A long time customer came across some old gold leaf glass pieces, stored away in a vault. I was contacted as they are wanting to possibly restore them and they wanted my opinion on that and the possible history of the pieces. I met with them and I suggested we should take one apart. I thought... "Okay these panels kinda crude and are maybe from the 40's or 50's or some thing, maybe there is a clue inside". Oddly, the backer was a solid piece of rough sawn wood. Image our surprise when I saw the date on the newspapers use to back up the glass. Check out this slide show... http://s87.photobucket.com/albums/k142/signdog/EPL/?action=view¤t=1162695192.pbw Lots of clues back there let me tell you... I was allowed to take the piece that had the most damage and bring it back to my shop...Naturally I handled it with gloves and great care. It's been a lot of years since I've done any glass gilding, but I was so pumped at what I saw!!! No, it's not a great example of lettering skill or creative techniques, but the age of it definitely warrants preservation. Two of the 3 panels are in darn good shape, and the gold it almost perfect in all of them. On the one panel I have, the background is quite "flaky" in spots. It has a bit of a deep charcoal color viewed from the front. From the back side it has a reddish hue. I'd like to solicit any thoughts you may have on what should be done next. A little more information. The newspapers used as backing were from different dates, but all from the same week. The newspaper is a Winnipeg, Manitioba paper, The job was done for the Edmonton, Alberta public library. As a young man back in the late 60's, I was blown away by the quality of the gold work done in Winnipeg. I image Winnipeg was a hub for gold leaf work for some time, hence the fact that an Edmonton institution commissioned the work out of province. I'd welcome your comments and advice.
[ November 04, 2006, 10:36 PM: Message edited by: Duncan Wilkie ]
Posted by Anne McDonald (Member # 6842) on :
Wow, I can see why preseving these would be important. John Jordan would be one of the people I would suggest you contact about these, he's a wealth of secrets and knowledge. I look forward to hearing how you get on with these. I am an amateur, just starting out gilder and I hope perhaps that one day I can help out with these tricky questions!!
Posted by Ian Stewart-Koster (Member # 3500) on :
Duncan, I'm no expert at those specifically, but back in the 80s, I restored two old antique motorbike racing oil glass signs- they were gilded, silvered & bronze-powdered, plus painted. Most of it (colour) would flake off if you just touched it. The hardest part was deciding the approach & psyching oneself up to start. After that it was straightforward, and nothing difficult at all- some bits I left alone, others I removed (scraped off) & redid, after making a good tracing.
They later went to a private museum & were really appreciated.
I've restored a heap of horse drawn vehicles, some privately owned, & some for museums- the consideration there is whether you "RESTORE" them to a former glory, or whether you "CONSERVE" them as is, with touch ups to fix them up to be in the current state with fewer blemishes, but also using processes that are reversible & removable, rather than permanent. (I think 'preserve' is a more appropriate word, but 'conserve' is what they say...)
Posted by Wayne Osborne (Member # 4569) on :
Wow those are interesting- Especially the newspapers.- When i frame up any glass Ive done like that I always include an envelope of information about the piece or some pics of the meet or something, for future generations to find.
Give Dave Smith a shout.. chapman_and_smith@btinternet.com
He'd love to see those-
Posted by Pat Welter (Member # 785) on :
Man Duncan those are special...Looks like a water gild on those letters...I suspect they would have backed up the gild with what they would have had at the time maybe japan black, then painted the background with the paint of the time...The redish hue you mention and what I can see in the pics looks like they may have backed the whole job up with a varnish of the time... If they are interested in saving them as they are( and they may be more valuable money wise in thier present state) you could always suggest to them about making a copy that they could display, as restoring with original paints etc. would be impossible as they are over 200 years old. Just an idea. Really great to see, thank Duncan.
Posted by John Lennig (Member # 2455) on :
Duncan, those are not SHY SERIFS... beautiful work, look forward to any history you discover...
DO NOT DROP!!
john
Posted by Dusty Campbell (Member # 4601) on :
Pat's age estimate has me wondering. Is that 1916 or 1816? The pic is a little hard to see. I thought it was 1916.
Posted by Mark Sheflo (Member # 3608) on :
From what I've seen in the past and what know from family experience.....don't do a thing to those panels! As they are they are historical artifacts that belong in a museum, or at least a museum case at the library.
I'll agree with Pat on this one, offer to make then copies for display and preserve the history of the current pieces as is. If they pressure you to restore them, get in touch with your local historical society for more information.
Mark
Posted by Rene Giroux (Member # 4980) on :
I would contact two Canadian letterheads and talk to them about it, I'm sure you either know them or at least heard about them...
Pete Payne at Canadian Signcrafters : 1-800-663-9753.
Doug Bernhardt : 613-836-7871
Both should have good advise on how to handle these pieces, after all, they were around when that newspaper was printed... Posted by Ken Henry (Member # 598) on :
Those very newspapers that are providing the clues as to the age of these pieces, may very well have been the most significant contributor toward their deterioration. Newsprint is notoriously acidic, and their presence as a backing material may have influenced the deterioration of the back-up paint, over time.
Museum quality paper is non acidic for archival purposes, and if/when a restoration is made, or as others have suggested, replicas made for display, please consider using a non-acid type of paper as backing. As others have suggested, Doug Bernhardt or Pete Payne would be the best people to contact regarding the restoration of these pieces.
Posted by Duncan Wilkie (Member # 132) on :
Great input folks, thanks. I'm on my way to the shop right away. I'm going to inspect it more carefully. I will post a few pics of some of the newspaper articles for your interest too. The paper was 1916, during WWI. The frame is in very poor shape, so they want that re-finished as well. That will be interesting too as it is quite crudely made.
Posted by Duncan Wilkie (Member # 132) on :
The newspaper backer contained this in the classifieds... ...I wonder if they made these signs. Time to check the Manitoba Provincial Archives. It's interesting to note that very few businesses had telephones in 1916.
Posted by Bill Lynch (Member # 3815) on :
I wouldn't do anything, any work you did would probably diminish their historical (and monetary)value.At least consult with the historical society first. Proabably the best thing to do is to reassemble them using conservation backing, with maybe a light cleaning first. Also I think that it is a beautiful example of lettering.
Posted by Pat Welter (Member # 785) on :
Gosh Duncan this is just wonderful...what a great look into the past...A year ago or so I had to take down a sign on the old railroad station in town that had been moved from its original location & then turned into a resturant. I was to put up a new sign in its place. The removal proved interseting as CN had stoccoed the building in recent years... but the most ineresting part was when I pulled off the old sign Ruth and I were hit by the smell of the old coal engines which had been inbedded behind the sign...It was as if we were transported in time back to the time of coal and steam powered engines. We stopped working and just stood there drinking in the smell of history.
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