I visited Apple's website (again) last night (contemplating a new system and without a doubt will switch to Mac if I do buy one) and I noticed something a little different.
They've increased the processor speeds in all their systems across the board (except the Mini) but kept pricing the same.
The 1.6GHz iMac G5 is now 1.8 for the same price and the 1.8/20" LCD model is now 2.0 GHz, etc.
Just thought anyone that's been looking at Apples recently might appreciate the heads up.
Posted by Russ McMullin (Member # 5617) on :
I've been wondering what the real differences are in capabilities between Macs and PCs these days. It seems that they run very similar programs and operate with very similar hardware.
I have a Mac and a PC, and I honestly can't tell the difference between their capabilities. They both run Illustrator and Photoshop with ease.
I just read what I wrote above. I guess it sounds pro-PC. It isn't intended to be that. I like either platform. I just wanted to see if others felt the same way - that PCs and Macs are very similar these days. Mike, what is your reason for wanting to get a Mac?
[ May 04, 2005, 02:29 PM: Message edited by: Russ McMullin ]
Posted by Bill Modzel (Member # 22) on :
Russ, see Tiger post below....they are similar no more.
Posted by Dale Manor (Member # 4858) on :
I just spoke with a student today who has to turn in her Mac laptop here at the University in trade for a PC.
The reason for this is that she is an Interior Design student and they need to run AutoCAD which isn't available on the MAC...unless you run a Windows emulator which is a bit slow they tell me.
Anyhooo, she was NOT looking forward to going over to Windows after being used to Mac OS 10.....it's just not the same!
Apple's iLife suite of software is great and I don't know what I would do without it.
Posted by Bill Modzel (Member # 22) on :
That's just a dog gone shame isn't it? There are universities and even the Austrailian Dept of Defense running Mac OS X super computer clusters and they wont let her try Autocad on VPC? (which, by the way, ran better before Microstuff bought it)
I know that mentality exists David, but it doesn't help me understand it. I have a 20 year history as a Mac user so I am aware of the evangelistic following. I also have 7 years working with PCs and, overall, I see few differences. I find both platforms equally comfortable.
The new Tiger search features do look inviting. I'm going to take a class at a local college soon so I'll see if I can get a student discount.
Posted by Joe McGillicuddy (Member # 4229) on :
The early Windows 3.1, etc. were poor substitutes for the more efficient GUI, Mac had refined from Xerox, but Apples graphic oriented niche market has dwindled as both platfoms adapt to each other.
I switched to PC after I was able to upgrade my software in either version, but still feel a Mac is superior for design and reliability and will have to exist for PC's sake.
Posted by Stephen Deveau (Member # 1305) on :
"Here is One", for you!
Going to a college in Halifax, where all the Instructors say they work at home (Graphics) on (Mac systems.) But at the College, we are working PC....
Ask them the question, Why? And the answer was not to worry as they are all the same anyway...... But local in-house companies use Macs only.....
So you tell me!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Jim Upchurch (Member # 209) on :
OK, PCs are cheaper. Too bad apple has such a lock on the hardware, I think it has hurt their sales potential. Things were looking good for the consumer when the Mac clones were available. Maybe I'd get my work done .03 seconds sooner with a Mac but I make up for it when I save money on the hardware.
Posted by Mike Pipes (Member # 1573) on :
Russ,
I've used several different operating systems over the years including OS/2 Warp, UNIX, VMS, a little MacOS and of course, Windows.
All of them except Windows were built from the ground up for solid, stable, reliable commercial use and provided it when they first hit the market.
Windows on the other hand, a new release is unleashed every couple of years with "fixes" and "improvements" that should have been included in the FIRST release ever, and have been included in those other operating systems. It's taken Windows what, 10 years of development to *almost* achieve the stability and feature set of the rest of the field. Apple has had 10 years to improve on something that kicked butt in the first place, so I can't even imagine what they have now.
interior designers using AutoCAD? what will they think of next? Sounds like a waste of time to me, AutoCAD is as far from intuitive as you can get and takes a loooooooot of time to become even slightly proficcient at it. That's actually another reason for my switch - now that I'm not contracting engineering anymore I don't have to maintain compatibility with AutoCAD so I can go Mac!
For what it's worth though, the year I used Macs at college AutoCAD was slick to use on those machines but half the time I did the class projects at home then taught myself how to use Illustrator at school.
The Mac OSX interface and all the Tiger features are actually 10 years old - IBM had it all first in their OS/2 WARP operating system. Interestingly enough, IBM and Apple have been known to collaborate.
Posted by Joe McGillicuddy (Member # 4229) on :
It was an electrical engineer in my area that was the first I saw using a Mac interfaced with a Gerber 4B back in 1990, and who specialized in Architectural Signage, that showed me what influence the computer was having on the sign industry.
His main advantage was his computer skills learned in engineering and was able to "burn" his own interchangable font chips to use w/his 4B., any brush related work (awnings, goldleaf windows, etc.) in his projects was farmed to people like myself.
In 1990 he sold his shop and contracts to go back to engineering , I bought his Gerber w/interface, took on similar "high end" projects and paid over $5000.00 for a "barebones" Mac.
It was Steve Job's invitation from Xerox labs to look at their "GUI" computer that the MacOS was based on and Windows ended up embracing the concept, developed by Xerox, refined by Apple, and "reverse engineered" by a co. that made it's fortune on business software.
Instead of going under as expected Apples doing better than ever through innovation and Xerox just "missed the boat" not seeing the PC as viable.
Posted by Dave Sherby (Member # 698) on :
A volkswagon is cheaper than a Cadillac. PC's cheaper? Every time I've compared a PC's cost to a Mac when the features are equal, and I don't just mean the size of the hard drive type features but also the quality of the components, the price difference wasn't a consideration. Many PC makers buy hardrives, busses, power supplies, etc. from the lowest bidder. Mac components are purchased because of their quality.
I too run both systems and absolutly hate the PC. I'm finding more differences, too many to list here, that drive me nuts about the PC. (A screaming, loaded Dell) Its not the hardware.. it's Windows that's the problem.
Quickly, here's just two idiotic characteristics of Windows. I use a San Disk jump drive to transfer files between the 2 computers. I can plug in the San Disk into any USB port on the Mac and it's on the desktop, available to everything. Unmounting just takes 2 clicks of the mouse.
I have 3 USB ports on the front of the Dell. You cannot plug it into the same port twice in a row. It just won't see it until you use a different port than it was in the last time. Then try to unmount it. If I have used Illustrator to save a file to the disk, Windows will not let me unmount the disk unless I quit Illustartor, along with any other program that was launched after the San Disk was plugged in. That is frustrating and a waste of time. Also, after plugging in the disk, fully mounted with it's light on, you have to try to open a file twice for the disk to show up in the menu. It never shows up the first time, but always on the second try. I'll take a Mac any day.
Posted by Mike Pipes (Member # 1573) on :
Xerox also invented Ethernet networking hardware and protocols but never followed through with it. Someone else took the reigns and now it's how virtually every computer on a network and the internet communicate with each other.
Dave's right. PC's are no cheaper than Apples when you load them with equivalent quality hardware. The entry level Mac is $500, an entry level PC is $500. A higher end consumer PC is $1200-$1800, a higher end consumer Mac (the iMac G5) is in the same price range. Professional level PC's range from $1800 on the low end up to $3,000 and more, G5 PowerMacs fall in the same price range with a single processor unit at $1700 and a Dual Processor unit starting at $1900..
So this perception that Apples cost more is totally untrue, especially when you subtract IT/Repair costs and downtime from the equation.
Posted by Jim Upchurch (Member # 209) on :
Dave, I've built my own computers for at least 12 years and yep, PCs are cheaper. I can count on one hand the amount of times I had hardware go out on me and I didn't always by the name brand item. I don't know what's wrong with your Dell, it would frustrate me too but I use flash cards in my home and work PC and never unmount anything, I just plug in whichever card I want and it always appears as a drive. You might try to update your motherboard bios or Windows.
Mike, I never found the prices to be the same, the Mac prices were close but didn't include a monitor. I upgrade components rather than buying whole new computers each time too. The other problem is that Macs don't run my sign software so it would just collect dust around here.
[ May 05, 2005, 07:38 PM: Message edited by: Jim Upchurch ]
Posted by Joe McGillicuddy (Member # 4229) on :
As I recall when Apple lost it's lawsuit on Microsoft their prices dropped and have been dropping ever since they stopped fabricating their computers and used more "off the shelf" components similar to the PC.I also remember it harder to find other Mac users to ask for software advice, but Macs "ease of use" in hardware and OS's seems to still apply.
That price to later costs saved comparison Apple also touted is something to still consider since they're more competitve w/pricing than ever.
Also I could now buy a Mac w/o the software being the expense it was before and just "cross upgrade". Time to start reading my "Macworld" more often from what I'm hearing from you guys.
Thanks for the "heads up".
Posted by Doug Fielder (Member # 803) on :
I saw a shirt last night that said, "Once you go MAC, you never go back!" Ain't that the truth. Besides, undo and group key strokes are a lot shorter on the mac. Having my degree in Graphic Design, that is the industry standard. PC's are like Chevys, cheap and plentifull, everyone can have one and MACs are like Mercedes', cost more, last longer and with less problems.
Posted by Russ McMullin (Member # 5617) on :
undo and ungroup keystrokes are shorter? Which program?
Adobe Illustrator: undo for the Mac: command-z undo for the PC: control-z
ungroup for the Mac: command-shift-g ungroup for the PC: control-shift-g
Posted by Mike Pipes (Member # 1573) on :
I'll let everyone know how my switch goes. Posted by Mike Pipes (Member # 1573) on :
I found a website with some price comparisons between Mac and PC computers, it's a must read for anyone that thinks PC's are cheaper.
Interestingly enough, this data comes from, of all places, a Linux website.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
I have a 20 year history as a Mac user so I am aware of the evangelistic following. I also have 7 years working with PCs and, overall, I see few differences. I find both platforms equally comfortable.![[Bash]](graemlins/bash.gif)