I've been working on a couple of 8x16 signs. As seems to be the case on anything I do with blends, that is the most challenging aspect. Any tips or ideas as to how to make them smooth?
Posted by Jillbeans (Member # 1912) on :
What type of paint are you using? I have used Smith's Creme or Penetrol to extend the drying time of 1-Shot. If latex/water-based you can try Floetrol. Love....Jill
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
Thanks Jill, I'm using alkyds this time - last time it was latex. I tried spraying but I ended up with a real blotchy mess. I managed to salvage it by doing some dry brushing, but it was really time consuming. I just seem to suck at blends. I have to spray a blend on some 20 high vinyl letters now. Maybe I should try rolling on a blend of my colour and clear? As far as the spraying, I'm sure part of my problem is my tools and part my lack of experience with them. Yuk! Posted by Donna in BC (Member # 130) on :
Kelly, the Sawatzky way is to have two paint brushes on the go, one with your letter colour and one with your blend colour. Base coat your letter, let dry, then paint your one colour on top, other on the bottom and take that 2nd colour and twist and turn into the top colour until you achieve that gradual fade. It takes abit of practice and has a somewhat choppy appearance but the effect is amazing.
Maybe Dan can describe it better. But you have to know when to turn your brush over to the drier side as you blend into the other colour so you don't get large hits of the 2nd colour.
Edited to add: never tried this with oils, always latex. AND the rest of the letter was purposely painted in a crosshatch way to achieve a layered textured look, so the choppy blend looked right.
[ May 31, 2008, 11:32 AM: Message edited by: Donna in BC ]
Posted by Dale Feicke (Member # 767) on :
Blends are kinda tough to do, Kelly, as you know.Working with alkyds, though, is for me, easier.
Spraying, do the top color, then mix some clear into it, spray down a little more. Then take the bottom color and reverse the process. Spray the bottome color up a-ways, then mix some clear in with it and blend in to your other clear-mix. The clears will help the two colors to blend more smoothly. Keep the gun back a couple feet, and about 50-55 lbs. pressure. By stepping back and looking at it, you can see if the fade is too far up or down, and tweak it accordingly.
I'v also done it by "bagging". But this process is not easy unless the boards are laying down on the floor or on a table. Mounted on a wall, it will have a tendency to run.
I've not done much in latex. Hope this will give you some help. You might try practicing on a smaller panel first. Let me know if I can give any more assistance.
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
I use rollers for big blends here. For an eight foot blend sixteen ft. long I would use two 9" rollers and two trays. First I start with the lightest color and work it across the board for the first band trying not to load the roller tray and nap any more than needed, yet with enough paint to go the full length and half the next nap full. Its easier if you are on the ground but very doable on rigging as long as you have access to the full length of the bulletin. When it comes time to start blending colors I add a enough of the next color to the tray and mix it with an old brush in the tray. It is best to keep this part as gradual as possible so as to avoid streaks. Sometimes I use another board or old scrap sign ,for a pallet to keep from loading up the nap and to keep the blend from streaking. the next band is lapped over the first depending on the blend. If needed you can use the pallet board to test as you go to make sure the nap is fairly empty to blend the two colors as needed,..you have to work fast for it to work properly and I would advise trying it out on another test panel for the first time just to be sure. Once you finish an area stay out of it and progress without getting too far back in the area thats been already painted. Sometimes it helps just to toss one roller cover that is starting to streak from too rapid a blend and use a clean one to do away with streaks quickly(this another reason for the pallet board,the bigger the better as this can be messy) Sometimes just emptying the roller on the pallet will do to keep the blend clean. When the times comes it may be easier just to switch pans and use a clean color and roller. the trick is to keep the roller wet but not overly full ,the next color will still pull what is in the nap on the next band. On blend that small I usually do them in about half again as much time as it would take as one color backgrounds.
oops edited to say I misread the post and this technique is for the background but can very easily adapted for your task by using smaller tools,...
[ May 31, 2008, 02:48 PM: Message edited by: Tim Barrow ]
Posted by Darcy Baker (Member # 8262) on :
Kelly, if you start with Tim's method rolling wet on wet you'll get close ('cept I'd use 9" rollers). Then use Dale's method with a spray gun and you got'er! Rolling will load up your base and basic gradation and the spray gives you the fades you desire.That's for a bkgrd. on letters 3" is good- had to re read this post.
[ May 31, 2008, 02:58 PM: Message edited by: Darcy Baker ]
Posted by Tim Barrow (Member # 576) on :
I responded to your first post here and reread the additional details,....I would use vinyl the color of your lightest color and just use one of the new plastic coat spray bombs(actually 2 to 4 cans). I use the new krylon brand for plastics here. Try misting the paint from a distance very lightly and then building it up to an opaque at the other side of the blend. The further away from your work the lighter the mist will be. Disregard the instructions on the can and spray at an angle to your work.You can always add more in a blend with spray but there is not a practical way to remove it, so the lighter the mist the better. Keep the nozzle clean with a rag to avoid spitting and the can shook well. If needed you can always come back with a mist from a can of the base color too smooth out the job. be damn sure it is dry before you cut and premask. A test run or two is still advised.
hope this helps ya!
[ May 31, 2008, 03:33 PM: Message edited by: Tim Barrow ]
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
Thanks all, Sorry if I confused as to what information I was looking for. I'm interested in techniques on how to do blends on any surface. I can usually get a fairly nice one on small areas using an airbrush or paintbrush, but the bigger ones are my downfall. There are some good ideas here that I'll try out on future projects.
Posted by Darcy Baker (Member # 8262) on :
Kelly, you can paint a mural quicker than a small canvas if your head is in the right space.Use bigger spray guns and bigger brushes.The strokes are the same.The only limitations are the ones in your head.
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
My head has no limitations Darcy...it's a vast wilderness in there. Posted by Joe Crumley (Member # 2307) on :
Kelly,
I gave Darcy some hints about this a couple of months ago. He was wanting to tone down the sides and corners of 4'X8' panels.
One trick that I've used is with a spray gun. With latex you can add an extender. That's more like a transparent coat. This makes it easy to make lots of coats back and forth adding up to a smooth blend. Using any paint strait is more difficult.
So the tip is work in transparent coats.
Posted by Darcy Baker (Member # 8262) on :
Joe lies, they were 4X10 and I didn't need extender.
Posted by Richard Heller (Member # 2443) on :
For alkyds you can use linseed oil or Penetrol, and waterbased acrylics use Floetrol. These reduce the drying time and give you a longer window to work within, then as they say above, the techniques are the same.
Posted by Jon Butterworth (Member # 227) on :
Kelly, that spray gun you got from me is ideal for blends.
Just practice with trigger pressure and distance from surface.
Keep the paint as thick as you can to still go thru the gun and mist it on.
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
That's what I used Jon, but I couldn't seem to get the volume I needed. I thought it was the 250V/120V thing. Was volume and regularity a problem in Moose Jaw?
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
OK Kelly
How many layer of blending colours?
If it is only two colours then you need two roller for the paint and two dry rollers to blend with.
Three rollers of colour and then three dry ones. and so on!
The trick is to keep the surface wet as you are working with it!
Always start your 'light to dark down' the board..
Some colurs will get muddy. Remember the colours that can be matched to each other.
Linseed Oil is amazing for this.
[ May 31, 2008, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Deveau ]
Posted by Jon Butterworth (Member # 227) on :
Yes it was a major problem in Moose Jaw, Kelly. 120v doesn't push out the volume unless it is thinned down so much it runs on a vertical surface.
Also, it really works best with acrylics, or spraying enamels with fast drying thinners.
So i would go the roller suggestions.
Posted by Doug Allan (Member # 2247) on :
I did these with 3 rollers on hand, and some pre-mixed mixtures in little cups. I got some straight peacock blue rolled out on one end, some reflex on the other & some 50/50 in the middle... then I had a large paper to work on getting my blends looking nice on the roller... then blended it into the wet paint on the sign...
Posted by John Arnott (Member # 215) on :
They do have large 20" or 24" commercial rollers available.
Posted by Gregg Parkes (Member # 7710) on :
Hi Kelly, I do this... seems to work every time.
Find the point that you wish to blend, half way, 1/3rd up etc, 3/4 up etc.
Paint two solid colours, say in this example, yellow, green. Let dry.
Then get two spray guns, one loaded with each colour. With the first colour, spray 1 action left to right, move up substrate, and spray 2 actions, right to left then left to right... then move up then right to left, left to right, right to left. Repeat until full colour match on the top. Remember how many "actions" (might be four), then get the other gun and spray 4,3,2,1 to the blend point. This is effectively putting a more gradual layer of paint on the substrate (like 100%,75%,50%,25% black) Getting the final effect can be then used between the two guns just touching up. The further away from the substrate, the finer the blend.
Hope this makes sense.
Posted by Steve Vigeant (Member # 439) on :
Kelly, One low-tech way that I tried on a real billboard a while back might work. I drew out several lines like a horizontal Corel fountain fill. Mixed up five steps of color like flag stripes. Then I hit the lines with a mix the two colors that were touching so it added up to a nine step blend. And it was quite an even blend on a 14' x 48' or so. The principle works and is very easy.
Posted by Darcy Baker (Member # 8262) on :
Seriously though, Joe gives great advice.I wasn't real confident about using latex, but definitely am not happy with performance of today's sign enamel.He set my mind at ease regarding latex and I feel good about the longevity of the work going out now.Joe recommended an extender medium as Jill and Richard mentioned Floetrol is something I would use on a larger project.
[ June 04, 2008, 05:09 AM: Message edited by: Darcy Baker ]
Posted by James Donahue (Member # 3624) on :
Occaisionally I see a truck going down the road that is one color along the bottom, and another along the top, with a chunky blend in between. That's what I call a mechanical blend. Somebody tried using the spray gun to do all the work.
Myself, I always prefer what I call a bench blend. I pre-mix the blend in a series of stages, at least 4, be it little cups, cans, whatever is the right size. Then I tool the first color on, leaving it as wet as possible. I do this for brush, roller, or spray. If you want control over the situation, this is how. If using brushes, load the paint on very wet. You can use horizontal strokes to apply a color, but always drag the tips of the bristles lightly over the wet paint in a vertical direction. This eliminates sags in your lobbed on wet paint, while you're getting the next color ready.
Alot of times, (always?) you can't mix white into a color and get the same cool transparent color effect you're looking for, in those cases, find the clear version of your paint, and do the bench blend with that, coming over a pre painted light or white.
Posted by James Donahue (Member # 3624) on :
Just remembered: rollers are the trickiest of all, because the retain so much paint. So you get stacks of newspaper to try and work a color out, only to have lines from the edge of the roller. Watch out for them dern edges/lines.
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