I have been posting recently about using 1shot lettering enamels and brush care, etc., for a "first time paint job" on a sign.
I've almost finished the sign with no problems and it looks pretty good (for my standards anyway). The last step is outlining the main copy in black. I figured that would be the easiest part, HOWEVER, the 1shot lettering black seems to be much more liquid than all of the other colors I've used. I'm using the lettering black, and not the shading black. I could even tell it was a little more watery when I started stirring it up. There wasn't much settlement at the bottom. And when I started painting, it was like using watercolors compared to the other 1shot colors.
Is this normal for the black, or is something wrong with this particular batch?
Thanks for your help with this and all of the other quirks I've had with this subject.
Randy
Posted by Curt Stenz (Member # 82) on :
I would say that your paint is normal. Just make sure you stir it each time before you use it. If I'm not mistaken, the black pigment is merely lamp black, or basically black carbon powder, ground very fine. This is much lighter in weight than other pigments. It doesn't take a lot for good coverage.
A can of black paint actually weighs less than most other colors. Next time you have several cans (same size) of different colors, you can feel very easily the weight difference. Chrome yellow is a real heavy-weight.
1-shot makes a great product and I have never had a bad product from them.
Posted by Alan Johnson (Member # 2513) on :
I have been using 1-shot for over 40 years,I'm sorry to have to say this but it isn't what it use to be. The black is watery, it doesn't cover, it gets a modeled look when you air brush it, it takes forever to dry, I had 2 jobs that were totally ruined and redone because of the **##!! black, and the orange,maroon,brillant blue are also*!!#*! too! I just had dinner with a well known letterhead tonight and he is switching to Ronans. I am using Cromatic Black with fair results. I am searching out "old" dated 1-shot that hasn't been " improved" for myself to get me thru. You can call 1-shot with the batch # but don't expect to much,I've given up trying to get them to wake up!!!! Oh 1-shot,YOUR FIRED!!! Posted by Kissymatina (Member # 2028) on :
I've had coverage problems with the black too.
What ya do is get cans with dents in them (like most of mine seems to show up like).... they'll never re-seal properly & the black thickens nicely. Posted by Danny Busselle (Member # 3746) on :
Think add a LITTLE NAZ DAR silk screen INK and that what I Running since 1shot gad to change. just about a teaspoon to 1 pint...that is all kid until next time when the Phatom returns.... Posted by Joey Madden (Member # 1192) on :
So if its watery then I guess you're not reducing it, so what are ya using to make it flow when the brush gets sticky or does it not get sticky?
Reply here and tell me exactly what and how you are using these paints.
Posted by PKing (Member # 337) on :
Any time I have problems of coverage with One Shot Lettering Enamels as you have mentioned.
Such as Medium Brown,Brilliant Blue,and Maroon.
I will add into paint(more punch)corresponding colors.ie..Bright Red,Imitation Gold=BROWN Reflex Blue=BRILLIANT Proper Purple=MAROON Dark Brown=BLACK
Remember:just a FEW DROPS will do
hope this helps
[ June 15, 2004, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: PKing ]
Posted by Steve Racz (Member # 4376) on :
The black is definitely more watery.
It sinks into sign foam like the foam wasn't even primed. I need 3 coats to make it look right.
Didn't used to be that way.
Thanks, Steve
Posted by Murray MacDonald (Member # 3558) on :
I have found the lettering black to be thinner when the can is freshly opened, so I use it direct from the can without reducing. As it gets older, I use reducer accordingly. let's face it, ever since THEY decided that too many children would be eating signs and thus removed all the lead, things ain't been the same. learn to lve with it, it ain't gonna get better.
MUR
Posted by Mike Languein (Member # 319) on :
Exactly, exactly, eh? OK, here goes - My dear Professor Madden, on an 18”x24” baked aluminum sign blank I am using a trimmed 1984 Artsign # 6 Imperial quill , 7/8” out, in 2 oz. of #199-L One Shot Lettering Black in a 3 oz. Dixie cup, painting (right handed) a 2 1/2" 'sign painters' gothic' letter, medium weight, says "No Parking", palletted on a 4" x 6" Crescent 14 ply cold press sho card pallette. 1962 Vintage Bortzoil enamel oil thinner by. Using a Mahl Stick, and sitting on a milk crate, endo, my Killer Kart beside me, 24" away to my right (North), sun behind and to my left, customer not watching - and STILL - the stuff is watery. Wtf can I do? Hurry, please - it's gettin' STICKY, and the customer says it’s a “Rush” job.
BTW, Kissy - if I get undented cans can I just pound in the sides a little, myself? I don’t imagine leaving the lids off would be Kosher...
Posted by Bob Rochon (Member # 30) on :
Man this is odd, just today I was saying how nice black flows, covers well and doesnt need any reducers or flow enhancers at all, Ya even have to make sure there is no thinner left in the heal or it does not cover.
I guess I'm stupid.
Posted by Randy W. Robarge (Member # 2022) on :
I'm using it straight from the can, nothing added. I'm new at this whole paint thing, so I didn't add anything to my troubles, so to speak.
All of the other colors went on great, I had to touch up a few spots, but that could have been me.
The sign is HDU. And, like the earlier post, it seemed to soak into the sign like it was paper. I can see me having to do a few coats of this outline.
At least I feel better that it wasn't my imagination.
Posted by Jillbeans (Member # 1912) on :
Black is my favorite 1-Shot paint. It flows well straight from the can and always covers thoroughly for me. I never alter it. In 20 years of using it, I did notice that the pint can I opened today had a different odor. But it applied beautifully for me. Love...Jill (I rarely paint on HDU tho)
Posted by Alan Johnson (Member # 2513) on :
Jill just wait a few months and tell me how much you like it when it turns flat! Just get some chromatic black and be done with it.sorry I've been 1-shots biggest fans but IT"S NOT THE SAME!
Posted by Joey Madden (Member # 1192) on :
Alan, always expect, the unexpected
I have to add this, I never carry black in my kit, I don't even buy it.
[ June 16, 2004, 01:24 AM: Message edited by: Joey Madden ]
Posted by Sheila Ferrell (Member # 3741) on :
. . . .ALL gloss paints go flat within a year or two, mabey 3. NOT just Oneshot . . . .Mobile or Sherwin Williams house paints, Devoe's bar-ox industrial enamels... They chalk.
. . . Even auto paint will go flat without hardners eventually.
Clear it if it bugs ya.
Though it goes flat, I seldom see Oneshot "chalk" . . . background chalk runs onto it usually.
Since the changes in the paint production, I HAVE seen some differences such as flat spots after the paint is dry and longer drying times, when aggrevated by cold or dampness.
While I think black may be a little thinner . . .("watery" is a poor-choice as a word for thin oil-base paint...) I don't really have a problem with it due to the heat.....I just leave the can open an' let it skin. The 95+ temp. will soon have me reducin' it . . . Posted by Ron Percell (Member # 399) on :
I suggest making sure you havent been using a poor/cheap mineral spirits that has a little bit more water in it than were used to. also check the label to make sure it's not a UV activated reducer.
I've switched to using one shots brand of reducers or pure turpentine. One Shots thinners allow for varied temps and dry times. The brush cleaner & conditioner also works great, if you haven't tried it before
As for drying time with the use of an air brush, the reducers and or the hardener can assist you with that. At times when were out hardener in the past I've substituted Frog Juice to assist in drying time.
Good Luck
Posted by Kevin Ledbetter (Member # 253) on :
I like to post this message on behalf of Jack Cuadra - General Manager of 1 SHOT/ Chromatic. ********************************************** We understand some concerns were expressed last week which involved several One Shot products.
Please be reassured that we resist as much as possible to change formulas. Formula changes must be warranted before a decision is made to reformulate. Through the years, formula changes can largely be attributed to regulatory issues. While reformulating to lead free, we tried very hard to retain the physical properties that defined One Shot. Slight differences may still exist since these products are now lead free. It is important to use lead free products. Yes there are slight differences, some perceived more than others. We are however confident that the quality of the products produced and used has not changed. It is the single most important area of our business. We were pleased to see that many of the artists who voiced their opinions expressed their satisfaction with the 1 Shot products they used.
We know we can’t please everyone all the time, and on occasion we can make mistakes. We are human too. So, please feel free to call us anytime you need assistance. You can contact us directly by telephone (219.949.1684), fax (219.949.1612), website (www.1shot.com), pull up out front (we’ve got plenty of free parking), send us a letter, you name it. When you do call with a product problem, please remember to have available the product number, batch number and the supplier where the product was purchased. The batch number is located on the top of every lid. It is critical in helping us trouble shoot your concern(s). Please note you are always welcome to call, write, visit anytime, you do not have to have a complaint, concern, or question. We are here to help and thankful that you choose to use 1 Shot products.
Thank you for your continued support.
Jack Cuadra General Manager *************************************************
Posted by Joey Madden (Member # 1192) on :
Thank you for your concern. I personally don't have many of the problems associated with your products as with most persons as I accept the changes and work with them. Living with most any paint in this day and age, persons have to realize that not everything remains as it once was and that change is inevitible. As one thing changes, persons must change, both in their attitude as well as their livelihood and must learn to adapt on their own if needed. The way things were done in the past doesn't always work with your newer paint formulars and that I understand and work with. Maybe others can see that these things will work for them if they try instead of just using the same old solvents and same old things their mentors of the past have taught them.
I like your products but would like to see 152L in Chromatic used as well.
Posted by Robert Larkham (Member # 2913) on :
Here is what I do: Dark brown is real dark and it is thicker than black. I mix some dark brown with my black and use it that way. I know I'm only ending up with a really dark brown at this point but it works for me. Try it out and see.
Posted by Harris Kohen (Member # 2139) on :
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