of a wall, direct sun. It was over a gray latex painted block wall. I used red (one coat)and black with some gray. No fading. Fortunately,, especially with the blocks as guidelines. the scale was large enough that I did the entire thing using 3" rollers, so the edge work was a snap. If the letters are big enough, they go very fast with the rollers and keeping the lines straight is easier.
I did another "Parts Dept" sign at a Chrysler store in 2000 in white and blue latex. I had to use a 2" brush to edge it in black. 13 years ago and it still looks good. I swear by the latex. It holds up well both in color and adhesion.
I did just look at some 2x4 metal directional signs I did for an apartment complex, four years ago. All in One Shot Lettering. The black, blue, and cream (triple coated) are all peeling and faded. I am very unimpressed with One Shot Lettering these days for anything more than a temp sign. They called up and asked me to come repaint them. I am embarrassed to even try to redo them in One Shot. Will use latex and will replace the substrate metal with B-bond from Glantz.
Posted by Janette Balogh (Member # 192) on :
So glad for these responses! I was thinking the same thing about latex, but just wanted to get a second opinion on my judgement.
Thanks also Preston, for the tips above. I didn't know you could keep paint from skimming over by adding the water. Too cool to keep learning new tidbits like that!
I also like sherwin william's paint so far. I use it on my sandblasted signs. T his wall customer painted their building with Ben Moore. Many moons ago, I used to really like Benjamin Moore paint, but then it got to be that it would take too many coats to cover. Plus, they are pricey, .... so the coats really add up!
I've been getting pretty weary of being disappointed by One Shot paint.
Thanks again for all the good feedback! ~ janette
Posted by Dan Sawatzky (Member # 88) on :
I would consider nothing other than a 100% acrylic paint (latex) for wall jobs. Our oneshot paint has gathered dust for decades and I do not miss the oils based fumes and mess. Acrylic lasts much longer too!
-grampa dan
Posted by Janette Balogh (Member # 192) on :
I'm doing the happy dance here! lol
Posted by Jane Diaz (Member # 595) on :
We have been REALLY happy with the Nova Paint. http://www.novacolorpaint.com/ The colors are very vibrant and long lasting. The problem with it is you have to order it from California and that can be an issue. But the people there are really helpful if you have any questions and they have a bunch of info on their website! We have also used a real high quality paint like Porter available locally. Sometimes these don't all have the range of color that Nova does but if you design with the colors available, that helps. Be aware of the TYPE of paint you are buying. Nova has a bunch of transparents & transluscents that are beautiful but don't cover well (duh!) but if you do your research and read their literature, you can get some really nice paint!
[ June 13, 2013, 01:43 PM: Message edited by: Jane Diaz ]
Posted by Rick Janzen (Member # 7227) on :
Haven't used One Shot for ext. wall jobs for years years, surprises me when I hear people still use it. Top grade acrylics/ latex all the way. The biggest thing is to use the right brush for the job. Also,you can match the sheen of the building paint. It's always interesting to hear how worried people are about the longevity of the wall signs, most out last the business. There's not a lot of things out there that will give you more than a 1 year warranty, but people seem to think a signs should last forever.
Posted by Janette Balogh (Member # 192) on :
Great Jane, and reasonably priced too. I appreciate that.
Posted by Dale Feicke (Member # 767) on :
Janette, I've been a One-Shot fan for a long time, but it's flat-out crap now, and they're doing nothing that we know of, to try and improve it in any way.
Many of us here, know who Robert Dafford is, the artist who has done many beautiful mural walls in Vicksburg, MS; Memphis, TN: Newport, KY; and many other spots around the country.
My wife and I went over to Vicksburg, about 5 years ago, when Mr. Dafford was working on the murals there. He wasn't there, that day, but his scaffolding was still set up, and many gallons of paint were sitting around. 90% of it was Sherwin-Williams Super Paint. (acrylic)
Last summer, we went back over to Vicksburg, for other reasons, but drove down by the flood walls, where the murals are. I could see no discernable fading or discoloration at all. So I figure, if it's good enough for one of the top muralists in the country, it's probably good enough for us.......right?
Posted by Bob Sauls (Member # 11321) on :
WE are using a lot ot SW SuperPaint and their Resilience line. You cannot get quarts of SuperPaint.
Try using a dark gray 1st coat under Darker color finish coat.
Posted by Leonard Gorsky (Member # 934) on :
latex is more difficult for me to work with, but it seems as if the colors last MUCH longer. any TOP quality latex house paint works.
LATEX
Posted by Deb Fowler (Member # 1039) on :
I was just going to mention Dan S when I read this but he beat me to it. I remember when he painted in Sterling, IL and now I live 15 min from there. The paint is still so beautiful and he used the acrylic. In Florida, of course the air is different too, but Florida shares some common problems that other parts of the country experiences in paints. I would like to get more familiar with latex and acrylic paints.
Posted by Preston McCall (Member # 351) on :
Another trick I accidentally discovered is that at the paint store, if you ask and know the person at the counter, is to get superpaint or metal latex with no pigment added. They will bitch about the warranty, but if you explain you will be using it to 'blend' they will sell it to you. Then try diluting the color you are trying to blend with and you will be amazed at how well it works. 50% more 'clear' makes the new paint transparent just enough to make blends easy.
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
We have found great longevity using a good grade acrylic house paint for a base and adding the NOVA colors to it.
Posted by Brian Oliver (Member # 2019) on :
I still letter a fair number of vehicles by hand and use 1-Shot to do them, but I'm getting really nervous reading these posts. Is there a better paint choice for vehicle lettering?
Posted by Bill Reusch (Member # 8028) on :
I still use one shot or ronan on vehicles and haven't had any problems. I do add hardener though. PPG bought out spraylat recently, maybe they are working on improving One Shot. It would be nice to know.
Posted by FranCisco Vargas (Member # 145) on :
Hi Netti, I also favor Nova Paints, seem to do the trick, if you order some, make sure to get some retarder if you want to work on blends, works real good...
Posted by Jane Diaz (Member # 595) on :
Brian, 1-shot is really having problems and has been for some time. Frankly, it just doesn't hold up. Bill has switch over to House of Kolor.
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
If it is a large job that doesn't require a lot of detail I'd go with a quality exterior house paint. With Latex paint it is better to thin with a latex extender than water. The latex extender contains bonding agents that surround the pigment particles and will not weaken the structure of the paint. Extenders also increase the drying time and blending ability.
Posted by Dale Manor (Member # 4858) on :
I would also recommend Nova Colors. I used it on several murals and really like working with it. I also used it on my last "smaller" sign project over latex paint and that is holding up great as well.
One shot fades quickly and I have had serious issues getting Ronan black to stick to anything! Done breathing the fumes...and will continue to use Water based paints!
Posted by W. R. Pickett (Member # 3842) on :
Every time I use enamel paint, I'm reminded why I hate it so much.
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
I love the smell of 1Shot in the morning!
1Shot, Chromatic, Ronan, etc. flowed beautifully off my quills ... and COVERED!
Latex takes 2 or 3 coats to cover.
Unfortunately we are stuck using latex for exterior work because of the Crap in a Can that they are now selling as enamel lettering paint!
Posted by Don Hulsey (Member # 128) on :
Amen Si!
Posted by stein Saether (Member # 430) on :
Latex must be brushed/rolled on much thicker to cover. I did a wall with best grade acryl-paints 15 years ago, still good as new
Posted by Bob Sauls (Member # 11321) on :
Do a Medium to dark gray first coat on any dark letter it will save you some grief
Posted by Dennis Kiernan (Member # 12202) on :
I like the smell of oil paint and turp, too. Makes me feel like myself. I have no emotional attachment to watercolor or acrylics.
Posted by Bob Sauls (Member # 11321) on :
Dennis I keep a small open cup of turpentine in my work area just so it will smell like a sign-shop. Ok, it's for my customers and for me to.
Posted by Janette Balogh (Member # 192) on :
Being a messy painter, being able to wash up with water over spirits is a big plus! haha
Posted by DianeBalch (Member # 1301) on :
How well does cast vinyl stick to latex?
Diane
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
Diane, in my experience it sticks fine once you have it on there, but getting it to stick to the latex above the transfer tape can be a pain especially with small letters or details, but once set it seems to hold up okay.
Posted by Bob Sauls (Member # 11321) on :
Diane, The better the paint (avoiding flat in most circumstances, use satin, eggshell, semi-gloss or gloss) combined with a premium vinyl will give you best adhesion. Do not cheap out or you will eat the job. I know from experience.
Posted by Mark Fair Signs (Member # 289) on :
I used all Nova Color on this wall recently. It was a rough brick wall. Just like Bob said, I tinted the primer with the background color to make the lettering cover well...
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
Neat little trick!
Gets rid of that nasty looking concrete patch!
[ June 21, 2013, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: Si Allen ]
Posted by Patrick Sweeney (Member # 4123) on :
A couple of years ago I got into a conversation with a commercial rep from Porter Paint about oil based vs latex. He told me all their R&D money goes into improving their latex brands. Because of all the federal regulations they have decided oil based has no long term future. I've used nothing but latex since and couldn't be happier.
Posted by Dennis Kiernan (Member # 12202) on :
They'll pry my brush loaded with Lead White out of my stiff, cold fingers.
Posted by Dennis Kiernan (Member # 12202) on :
They'll pry my brush loaded with Lead White out of my stiff, cold fingers.
Posted by Bill Diaz (Member # 2549) on :
Diane, my experience with cast vinyl is that it sticks best to a flat or satin sheen latex background that has been rolled real smooth with a 3/16" pile roller cover or spray-on finish.
The glossier sheens seem to have more plasticizers migrating to the surface which makes it difficult to remove the pre-mask. I always test it first by putting masking tape on the latex surface and seeing how well it sticks. I think in time the glossier surfaces become O.K. for vinyl when they cure out a bit.
