They are rather expensive new, but you can find good deals on eBay for used ones. The reasons I want one are twofold:
1. I'm a decent cartoonist and have been publishing my work to the web since last year on other forums, mostly about sports. Since the maximum size I can scan is 8.5" x 11", that's the max size I can draw on paper, which can be a problem with multiple frame cartoons. You gotta draw so small that it's a P.I.T.A. if it ain't a single frame cartoon.
2. I get frustrated with my clip art collection as pertaining to my sign work when I'm designing a custom signs to cut on my ShopBot that may call for something not in my collection (which is extensive, BTW). I can draw very well, just about anything, so with a digitized drawing tablet, will I be able to design what I need, convert it into a file that will work with SignLab, ArtCam Pro, Casemate, etc., and then send it to my CNC? Maybe even to do 3D?
Thanks!
[ April 25, 2007, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: Mark Tucker ]
Posted by Jason Davie (Member # 2172) on :
Mark I have a wacom its the less expensive one only 4x6 but I love it I use it for signlab 5 i would buy a slightly bigger one i think if i were to buy another... But I love my trackball to draw with even more than the wacom.....
Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
I've been using a wacom since age 16. You need one. I don't understand someone that does design or art on the computer witha mouse, they must not realize what a tablet can do.
I know next to nothing about CNC, but my guess is it'll be a big help. I can draw in illustrator and cut on my plotter in seconds. I still love pencil though, so I'll often scan and finish something off digitally. If you use a soft pencil (or ink) and work clean you can scan and do a live trace in illustrator, and cut that ona plotter. I mention the plotter again because I'm sure that process (vector) would be helpful for CNC stuff too.
The other advantage is speed. I don't care how fast you are with a mouse or what you're doing, I'm twice as fast with the tablet.
Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
Oh yeah, with regard to size, bigger is better. I've used the 4x6, didn't like it. I used to have a 12x18 artzII, loved it, now the biggest I can get (without spending a fortune for a cintiq) is 9x12 intuos3, that's what I have now and that's the best bang for your buck.
Posted by Dale Manor (Member # 4858) on :
I have used the 12 X 12 before and found it too big. It just seemed like I had to move my hand an unnatural amount in proportion to what I was trying to draw.
I think the 9 X 12 would be a better fit for me.
Hey Mark, Do you use Adobe Illustrator or Photoshop to do your vector and bitmap work?
If you do, the Wacom will be a great tool for you!
Posted by Jim & Chris hetzler (Member # 1709) on :
You won't regret it....it is the best investement tool we have in our shop, plus you will be more productive with less fatigue. Don't expect to be good at it right away though, it took me a few frustrating days to get the hang of it.
Hetz
Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
Oh, nice. You can get intuos3 up to 12x19 now! When I got mine 9x12 was the largest. Great, now I want a new one.
I found that the larger size lets me use arm motion rather than wrist motion, which lets me make nicer sweeping curves.
Posted by Kelly Thorson (Member # 2958) on :
I have a 9x12 I hardly ever used. I found the larger drawing area required a lot of arm movement. I now have a smaller one I like much better. I've run into a lot that agree with that so I'd have to agree with Dale, bigger isn't necessarily better. Something else you should look into is the pens, there are different profiles and I've heard some men complain that their pens were to slender, and I find that the pen with my larger tablet is very cumbersome. For some the Wacom feels right from the start, and for others they never do manage to be 100% comfortable with it. Be prepared for an adjustment period, particularily if you do not have really good co-ordination. Hey Lee, Welcome to Letterville,I checked out your web site...some cool work there. Are you coming to the Moose Jaw meet?
Posted by Mark Sheflo (Member # 3608) on :
Two words of advice on this one:
Buy it.
One hint if you are using it for illustrations, figure out how much area you normally use for your drawings and buy the right size for you. Personally I have an 6 x 8 Intuos at home and use a 9 x 12 Intuos 3 at work. Both work wonderfully for what I do. I know some who like the bigger size and a few who like smaller sizes as well, it all depends on the use. I doubt that you would be happy with anything less than an Intuos though, so many ways to personalize it.
Mark
Posted by Steve Purcell (Member # 1140) on :
Very handy tool. If the 9x12 drawing area is too large for your liking , you can reduce the active tablet area to suit your drawing style.
Posted by Raymond Chapman (Member # 361) on :
Mark, I have two but use the 9 x 12 most of the time. The other is a smaller one that is used mostly for vector work, but it is extremely handy also.
The pen takes a little practice to get used to drawing on the tablet and seeing it on a monitor. It's not a natural thing, but easily overcome.
The sensitivity of the pen is adjustable which is desirable, especially while you are learning to use it.
I use the mouse with my left hand and the pen with my right (not at the same time) so going back and forth takes a little patience. And don't ask why I do it that way, because I don't know.
Posted by Todd Gill (Member # 2569) on :
Mark -
I have the 9 X 12 also....
My thoughts? It's too big....too much arm movement required, and yes you can minimize the work space - but then, if you do that you might as well have bought a bit smaller one in the first place.
I have found that I can draw faster and more accurately with my mouse....which I've been using forever....so it's probably a "what you're used to" sort of thing.
Also....if your hands shake - even a little - the pen picks up every little twitch and makes it hard [for me] to click on a node for instance....
With the mouse - my hands entire weight is moving the mouse around with enough friction on the mousepad to keep me stable.
But - you can't get the pressure/airbrush stuff out of a traditional mouse either...
Also - wish Wacom had more "attributes" that you can set for the buttons on the pen/tablet. There is a limitation on what you can assign.
There were a few other downsides I recall too....but I can't remember them at the moment.
I'm going to give it another go and see if I can get more accustomed to it.
I asked these same questions when I was looking and I think it was Dale that suggested not getting too big of one....I disregarded that advice thinking "bigger must be better"....and now I wish I had listened to that advice. Good luck Mark...I'll bet you find it very suitable to cartooning.....especially with the pressure sensitive brush styles.
Posted by Mark Tucker (Member # 6461) on :
Jason, what's a trackball?
Kelly, wanna sell that 9 x 12?
Dale, I use Corel X3 for my vector and bitmap work, but I have Illustrator and Photoshop as well.
Thanks, everyone! 'Preciate it! I think bigger will be better for me as I am prefer to draw larger and then shrink the image if necessary and you can do that with these things, right?
I wish I could rent several different sizes and then decide! Posted by Si Allen (Member # 420) on :
Mark....have you ever thought of drawing your cartoons as individual cells ...at whatever is a convienient size, then saving. When you get them all drawn, then import them all back into Corel and assemble them in the right order and then save that.
Posted by Mark Tucker (Member # 6461) on :
Si,...no, I hadn't thought of that, but I'm thinking about it now! I'm glad I thought of that! Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
I'm surprised at the number of people that prefer smaller sizes. I'll admit it's rough on my shoulder and takes up some real estate on my desk, but I guess I define "better" only in terms of what lets me draw better.
Kelly - thanks! I don't know... didn't really know about it. I'll do a search, if it's possible I'd like to.
Posted by Mark Tucker (Member # 6461) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lee Kembel: I'm surprised at the number of people that prefer smaller sizes.
I am too, Lee, but I am not familiar with them as you and others. I've never even seen one in person.
When you draw on these things, you see the image you're drawing on the tablet as well as your monitor, right? And you can do full color work, right? And if you're working with, say, a 9 x 12 tablet, you can make your work area much larger (in scale), than that on your computer, say 90 x 120, right?
I be a lil' confused.
[ April 25, 2007, 03:12 PM: Message edited by: Mark Tucker ]
Posted by Steve Eisenreich (Member # 1444) on :
Mark the tablets you can see your work on are the Cintiq tablets (basically a handheld touch screen monitor) I am sure they are up in price even on ebay.
Everyone so far has been speaking about the Intuos tablets of some kind, personally if you are running a 19-21 inch monitor then get a larger 9-12 tablet but if you are still using a tiny 14 inch monitor then buy the small graphire
I've always wondered what some of you were talking about when referring to these tablets. Does anyone know of a internet video that shows how these things are used?
Posted by Mark Tucker (Member # 6461) on :
Steve, yeah I have a 19" LCD monitor. The Cintiq and Tablet PC's you speak of are a lot more $$$ than I want to spend. I reckon I can learn to draw on a tablet and see it materialize on my monitor. I've decided I will get a 9 x 12 minimum, depending on the deals available and bidding wars on eBay. Thanks.
Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
Yeah, the cintiq is the one wher eyou see what you draw on the tablet. I'd have one if I could afford it. The intuos has a little bit of a learning curve because you draw on the tablet, but you watch the screen, so your brain has to get used to that. Definitely read the lit at wacom.com.
You can do full color, the input is different but the output is the same as a mouse, if that makes sense.
You can work in monster formats. I did a banner for a soccer goal @ 70DPI last month, that's 28' wide I think, 30,000x8000 pixels or something like that. Hyooge.
My workflow is usually pencil/paper (B is best compromise for scanning without smudging), scan, clean up smudges in photoshop, adjust contrast. Then put this on a layer set to multiply and add color on layers underneath. Then paint in detail on top of everything. If I needed vector, or just clean lines for a more cartoon look, I might use pen/ink rather than pencil, and do a live trace in illustrator.
One thing I really love is the ability to second guess your color choices after you're done. And the clean-up time is nice
ENjoy! 9x12 intuos3 is a good choice IMO.
Posted by Sonny Franks (Member # 588) on :
Mark, I have the small one and it's great for working in Photoshop. If you like, I'll drop it off next time I'm up your way and you can give it a trial run......
Posted by Mark Tucker (Member # 6461) on :
Sonny, I 'preciate it, brother, but I'll have one ordered within the next week or so, one way or another. Ongoing feedback in here and my own research tells me that I'm gonna enjoy the HELLO out of one of these things, and when I become a nationally syndicated sports cartoonist, y'all cay say "Yeah, we knew him when!" But drop in anyways when you're in this neck of the woods, please, and by all means!
Lee, you're way ahead of this hi-tech redneck with what you're doing. Nice work! But I'm gonna catch up, brother! Thanks, and a 9 x 12 or a 12 x 12 it shall be!
Love these boards! Posted by Steve Racz (Member # 4376) on :
Mark,
I have the 6x8 and i have the active area mapped to an even smaller area.
Two minor inconveniences with the tablet: - there is not a scroll wheel so scrolling is a little more inconvenient - recently at Photoshop World i talked to the Wacom people and for the time being this is a ttwii (that's the way it is)
The tablet does come with a mouse so you can use the mouse also, but i have trained myself to rely on the pen because i didn't like switching back and forth between the devices.
- you will wear through your pad from scrolling if you use the pen for surfing the net, but you can buy a new pad fairly cheaply
Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
Steve, do you have an intuos3? The mouse has a scroll wheel. I also have it set up to press down the scroll wheel for scroll lock to scroll very large documents quickly. There should also be 2 scroll pads on each side of the drawing surface that you can customize.
Posted by Steve Racz (Member # 4376) on :
Hi Lee,
Yes, i have the intuos 3, and yes, you are correct that my mouse has a scroll wheel.
What i was wishing for was some way to scroll using the pen. I know the airbrush pen has a wheel but it can't be configured to scroll - i have confirmed this with Wacom over the phone and in person.
And yes i do have the 2 scroll pads you mentioned. I have tried using them for scrolling but i have my tablet off to the right of my keyboard and it isn't really that convenient. Boy do i sound like a complainer... Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
Yeah, I have the airbrush, I was dissapointed with it.
You can set up the top half of the side switch as a middle click (scroll lock). It's not a scroll wheel, but after you're used to it scrolling web pages is fast.
Funny how it's so customizable but you still can't customize it the way you want.
Posted by Mark Tucker (Member # 6461) on :
I'm looking at one on eBay that comes with a standard pen and an airbrush pen as well. What's wrong with the airbrush pen, Lee?
Posted by Lee Kembel (Member # 7577) on :
I might be prejudiced because I was familiar with airbrushes before I tried the tool. I just found it cludgy and awkward, not like an airbrush at all. With an airbrush you control line weight with distance from substrate, with the wacom though you need the tool on the tablet, so you control line weight either with pressure or by using the scroll wheel, which has a limited movement so it emulates an airbrush trigger. I found the best setup to be the scroll wheel controlling opacity and pen pressure controlling brush size, but my real gripe is that you can't rest your hand on the tablet comfortably like the pen. With a real airbrush of course you don't want to, mostly, but because you don't vary the distance of the tool from the tablet... it's just not the same. You might find it different, but I rarely use it.
The 6D art pen is fun, but has no buttons at all, which is bad. It lets you rotate the tool to rotate flat shaped brushes in photoshop/illustrator. Fun, but just doesn't the nice feel of a brush or calligraphy nib.
Another regular pen is nice because you can have different settings for each. For instance, I have another that's mapped to a second monitor, where I keep my pallettes, allowing me to map my drawing pen full screen to the main monitor.
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