I've been playing around with this layout, and decided to try out Dan Mika's advice in SignCraft ("Turn that O into an "Ohhhh!") .... does it work? - or is it more an "Uh?" The bottom 2 are just ideas I was working on before the "O" idea Any advice gratefully received as always - thanks, Karen
Posted by Dan Sawatzky (Member # 88) on :
It works for me! I like the top one although I 'm not a fan of the G in that top font. THe lighter fonts in the examples below may work better for the G Thomas.
-grampa dan
Posted by Jon Butterworth (Member # 227) on :
Ditto Dan's comments. My only reservation is the "G" overlaping the "A".
I prefer the font to the ones below .... maybe a lighter version or smaller cap size.
Posted by david drane (Member # 507) on :
It is a great start, but "Belwe" seems to not fit the occasion to me. I think it would look better with a skinny block letter (Avante Garde) family with the G. Thomas in the same font.(but smaller)?? Taking that the guy's name is G. Thomas Anderson, but that is just me. The "Lawn Maintenance" in the reverse panel is great!!
[ July 18, 2008, 06:34 AM: Message edited by: david drane ]
Posted by Jillbeans (Member # 1912) on :
I love the idea of using that "O" in the way you've depicted. Like Dave, I am not in favor of the Belwe, although I have always liked that font. I took his suggestion of Avant Garde and gave it a whirl. Used my fave script, Valentino, on the name, but I did try it in a lighter weight of Avant Garde. I tried black rather than the dark green, with a spring green accent. (well in Corel it was a spring green) As always, I love using a reverse panel in a layout. I probably use it too often but it's tried and true. I think you have a great start, just need some TLC. Love....Jill Oops! Forgot to add the pic:
[ July 18, 2008, 08:36 AM: Message edited by: Jillbeans ]
Posted by Mark M. Kottwitz (Member # 1764) on :
I agree with the comments made above.
I really like the top example, I'm not really crazy about the scripty font on the top.
Perhaps, if you use the font on the bottom examples. As far as the overlaping, I would make an outline of the overlaping letter, and remove the bottom with it, rather than a reverse color. ( I hope that makes sense.)
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
I like Jill's layout....
Minor exceptions would be different look for grass and a secondary color for the block behind "lawn maintenance"..... but the layout and font choices are outstanding.....
Makes me want to mow my lawn [almost ]
Karen - your original layouts have some merit... but the font choices aren't ideal as a few mentioned.
My other critique would be the "grass" image you have looks like a weed to me - or grass that has gone to seed. Not sure you want an image of unkempt grass associated with a lawn *care* logo.... the grass should look tidy and neat - my opinion.
Again... study Jill's layout - - nice fonts, balance, legibility, etc.
Posted by karen m stanley (Member # 7178) on :
Wow everyone - thank you for the lessons! I have been playing around a bit with the fonts ... I really like your suggestions, just gotta get some good scripts Todd... that's exactly what the grass is - part of my lawn wasnt mown in so long that the grass went to seed ! so I drew some... I guess I was thinking that if you have looong grass you need to get some lawn maintenance? I'll keep working on it and again appreciate all and any advice Karen
[ July 18, 2008, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: karen m stanley ]
Posted by Arthur Vanson (Member # 2855) on :
I thought Dan A. had the lawncare logo market sown-up; how did this one escape?
Here's another simple variation, although I would prefer Karen's original grassy O as an image, I really liked it.
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Sorry Arthur!
But the (O) pulls your eye in one direction. It doesn't work.
It is interesting how people want their (name) before the service and contact number.
[ July 20, 2008, 07:49 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
Posted by karen m stanley (Member # 7178) on :
quote: It is interesting how people want their (name) before the service and contact number.
What are you saying Stephen - that it might be better / okay to put the service + ph number first and the name last?? It would be interesting to play around with that - very non-traditional. Would that really work? Do you have any examples - I love new ideas but don't want to go off on a wild tangent karen
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Karen Give me a day and will show you what I mean.
I don't like to project other peoples works. But this one is interesting.
The "Service" is the 'For Most'!
Contact # is the next! Name of company is the last.
I do Page Ads. Calendars...Etc. 'Yellow/Newspaper White Prints'...
but you have capture the needs first.
[ July 20, 2008, 09:16 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
I think the "name" in this case is the business name.... I don't see the "lawn service" and phone number as being at the top and dominant.
I think it would be a major mistake to change the emphasis to "lawn service" and the phone number....."lawn service" is a generic term for what "Anderson" the company does.....
My 2 cents. But let's see what it looks like...
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Todd There is many whys to dream outside the Box!
Posted by david drane (Member # 507) on :
Is "G. Thomas Anderson" the guy's name or is his name "G. Thomas" and he comes from Anderson (town) Lawn Maintenance? If his name is "G. Thomas Anderson" then the script (in Jill's layout) does not belong.
Posted by Jillbeans (Member # 1912) on :
Here's a simple way of combining the name G. Thomas Anderson while highlighting what they do, not who they are. But then we lose the fun "O"!
This layout is just a suggestion, but not the way I would normally do a layout. In my work, I typically play up on the name, not so much the service. For example, why make "TOWING" real big on a tow truck? It is obvious that is what task the company performs. Therefore I highlight the name. Same with lawn service businesses. Usually if you see a truck parked at a house with a hot guy on a stand-up mower, you know he's a lawn man. So make his name stand out rather than LAWN MAINTENANCE. That way his prospective clients can see his name and remember it. Same with contractors, as there are so many around here.
I NEVER highlight a phone number tho. I keep it understated, which I know some will argue. But if one can easily spot and remember a name, the business can be contacted later on via the Internet or a phone. I dislike when a phone number is given the most emphasis on a sign. Just my 2¢ Thanks for being a good sport, Karen. Love....Jill Posted by Anne McDonald (Member # 6842) on :
I agree Jill, most people don't recall the phone number. I always understate it unless the company is pushing a free call number. I like your layout above but feel like the G.Thomas is oversized. Just my 2C worth!!
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Just a rough take on this. But as I said 'Service first.'
Contact number next.
Posted by Catharine C. Kennedy (Member # 4459) on :
I like your thinking, Stephen! Do you even KNOW what the inside of the box looks like? LOL!
Posted by Jillbeans (Member # 1912) on :
But does this mean the grass will be cropped by the pony rather than G. Thomas Anderson? Love....Jill
Posted by Murray MacDonald (Member # 3558) on :
Nope. Fertilized. Mur
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Thank You Catharine!
We want to capture someones attention with our work.
Jill it caught yours! A picture is worth a thousand words.
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
Sorry Stephen -
That layout doesn't work at all (my opinion).
And neither would this idea following that logic...
Creative thinking is fine, but there are certain design truths that stand the test of time.... and one of them is brand recognition.... you don't get brand recognition by making the generic "lawn Maintenance" the element with the greatest emphasis...
Who's lawn maintenance?? Could be anybody's lawn service....
If I saw a True Green lawn care truck drive by.... I want to see "True Green" first.... it conjures up a lot of emotional response as it relates to brand recognition and reputation: Immediately you tie the name into their commercials, you tie the name into the positive comments you've heard your neighbors make about using their service, you tie into all manner of marketing themes, jingles, etc you've seen and heard.
Now, contrast that to seeing a truck drive by that boldy says "Lawn Maintenance"....with the brand identity almost hidden.....
It means very little and evokes almost no visual and metal connection and no emotional response to the brand. All it says to me is: This must be some weekend handyman trying to make a buck....it totally lacks a professional image.
The exception being a product that is so widely known, such as the Volkswagen Beetle, that simply having a picture of the vehicle in an add will instantly make you think "VW."
In this case.... Lawn Maintenance doesn't strongly relate to any particular business.
Sorry dude... doesn't work for me....
Thinking too far out of the box can be disastrous; Imagine deciding to put a tires treads on the inside of the tire instead of the outside surface? LOL.
[ July 22, 2008, 11:08 AM: Message edited by: Todd Gill ]
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
That is ok... Todd!
No One has ever sold you on something like
"OUTSIDE THE LINES" Right.
Check you next newsprint or flyer! Product first, and next is contact or date of item then it is where you can get this item.
I love how people sit in the darkness of the box and peek through the cracks!
Edit to say (Fill in the dot spaces on your services)
[ July 22, 2008, 02:11 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
No offense Stephen...just my opinion.
*Outside The Lines* refers to creative style.....not rearranging basic building blocks of good design.
At least - that is my take on it.
What's a newspaper?? Is that one of those antiquated print and deliver rags that contain regionally biased information which continually decline in readership? Posted by Michael Gene Adkins (Member # 882) on :
I get jobs like this all the time, where the name is too big, the name is confusing, they want their whole family name worked into the layout, etc.
Unless they're paying you more for your time, that's when they get the basic layouts, and then I try to follow Todd's suggestion.
Keep the important stuff dominant and legible!!!
Throw on a phone number, thank you, have a nice day!!!
Jill beans 2nd layout (or one like it) is your safest bet. Unless the customer hates it. Then you just do what the customer wants and ya goes on!
Like I said, I get this stuff all day long and I've learned that simple, simple, simple is best.
Posted by Jon Butterworth (Member # 227) on :
OK, I'll throw in my 2c worth. I spent 10 years as a visualiser/copywriter for an advertising agency before I went solo signwriting.
Stephen: Yes, a picture is worth a thousand words, but WTF has a horse eating grass going to do to the customer's image of service and care? I agree, thinking outside the box works, but layout and image can suffer.
Todd is right to some extent. Brand recognition is very important with all the competition.
Jilly's first design looks best to me, although with a little more resizng of the elements, Karen's first one does too.
Karen: Take the "G. Thomas" down in size and weight. Nice flowing script. Then make the "Lawn Maintenance" panel in equal weight (size) to the word "Anderson". Your treatment of the grass in the "O" is enough to pull the logo out of the ordinary.
If people don't remember the phone number they will remember "Anderson Lawn Maintenance"
Maybe that was 5c worth
[ July 22, 2008, 04:57 PM: Message edited by: Jon Butterworth ]
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Then I will back down on my 'Design Work'
Sorry People! We have to follow the.... 'Normal' things in life!
[ July 22, 2008, 08:31 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
Posted by karen m stanley (Member # 7178) on :
Stephen - I like it! It captured my attention and made me laugh It certainly challenges me to think differently about my designs - thank you!!! Michael - I hear what you're saying but... For my first 8 years in this business it was pretty much just basic/simple stuff "throw on.... thankyou, have a nice day". But now I'm running my own business and am in the wonderful position of not HAVING to make any sale (I work at home) So with any job I get I try to use it as an opportunity to improve my skills. I don't get paid for all my design time but then again I could be paying to go to college and get taught all this stuff that I'm learning right on the job... and on Letterville!!! And I appreciate everyone's efforts to teach me with this one Jon - I thought I had it finished but might have to tweak it just a bit.... THANK YOU all! Karen
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
I'd really like to see what you came up with Karen. When all was said and done I still liked your first design the best. The only thing that bothered me was the G. Thomas I envisioned a tweak like this where it nested between a larger A and the taller grasses of the O. Please ignore the mismatched font and the quick and dirty manipulation, but it gets my idea across anyhow.
Your design has a nice unique character that appeals to me. I guess it doesn't address the concerns with the size of the phone # vs the services though.
Posted by Russ McMullin (Member # 5617) on :
With the exception of the "o" I really like Arthur's solution. I think it puts good emphasis on what's most important to see first, and subordinates the rest. It would look great on the side of a truck.
Posted by Robert Larkham (Member # 2913) on :
Bottom line. Park a truck with any of the original designs on it side by side with Stephens and who are you going to call. I say the originals. Much more of a corporate logo for a vehicle. Stephen's looks like a business card you trying to use for everything you have like truck doors, 4x8 building sign and the real estate signs. It just won't work. The originals would easily be broken apart and moved around for different applications. I'm all for thinking outside the box but many times the "norm" is where you need to go. Go to Dan Antonelli's site and just look at the logo design. It all works amazingly. I often go there to soak it in before working on new logos for a client. Sorry Stephen it just doesn't work for me.
Posted by david drane (Member # 507) on :
quote:Originally posted by Robert Larkham: Bottom line. Park a truck with any of the original designs on it side by side with Stephens and who are you going to call. I say the originals. Much more of a corporate logo for a vehicle. Stephen's looks like a business card you trying to use for everything you have like truck doors, 4x8 building sign and the real estate signs. It just won't work. The originals would easily be broken apart and moved around for different applications. I'm all for thinking outside the box but many times the "norm" is where you need to go. Go to Dan Antonelli's site and just look at the logo design. It all works amazingly. I often go there to soak it in before working on new logos for a client. Sorry Stephen it just doesn't work for me.
I agree.. A half second glimpse is what one needs to sink in straight away!! Jill's first layout was the best with the exception of using the same font except much smaller in the top line instead of the script.
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
Robert
I take no offence.
I understand that most just think in a vector format and some of us use digitals,.. plus!
Posted by Robert Larkham (Member # 2913) on :
Stephen I run a a large format digital printer all day long. I get what your saying but from your layout I don't know if the guy is cutting grass or giving pony rides. I too incorporate photos into my work but try to make the photo relevant to the business. There is outside the box and then there is WAY outside the box.
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
Me too.... I work in Photoshop about 50%+ of my day.
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
OK! Guys I took my post down.. I work (100%) with 'Photo and Illy' all day long.
The 'Horse' is not the matter as it could have been a "Cow/ Goat or Lawn Mower!"
[ July 23, 2008, 01:08 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
Don't take your post down...it's been a good discussion... with a wide range of opinion... not hammering on you in a personal way Stephen... Have a good one.
If you wanted to create an image that would really stick in people's minds...humor might be the route to go.
Imagine having a guy walking behind a goat, holding onto reins that are attached to a harness on the goat....while the goat is moving forward eating (mowing) the grass.
Now that would be funny, and an image that would stick.
Posted by karen m stanley (Member # 7178) on :
Todd - don't tempt me - I have 2 goats out in the paddock right now.... Posted by KARYN BUSH (Member # 1948) on :
or better yet...two sheep...with sexy black leather harnesses of course...with someone from nh(or mass)...i dunno...ron costa maybe or bob peach(one of them for sure)...standing behind them with a(i should stop now)...but todd, come on...you can whip that up in photoshop quick! Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
Why do I have a feeling someone's trying to get me booted off this site??
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Any advice gratefully received as always - thanks, Karen
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