or a couple of white socks, inside each other tied at the top
Posted by Bill Lynch (Member # 3815) on :
The Hansee's are nice, but usually end up with a homemade bag from some t shirt rags.
Posted by Rick Janzen (Member # 7227) on :
Hi Chris, You can use a rag(t-shirt type) or a sock, just pour the chalk in, tie or tape it closed and pounce away. You can also by a commercial brush that's designed for pounce patterns, something like a chalk brush.
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
personally i hate the dust from pouncing,...that's what drove me to learn to freehand,...both pictorials and copy,...but when i have no choice an old t-shirt double thick then taped to hold the chosen nasty powder of choice inside,....
Posted by Dale Feicke (Member # 767) on :
We usually use folded-up T-Shirts too.
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
I use the Hansee pads.
Tshirt and sock type get powder all over you. I use 3 colors .... blue and white chalk alsocharcoal.
DO NOT use red chalk for pouncing or snap lines! IT DOES NOT COME OFF!
Posted by Bill Wood (Member # 6543) on :
I have done the alternative..tape the pattern down really good and spray each letter with the airbrush providing the pounce holes are uniform and you need to use the pattern one time.
Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :
For those of you who dislike the powder getting on your hands when using a pounce bag, try this simple solution:
Put your hand into a good-sized plastic bag and then grip the pounce bag and use as you usually do holding onto the bag through the plastic. When finished, simply pull the bag down over your hand & pounce bag,turning the plastic bag inside-out. Seal the plastic bag with the pounce bag inside, and you've avoided the dust on your hands and provided a secure bag for storing the pounce bag in your kit. No messsy powder on your hands or in your kit.
Posted by chris depuy (Member # 11823) on :
Thanks!!
Posted by Preston McCall (Member # 351) on :
Nambie-pambies. The chalk washes off with soap and water. I dislike the feeling of the chalk on my hands, but I carry a bottle of window cleaner in the truck and wash it off when I am done. No big deal. Just like having to clean fish when you catch a big one to keep. I use one of those white cotton socks that amazingly appears in the drier with no mate. I also buy the Tshirts on bulk and cut them up for truck rags. I keep a stack behind the seat. paper towels are such a waste when I have so many Tshirts with paint on them.
I still find pouncing by hand the best way to get accurate small stuff, which is the only reason I pounce patterns most anything, other than repeaters, like truck sides. Eyeballing it took time to master in the beginning, but I do most of my window work with scaling and eyeballs. Helps to have a grid sometimes for intricate ones. A good drawing helps to have in hand as I roll the white down.
Now, if they just added spell-check to the quills and flats!
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
We put the powder on a wad of cotton and roll it into an old sock. I have not found a job yet worthy of using a new sock. Finding powdered charcoal has become difficult though. Hansee sells this charcoal mixture that doesn't read nearly as well as straight charcoal. I've tested the difference to see if it was my aging eyes.
Posted by FranCisco Vargas (Member # 145) on :
Charcoal can still be found in Los Angeles, McLogan Sign Supply has em...
Posted by chris depuy (Member # 11823) on :
Ok on to wheels....What size is the best all arounder??
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
I will assume you are speaking of pounce wheels and their varied sizes and uses with the previous question here,...I have several different size pounce wheels from the three standard sizes included in my grifhold set and another much larger older wall wheel made with even coarser teeth than any in the grifhold set for wall work. the finer toothed tools are best suited for smaller detailed work and the larger coarser toothed tools for larger copy and wall work
edited to add the small coarse wheel that grifhold makes is probably the most used for all around work,.... the no 10 wheel on this page
[ December 28, 2011, 03:14 PM: Message edited by: Tim Barrow ]
Posted by Michael Clanton (Member # 2419) on :
I never could get a wheel to work very well- so I have used a scrap piece of styrofoam, paper pattern, and an old airbrush needle to poke holes in the paper- works great on smaller patterns.
I still love using the electro pounce machine- I love the smell of burning paper... just be sure not to use a metal yardstick-ZZZPOOOWWW!
Posted by George Perkins (Member # 156) on :
I can vouch for Ken's method with the zip lock bag. I read that somewhere years ago and have used it ever since, works great.
On pounce wheels, unless you are doing tiny stuff the bigger wheel works better. I prefer the elctro pounce over the wheel, used it a few weeks ago and zapped myself, something I hadn't done in probably twenty years......I forgot just what a lousy feeling that is Posted by Bart McCune (Member # 21369) on :
Hope you don't mind if I add a question.
Would I be able to use the chalk that I can pick up at any home depot or lowes store? I see that lowes carries many different colors of Stanley chalk in 8oz. bottles.
Posted by Sonny Franks (Member # 588) on :
I much prefer a wheel to electro-pounce using a corkboard base I've had for at least 25 years. I guarantee it will give you a better pattern faster than you could do it with an electro and less effort......
Posted by bruce ward (Member # 1289) on :
spraypaint
Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
Bart .... white or blue will work just fine!
AVOID the RED chalk ... it does not come off!
Posted by Rick Sacks (Member # 379) on :
We used to have our lettering benches skinned with a product they used to sell called Upsom Board...don't know if it's still available or not. We could run the pounce wheel right on the bench after we drew our pattern. Still needed to flip it to sand the back side though. For larger holes for wall work, I like to double the layers of the paper and use the electric wonder.
Posted by Preston McCall (Member # 351) on :
I like the bigger wheels as they can follow a ruler better. I have also found wrapping about a quarter inch of masking tape around the handle makes for less strain on the fingers. I even expanded the length of the handle with a hollowed out wooden dowell helps as the handle was always too short to get better arm action on bigger patterns.
I use the Stanley type of chalk at the hardware stores. Blue, white or black seems to work the best. Red is hard to get rid of as Si explained. never saw any advantage to using charcoal.
Sanding the back...I use 180 grit paper and sand only in one diection as I frequently make patterns with just tiled typing paper printed off of my computer and tape them together with clear tape. I also have found using a smooth cut-up old tshirt, ironed flat, works about the best for something to roll against, beneath the paper. When I have to do real little letters, sometimes I use a pin on a stick to get very tight patterns.
I tried the electro pounce years ago, but hated getting shocked and it always seemed to take about as long getting set up. I only have to do a dozen or so patterns a year, so no big deal. It is an invaluable tool though.
Years ago in the late 70s, we had an opaque projector and cut out of the Letterset catalogue all the various fonts we needed on cardboard. We had to move each letter where we wanted them to make a pencil sketch, before pouncing. We did almost everything that way, before computers. We had to close off the light in the shop and on hot days it was brutal being in there for an hour making a sketch before we pounced. I remember using the first vinyl letters in maybe 1980 that we got from some company in Arizona and we were mightily impressed with making some 100 small signs for label boards in a lumber company. Even then, I never imagined we would eventually all be able to cut out our own vinyl so easily, but no, I never bought a Gerber 4B. I honestly figured that they would run off most of the hand lettering people and it really did. It is amazing how much more today I can charge for hand lettering. It really is a lost art.
Posted by chris depuy (Member # 11823) on :
Thanks to you all!! I never thought I would get this kind of response.....
Posted by Brad Ferguson (Member # 33) on :
I've used carpenters chalk many times but I prefer powdered charcoal. It's finer ground so you don't have to sand the back of the paper. And you can get a lighter deposit of powder on the sign by just rubbing, as opposed to tapping the bag. Of course, carpenters chalk is more readily available.
I've also put artist's charcoal in snap-lines. It was easier to clean off wall jobs and was less apt to leave blue ghost lines. Not that I made a habit of cleaning layout lines off wall jobs, but it was occasionally a customer request for wall signs that were close to the ground.
Posted by Bart McCune (Member # 21369) on :
Wow there is a lot of useful information in this thread.
Exactly what any guy starting out would need.
Posted by Len Mort (Member # 7030) on :
Patterns were always made on Sign Painters Bond paper and pounced with with pounce wheels from fine to large, pounced with charcoal, Talc, baby powder or blue chalk in a cotton ball filled with medium and wrapped with a cotton rag tied in a ball. Hansee pad's came on the market and work great as well, but old school rules!.
Drawing/Lettering board is 48" x 16' and covered with a material called homasote works well for pouncing as well as pining paper, cards or any other material down .
Posted by Jane Diaz (Member # 595) on :
Ever since our kids were little we have used baby socks! They are usually tightly woven and small enough that you have just about the right amount of black chalk, talcum powder or blue carpenter's chalk. Fill them 1/2 full and tie the top shut with a knot. Seal them up in a sandwich bag in your kit and you don't have "stuff" all over. And as Si said, don't use red.
Posted by Barb Schilling (Member # 13) on :
Besides the "wad of cotton" idea in the sock or bag, I do my pouncing on a printer "blanket". The rubber pad that gets attached to an offset press. When they get worn out for printing they still work great for pouncing and are self healing and flexible. I put a grommet in the corners and hang it up on the wall when not in use. Also, I use a latex glove to "store" the pouncebag. Just turn it inside out so the hand covers the bag and the fingers when done pouncing. If you can find animal bone charcoal, it works better outside and doesn't wash off easy. When I need a big pouncebag, I use muslin - much tougher than sock.
Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :
Here's another tip That I forgot to include in my initial response. If you're making a pattern that you'll be working with in a windy situation, or if you want a strong durable pattern that will last for a good long while, substitute Tyvek for the paper. This stuff performs as well as paper, but it is highly resistant to tearing.
Posted by John Byrd (Member # 825) on :
corn starch was used when doing Gold. was always affraid the talc would cause problems with the paint. Drywall is a good cheap backer for pouncing with a wheel.
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